The Cincinnati Reds made some roster moves this morning before their series finale against the Milwaukee Brewers. Hunter Greene, who left last night’s start after the 5th inning when he experienced some soreness in his right groin, was placed on the 15-day injured list. The club also signed left-handed pitcher Wade Miley to a big league contract. To clear a spot on the 40-man roster for him the Reds moved right-handed pitcher Rhett Lowder to the 60-day injured list.
Let’s start with Hunter Greene. Last night was just his third start back from a groin strain that he suffered in early May in Atlanta. The injury happened during the final few pitches of the 5th inning, though he didn’t mention it to anyone until the inning was over and he was in the dugout. After the game manager Terry Francona mentioned it during his meeting with the media and it came as a surprise to everyone. Greene then spoke to the media in the clubhouse and didn’t seem too concerned about the injury but did have an MRI this morning and it seems that whatever they saw was enough to give him some time off.
With the way the schedule works out with off days, the Reds could in theory go with a 4-man rotation for all 15 days in which Greene is on the injured list if he were to miss the minimal amount of time. But that seems unlikely at this point given that they went out and signed Wade Miley….
Miley, who had signed with Cincinnati before the season, spent the past seven weeks pitching in the minor leagues for the Reds. He was coming off of Tommy John surgery and didn’t get back on the mound until late April when he began a rehab assignment with the High-A Dayton Dragons. After three starts there he moved up to Triple-A Louisville where he made four more starts.
On his rehab and in his time in the minor leagues things did not go well for the most part. In his three starts in Dayton he gave up 10 runs on 13 hits – including four home runs – in 5.2 innings. Things went a little better in Louisville, but he was hit or miss there. In his first start he allowed three runs in 3.0 innings on six hits. The next time out he threw 5.0 shutout innings in a rain-shortened complete game. The following start he didn’t get out of the 1st inning, giving up four runs on five hits in just 0.2 innings. His final start saw him allow two runs in 5.0 innings on six hits and three walks.
Miley had an opt-out in his contract for June 1st and he was informed by the team that they didn’t have room for him in the rotation. That led the lefty to opt out to see what else was out there for him. Two days later what was out there for him was a big league deal with the Reds who suddenly had a need for a starting pitcher.
Rhett Lowder, who missed the start of the season with an elbow injury, is going to be out for a while at this point. While his elbow is doing better and allowed him to go on a rehab assignment in May, he suffered an oblique injury in one of his starts in the minor leagues and had to be shut down and he’s going to miss plenty of time with that injury.
best of luck to Miley but this is not the way to run a winning organization.
If you are going for it then give the ball to Burns. That’s what a team going for it would do.
I have always believed when you have a prospect with all-star potential, you let their development dictate their performance. Burns has performed well, but recently, Keith Law stated Burns needs to improve his changeup to hit his top-of-the-rotation ceiling.
At the same time I’d counter with this: How many 22-year-old pitchers in the history of the game didn’t need to improve at least one of their secondary offerings to be a top of the rotation caliber pitcher? I’d venture to guess that it’s an incredibly short list.
He can improve his changeup in the majors don’t you think? Not many if any pitchers are “perfect” or have reached their potential before being called up.
Richardson’s change up did seem to improve during his time in AAA.
He’s throwing it often with a lot of confidence.
Hopefully, the same improvements can accrue for Burns.
BK, Burns is as freakishly talented as EDLC. I have come to accept he is going to need to develop at the ML level and, like Elly, we are going to have to tolerate that.
Like you, I would like to see as much drag on the fishing reel as we can get with Burns, just so he can build innings and pitch counts in a more controlled setting (I also like watching him play with that AA team and Arroyo, HRod, Stewart, soon Collier).
But, he’s coming on in a big hurry. And that fastball, 99-100?
His slider is better.
The key to the argument is going for it. Do you have a better shot going for it with the healthy 22 year old future hard throwing Star or the 39-year old puss thrower who is recovering from major arm surgery? That’s the question not if Burns is a finished product. Let’s win rather than just tired water and if that means being agressive then be aggressive.
Yep MK. Krall doesn’t understand seemingly what “going for it” means. Mr. Cautious/Comfortable Krall.
Precisely the reason the Reds are running it the way they are.
Serendipity.
Miley is a tough nut. He’s been sketchy in rehab, but we’ll see what happens under the bright lights and with the adrenaline pumping.
I like the idea of having Richardson piggy-back off of Miley, with the hope of the two of them getting through 6 innings.
I prefer this to moving Lyon out of the role where he’s only just found success. He can give us two innings now. Three shouldn’t be a big stretch. He just seems so low effort (vs high effort) right now. Almost unflappable compared to 2024. There’s a reason why guys like Suter and Martinex last year can bounce around in multiple roles. So, yes, expand Lyon’s role slightly, but don’t undo it.
Wow…quite a drop off from Hunter Greene to Wade Miley.
Well the drop off is really from Hunter to the number two starter. The drop off to Miley is down from Singer, I’d say. Fast forward to 2026 and the drop off would be from Greene to Burns …
That’s one way of looking at it. In the other hand Lodolo, Abbott and Singer are still in the rotation. The only one who isn’t in the rotation is Greene and he is being replaced by Miley. I’m
Hey, I predicted this in last nights article.
I was right for once… lol. It just sounded like an easy, Reds type move considering the situation. Miley comes off as a knowledgeable guy to keep around to help the young guys anyways.
I said a couple of days ago, wait until the pitchers start going on the IL. Who’s next? It seems like there are three things in MLB that are important, throw fast, get strikeouts and hit home runs.
Most of what Krall does are “hope” projects. Is Miley really pitching better than someone else in the minors? Another question is what will they do with Miley when Greene does come back? They signed him to a major league contract and he obviously has no options left. If he pitches poorly are they going to keep him longer than they should because of that? Hampson and Miley are two players who’ve they recently signed to major league contracts who also they will likely have to cut after they’ve given them every opportunity while we’re in a pennant/post season race. I hope Miley has more in him than he’s shown so far in rehab.
They put Lowder on the 60-day IL, to open a roster spot for Miley. Lowder joins Williamson, Spiers, and Aquiar as pitchers on the 60-man. Spiers ought to be back later in the season, and maybe Lowder even later on.
I hope that the last two years’ drafts have taught the Reds never to select another pitcher from LSU. Ty Floyd in 2023 and Luke Holman in 2024, both of whom the Reds selected with their second pick, are ever-injured bombs who can pretty much already be written off, along with their collective $3 million bonuses.
Something about the hot sauce down there?
We’ll take the quarterbacks, though 🙂
Skenes was LSU
Lowder from Wake forest?
Skenes used up all the health that LSU had in its coffers. Now, if you visit an LSU pitching camp, there are buzzards circling overhead like an old TV western.
Watched Wake Forest play last weekend. Don’t think they will take a WF pitcher early this year, though LSU is possible (not1 but Too 5 rounds)
I’m happy we were still able to sign Wade. He’s been a good pitcher when healthy.
Mutually beneficial. We get a proven place holder while Greene gets the groin healthy and a bit of insurance in case another starter gets a ding. Miley gets a ML showcase for a few weeks. Who knows, maybe we get a minor leaguer out of it at the deadline.
Miley could also move to relief if we have our 5 starters all healthy.
The odds that we have an opening in either the rotation or pen are extremely high, so I don’t see a reason not to keep him around.
Have you been paying attention to his recent minor league outings? He gets shelled on a regular basis.
Nice, glad he was still available. You can never have too many crafty LH pitchers.
Chris Welsh is available if that’s the criteria and I doubt he can get minor leaguers out now, just like Wade.
OK, I’ll be the first one to say it again, “Sell the team Bob!” I don’t know what is worse:
1. That the Reds make no changes to the Conditioning and Athletic Training staff despite them completely mishandling Greene, Steer, McClain, Loyola, and CES in the last 12 months.
2. They bring back Miley? He was a solid MLB pitcher, but by all objective criteria, he’s shot. This would have been Burns on any team that wants to win. The Reds do not won’t to win. They want to save $$$ and want to make sure they have team control on Burns til 2032. The do EVERYTHING on the cheap, despite having a roster where all the core players are pre-Arbitrarion!
I think you are going to have to offer some evidence that Greene, McLain, Lodolo (Loyola?) and CES have been mishandled.
Steer, you have a slight chance of getting a pass, but that was really on Francona, Krall and Steer believing he could get in hitting shape while playing in the ML’s.
Everyone on here thinks they are a medical expert, get used to it.
If a handful of players get injured? It’s definitely the fault of the medical staff and/or athletic trainers. Not at all the fact that athletes, especially pitchers, get injured frequently. For EVERY team.
1. Steer hurt his shoulder in September. It’s such a severe injury that he still couldn’t throw in March. How many MLBers go 6 months without throwing without having surgery? And you can’t throw a baseball but your shoulder is good enough to turn on a 100 mph fastball?
2. Greene 2nd stint on the IL for groin in 6 weeks. 4 stints on IL last 1 1/3 seasons.
3. Oblique injuries: Hays, Lowder, McClain, Marte, Stephenson
4. CES breaks arm on HBP, continues to play, has to have surgery, misses season.
5. McCain – Shoulder hurt in 24, expected back in June, misses while season.
6. Lodolo – 4 stinks on IL over two years, 2 involving blisters. Also has had 2 seasons where he missed over half the season with muscle pools that never healed.
Nobody’s arguing that there aren’t a lot of injuries, but as DocMike points out, every team has lots of injuries: It seems to be the nature of the game in the 21st century. As for Steer, the way the shoulder is engaged when swinging the bat is quite different from the engagement when throwing, and unless you know exactly what the injury is and are an orthopedic surgeon, it seems unlikely that you know enough to know that surgery is indicated. It isn’t magic, and some injuries take a long time to fully heal.
Since turning pro in 2017, Greene has been on the IL five times.
That’s five occasions in eight years.
It’s also just two minor injuries in the last two years.
8/18 – 9/19 — TJ surgery
8/22 – 9/19 — 6 weeks, Shoulder strain
6/23 – 8/23 — 8 weeks, hip pain
8/24 – 9/24 — 4 weeks, elbow soreness
5/25, 6/25 — 2 weeks, groin.
TJ, shoulder, hip and elbow (again) are joint injuries, not a function of the training staff.
Further, regarding Greene, et al. Players in every organization get pulled muscles every day of the week. The Reds are not unique.
It’s also not the training staff that caused CES to get a broken bone and that the first scan missed it.
Matt McLain had shoulder surgery on March 27 and was not for one second expected back by June.
Lodolo has never pitched more than 115 innings, either in college or as a pro. He was promoted to the ML’s after 70 minor league innings, never building up innings. That’s a Lodolo issue and an organizational issue, not a training staff issue.
Steer? I gave you that one, in part. That he was given latitude to effectively work back with the Reds is not a training staff issue. It’s the Reds giving him the ok to do so.
That he opted not to have surgery last fall for impingement (that does not necessarily have good outcomes) and try to rehab via strengthening is reasonable, but took longer than expected.
That Loyola guy has been flying under the radar.
I love how you list the Reds’ injuries as if that supports your position that the Reds’ medical staff is at fault. As though every team in baseball doesn’t deal with these same exact injuries.
You know what team has been hit with more injuries than any other team this year? The Dodgers. Yep, the team with way more money, and way more resources than the Reds (and almost every other team).
If the Reds are mishandling their injuries, then that applies to every team. Perhaps they should all fire their training staffs?
Great info in your second post here DaveCT! Greene and Lodolo are good, very good in the case of Green, but they are both fragile. You can’t build around unreliability or inconsistency.
They already have control of Burns through 2031, and they have since about April 20th.
I bet Burns would be cheaper right now.
I’m not surprised that the Reds elected to stick with a 5-man rotation, as many of their pitchers will be surpassing previous highs in innings pitched if they remain healthy. Now, does Miley have anything left in the tank?
I’m thinking if signing Miley was absolutely necessary. Obviously the Reds FO/Staff don’t have confidence in Petty. The other choice of going with a 4-man rotation maybe push a bit the starters despite being in normal rest I don’t know… I guess they prefer Miley than Wilkerson despite the latter has been solid in Triple-A during the season becoming a starting depth option recently…Even they will count on the Miley’s health who is coming back from Tommy John surgery and also felt some groin issues recently….Krall is doing some kind of desperate deals in last days
I like Miley, but wonder if his rehab was cut short by his June 1 contract decision date.
A couple more AAA starts would likely have helped him, and the Reds in assessing his situation.
A key is not to expect too much, too soon.
Suter-Miley-Richardson might be good for a couple cycles through the rotation and get you to the 7th-inning.
But if Miley is on an MLB contract what does that suggest long term for the season?
Can they option him?
Without looking, Miley has the service time to decline an optional assignment even if all three of his option-eligible seasons have not been burned (long, long ago).
Bottom line this team continues to be a train wreck. Look out Pirates here we come!!! So sad but very true. We are years away and not getting any closer despite all the effort to draft and sign. Cincinnati deserves better. Just pitiful.
Meh – Miley may work out OK for a few starts, or may not. It would be a push to call up Burns now, but if they move him to the Bats and he continues to perform well, he really should be in the rotation by mid-July. They seem to be past the “service-time” excuse and barring a complete collapse they don’t fall out of the wild card race until September, so it will show how badly they “stick to the plan” if he doesn’t come up. They did well moving Lowder along last season, so there’s no excuse this time.
I hope they don’t just stick Miley into the rotation into Greene’s spot. As I mentioned in the other thread, due to off-days the Reds only need a 5th starter once during the entire time of Greene’s IL stay. No need to use a lesser starter any more than needed.
I still say to use a “bullpen” game on that one start. Maybe you let Miley start and go 3 innings, hopefully not much more than one trip through the order. Then let Richardson or Suter go another 2-3 innings.
Yes – they need to consider Miley as a very long reliever – he could maybe go 4 innings, but to expect him to go 90+ pitches and a 3rd time into the order is asking for trouble. Barlow/Miley/Richardson/Suter could get thru a game if the offense can score 5 or more runs.
1. When the players consistently get the same soft tissue injuries over a 2-3 yr period (oblques), I think it’s reasonable to question the training staff.
2. When a player goes 7 months (Steer) without being able to throwi a baseball, and the player doesn’t get a surgery or a rehab plan other than to rest it, I think you can question the training staff.
3. When you have players on IL multiple times for the same injury (Greene, Lodolo, CES, McClain last year) I think you can question the training staff.
1. You can’t just wave a magic wand and make an oblique injury go away. The only thing that really helps is time. Thus, the IL stint. Now, if you wanted to make sure the issue gets plenty of time to rest and heal, I suppose you could shut him down for the rest of the year. But that’s most likely overkill. The Reds did the right thing, give him time off, and when it feels all better, let him try it again. No one did anything wrong.
2. Steer had an injury to his shoulder that may not be able to be surgically repaired. No reason to go under the knife if it’s not going to help. And how do you know what his rehab plan was? Were you privy to Mr. Steer’s private medical information?
3. Greene has had pulled muscles. Lodolo has had blisters. CES has had back problems. I’m not sure what you mean listing McLain, he sustained a serious shoulder injury last spring that knocked him out all year. But regardless, training can’t always prevent pulled muscles. Any athlete knows this.
Greene to the IL and the Reds sign a 38yo pitcher coming back from injury who has been highly ineffective in the minors? Seriously, if Krall had any self-awareness or integrity, he’d resign and turn the job over to someone serioius.
We can’t really presume that for Krall, you know? None of us can know what’s best for he and his family. I’m less critical of Krall than you are, generally, though not absolutely. I don’t think anyone can qualify this, whatever ‘this’ is, as a character flaw.
Consider two options, either he has the financial resources to succeed or he doesn’t . If he does and continues to make bad moves , he lacks self-awareness and isn’t qualified for the job. If he doesn’t have the resources and continues in a job where he can’t succeed, he lacks integrity or he would have quit.
The question is what happens when the next starting pitcher comes up lame. I suspect Petty gets the call despite his previous poor starts.
“Well. Look who came Kralling back” – Miley’s agent (probably)
Signed him to sit around and be an emergency starter if there’s a doubleheader or something, I guess. Makes enough sense. If they do give him a regular turn you could do worse.
Huh. Francona said Miley is indeed pitching Monday. So he’s pitching next weekend too. Don’t mind me.
Tito has to be talking the “company line”. He has to know the crazy things that are going on. Probably drives home shaking his head every day.
If Miley can give them 5 innings a start, it’s all they want. Miley is here to replace Martinez ultimately, when they trade him in June. He will be the bridge until later this year when Spiers/Burns/Acuna/Petty step up or Wilkinson becomes the next Ben Lively.
Our Bullpen is already doing 3-4 innings a game, Bullpen games should be last on the list of alternatives.
Miley will be lucky to give 3 innings a start, unless the Reds want to be down by double digits going into the 4th.
Miley’s Major league career is over. Everyone except Krall knows it.
I believe I said this after his first start in Dayton.
The few of you who think this signing isn’t so bad haven’t been paying attention to his atrocious minor league appearances this year. The guy gets blown out in Single A Dayton.
Miley, Suter, Ashcraft, and Richardson can each give you 2-3 innings twice a week. That should be good enough you cover Greene’s stint on the IL. But how effective will Miley be? Amazing that Lowder, Williamson, Spiers, and Aguiar are all on the IL. All the micromanaging of these players is making them fragile, as is the role specialization and the money that spawned both.