Hunter Greene struck out nine batters and didn’t allow any runs in 6.1 innings, but Mitch Keller matched him all afternoon as the two kept the other team off of the board. The Pirates got a late home run and on a day when the two teams combined for just five hits, that was enough for a 1-0 win as Pittsburgh took two of the three games against the Cincinnati Reds and grabbed a series win.

Final R H E
Cincinnati Reds (35-39)
0 2 0
Pittsburgh Pirates (36-38)
1 3 0
W: Holderman (3-0) L: Martinez (2-5) Sv: Bednar (16)
Box Score | Game Thread

Hunter Greene hit Bryan Reynolds with a pitch in the 1st, but worked around it. In the next inning he would hit another batter, and then Yasmani Grandal came through with a 2-out double into the right field corner. Connor Joe made it to third base, but Elly De La Cruz sprinted across the field to become the cutoff man and with his arm strength being in play, the Pirates held Joe at third. Greene came through with a strikeout to end the inning and strand two runners.

While Greene was doing his part, so was Mitch Keller. The Reds didn’t pick up a hit until the 5th inning when Santiago Espinal led off with a single. The next three batters couldn’t get the ball out of the infield, though, and he was stranded at second base. Cincinnati would get another hit in the 6th, but Jonathan India was stranded at first as Keller continued to confound the Reds hitters.

Greene kept cruising until a 1-out double in the 7th inning. That led to a pitching change, with Fernando Cruz coming in to get out of the jam, leaving Greene with 6.1 innings of shutout baseball and nine strikeouts.

Nick Martinez took over in the 8th for the Reds and retired the first two batters of the inning but a change up at the top of the zone to Bryan Reynolds went 407 feet and into the Pirates dugout to put Pittsburgh up 1-0. That’s all they would need as closer David Bednar set the Reds down in order in the top of the 9th to seal the shutout win.

Key Moment of the Game

Bryan Reynolds home run in the 8th.

Notes Worth Noting

Hunter Greene lowered his ERA to 3.35 on the season. In his 15 starts he’s thrown 88.2 innings and now has 98 strikeouts with 37 walks. Today was the first game all season in which Greene did not walk a batter.

Cincinnati dropped to 35-39 on the season. That puts them in a tie for last place with the Chicago Cubs for the time being. Chicago is playing now, but their game is in the 2nd inning as of this publishing.

The game took just two hours and eight minutes.

Up Next for the Cincinnati Reds

Boston Red Sox vs Cincinnati Reds

Friday June 21st, 7:10pm ET

Kutter Crawford (3-6, 3.54 ERA) vs Andrew Abbott (5-6, 3.42 ERA)

172 Responses

  1. Mark A Verticchio

    My question is why didn’t Stephenson bat for Maile in the top of the 8th. Keller was out of the game so you can’t use that excuse. Let’s face it Bell has no clue what he is doing. He also didn’t pitch Moll until the game was lost he is without a doubt the worst manager in baseball. I don’t dislike him as a person but as a manager he sucks.

    • LDS

      Yep, you could give Bell a team with Ohtani and Soto and he’d find a reason to platoon them. But we all know that. And he’s an insider so he’ll be protected and probably promoted or at least given a raise, if not an extension. Krall isn’t anything to write home about lately either. He has failed since last summer. Too many internal promotions and too much nepotism to build a winning team and culture.

    • Klugo

      Nepotism. I’m convinced that this franchise will wallow in mediocrity, at best, until it receives new ownership. They’re cheapskates all the way through .

    • Mark

      Got hosed by the three batter rule there.
      Although Martinez needs a clean frame there.

    • DaveCT

      I think the outcome of nepotism and cheapiosity is a culture that is in opposition to team success. It’s evident in this non-stop barrage of hype, marketing and celebration by the org, broadcasters, etc of individual success and stories.

      It hides under the Jim Day guise of human interest and family friendliness, under the Sadak minutia. How many individual micro-stats do we need to be bludgeoned with?

      A culture of mediocrity clouds the absence of team success with individual success. This is the primary sign of long term team and organizational failure. You gotta celebrate something, right? So, yay, Joey Votto, elder statesman. Yay, rookies! Yay, all of Elly’s superlatives.

      • Rob

        Your comment about Sadak minutia” was spot on. Good to know I’m not the only one irritated by his meaningless statistical trivia, which he always states as if it’s absolutely earth-shattering.

        Earlier this season, I heard him say something to the effect that the Reds’ opponent currently ranked second in the league in least number of catcher’s interference calls. As if catcher’s interference occurs so often that it’s a major factor in whether or not a team wins a pennant!!

      • DaveCT

        I do not dislike Sadak. He is light years better than Thom, who once suggested Lorenzen was the best hitter on the team. I like Sadak in that he is well prepared, and i feel he is best when he talks less. The minutia, however …

        and to my point, this distracts from the coverage of the lack of team success. And, it (the use of broadcasters to promote the organization rather than 1) Call the game, 2) Report on the clubhouse and 3) Investigate the front office) is by design.

        It’s the Culture of Mediocrity

      • RedinInd

        @DaveCT and @Rob – count me in with your Sadak comments.

      • OcotilloGus

        I live in Arizona and pay for the MLB package in order to watch as many games as possible. I never have the sound on because I find Sadak so annoying. He is easily the worst announcer in the league.

      • DrDoc

        Man everytime John Sadak starts to lose his luster, lo and behold I catch a nationwide primetime game and those announcers have me praying to have my boy John. Whether we like it or not the announcers are just as much a part of the team as the players. While none of the broadcasters necessarily wows me all the time, outside of perhaps the recent Sam LeCure games, I think the Reds are more blessed than not with their broadcast and on-air personalities.

      • Jimbo44CN

        I prefer to call them nonsense stats, especially about the other team, but bludgeoned is the right word. God, just stop.

  2. Jeremiah

    Reds need at least 2 consistent new everyday hitters I think to be a playoff team. Maybe when one of the young guys come back that is one, maybe a trade, maybe Fraley gets hot, etc. But it’s going to be tough to get over .500 with the current offensive talent. Pirates not too impressive either offensively though.

    • Jimbo44CN

      My thoughts exactly. We need a couple of hitters, period

      • Longtimefan

        Krall is gunshy about signing free agents or making trades. His past history is horrible and literally none of free agent signings have panned out. Not even mediocre but totally horrible. They have spent so much money on free agents and alot of them didn’t even make it thru the first year. They need better evaluators of talent so they don’t throw so much money away. Cincinnati is a small market area. They’re never going to be able to match the Yankees, Dodgers, or any large market team financially so when they spend money and it doesn’t pan out they don’t have the money to turn around take a chance to lose even more. Look at the Ray’s. They never make trades or sign free agents and yet they seem to be competitive every year. When their players become stars they go somewhere else to make money. It’s all about being able to evaluate talent and making the right choices.

      • jmb

        Gun-shy to sign free agents? Just the opposite: Krall signed too many. Montas, Candelario, Pagan, Martinez–do they need any of them? Trades would have reaped better rewards.

    • MFG

      We really miss CES, Mclain and Marte!
      3 right handed sticks.

      • Rob

        But we have known all year about Marte and Mac being out. Not a new development. And the replacements have been Thompson, Ford! Capel, Martini, Hurtubise, Dunn, and Espinal. And the GM says he is always looking and trying to improve the team. Draw your own conclusions.

      • jon

        I agree! People whining about Bell after every loss forget those 3 plus Friedl have missed most of the year plus no vet bat that can hit with the exception of candy.

  3. Klugo

    This team is crap without Friedl. Take Candelario (and Stephenson) away, too? Fugetaboutit.

    • RedBB

      Even with him this offense is crap…

    • Jim Walker

      What position does Fugetaboutit play and is he a switch hitter or would they need a platoon partner for him??? 😉 😉

      • Melvin

        Yes. I can’t find any stats on him. 😉

    • Andrew Brewer

      How bad is the Friedl injury this time ? And without the Candy Man, who has been delivering… Espinal and India get the only two hits.
      Looks like the party is over for now, but the wild card is still not out of reach…

    • jmb

      …and Marte and McLain and a left-handed hitting catcher and two right-handed hitting corner outfielders who can also play D. There is lots of work to be done. EDLC and Steer may need to be involved in getting the players that will actually improve the team. They currently have too many strikeout kings (Benson, EDLC) and guys who really can’t field their position (India, Steer, CES, EDLC).

  4. Jedi Joey

    It was one of those days where I should chose music or podcasts over listening to the broadcast of the game. What a snoozer!

    • TR

      If there’s an answer, it’s certainly music.

    • Votto4life

      Yeah, I listen to the “Dead Ball” Podcast. It’s a great baseball history podcast although can be a bit dark at times.

  5. RedBB

    Ridiculously TERRIBLE offense. Krall sucks

  6. DW

    One gut punch after another with this offense and this manager. Three total runs in a series against the Pirates. Geesh

  7. Melvin

    Bright spot is the starting pitching the last couple of games. Even Spiers only gave up four runs in six innings after he settled down. All is not lost…..if we just get some HELP.

    • Eddiek957

      I kind of think spiers would be nice with an opener

      • DrDoc

        I wonder if the Reds might be on to something with having some nonstarter innings eaters like Spiers and Martinez. I also think Suter could fill that roll.

  8. Erik the Red

    Not sure a couple of hitters solves the 2023 Reds offense unless it is two guys that can hit .300 hit 15 homers and drive in 50 rbis over the last half of the season.

  9. TR

    Another one run loss. Two hits. Four under .500. Management does nothing to jolt the offense. Their answer seems to be wait till the offense of last year recovers from injury and things will turn around. Meanwhile, the Reds are in and out of last place. How nice it would be if management could convey a sense of urgency to win with 45% of the season in the books.

  10. Dennis Westrick

    Offense struggles? Take the “s” and the “u” from struggle and add “cks” to truly describe the current Reds offense! 2 hits! 2 lousy hits! Feel sorry for HG! Seems like he gets very little run support!

    Thankfully missed the last 2 innings due to a meeting here at work!

    Last place in the NL Central Division is looming pending the resultsof the Cubs/Giants game!

  11. VaRedsFan

    I’m flying out to Cincy Friday to try to light a fire under the boys.
    Friday – Lexus Diamond Seats – 1st time ever!
    Saturday – Section 130 behind the Reds dugout.

    Any messages that y’all want me to relay to Bell?
    I have a few of my own.

      • VaRedsFan

        Thanks Mark…Hope you can get up to DC again this year.

    • Jim Walker

      Tell him how wonderful scenic Virginia is to visit this time of year and offer to be his tour guide if he will throw in the towel and head for Virginia for several weeks.

      • VaRedsFan

        Brilliant idea Jim.
        I’ll make the sacrifice for the good of the team.

        My son is in Sprigfield…stationed at Wright Patt.
        We’ll honk at you when we drive by.

      • Jim Walker

        @VaRedsFan>>> I worked on base at WPAFB for ~15 years as a civilian contractor which means I was a W2 employee of a company that had a contract with the Air Force to supply services. In my case, it was supporting the data network backbone infrastructure.

    • Daytonnati

      The problem with the Diamond seats is that you never want to go to a game again unless that is where you are 🙂 Fantastic service and experience.

      • VaRedsFan

        Any tips?
        We’ll get there when park opens.
        Enjoy the food in the club area.
        I know there is window where you can see players going from dugout to clubhouse.
        In seat food options and drinks.
        What else?

      • Daytonnati

        Well, there is the more than 50% chance you’ll see terrible “professional” baseball, up close and personal 🙂

    • Jason Franklin

      Hope you get to see some wins while declining in luxury. (: Sounds like a good time.

  12. Pat

    Do the reds have a hitting coach? Is it possible to trade him?

  13. Mark Moore

    STINK. FISH. POT!!!!

    And that’s all I’ve got to say about that.

  14. RedsGettingBetter

    It’s depressing to hold your rival on 1 run and 3 hits but you lose the game. I don’t know if the Pirates win a game 1-0 against the Reds every year, still remember when Greene no-hit them two years ago although he lost.
    Have been very frustrating this offense consistently struggling added to the fact of having always two or three regular guys injured… I’m tired of that… Hopefully this weekend Candelario and Martini could play against the Red Sox and Abbott, Montas and Spiers show their best stuff…By the way, I would schedule Lodolo and Greene for Sunday and Monday games pushing back Spiers…

  15. GreatRedLegsFan

    That’s a shame the Reds have a very competitive pitching staff this year. However, loosing McClain, Marte, Friedl and CES (considering his production from last year) has proved to be just too much to overcome. There’re still a few good bats left in EDLC, Stephenson, Steer and JC but it won’t make the cut. So, let’s hope the return of Marte and maybe a trade or two down the way could spark the offense.

  16. Gpod

    Let’s compare the Reds franchise with the KC Royals….kind of similar size comparison….they have to rebuild at times but at least they accomplish something….KC is currently 8 games over 500 (a dream for the reds) and of course they have also won a World Series in the last recent memory…unlike the current constant tailspin the reds have been it since 1990

    • Daytonnati

      They were also willing to part with the three most promising left-handers in their system in exchange for half a season of Johnny Cueto. All three burned out here, and the Royals have a ring.

    • jmb

      2015, wasn’t it? But they went to the Series 2 years in a row, winning the 2nd go. They had quite a team, and the Reds contributed by trading Cueto to them.

  17. redfanorbust

    Not sure what some of us are expecting with our complaining but at the same time I get it. With all our injuries I very much doubt any team with similar amount of injuries and time on the IL would fair much better. We are all frustrated since it has been forever since Reds have been relevant and now that we get our hopes up and rotten luck rears its ugly head and is heaped upon us. I am pretty sure not much is going to change till we get the lion’s share of our key players back. Krall IMO is not going to gut the minors for any trade fixes even if there turns out to be any real solid help out there that would really move the preverbal needle.

    • Mark A Verticchio

      If what you say is true, and I believe it is, this season is over, despite having 3 of the top young pitchers in all of baseball. Marte will soon come back, Freidl will hopefully get well, until hurt again, and Candy says he will be fine soon. However we must all face the fact that Mclain will not play this year and neither will CES. In my mind Mclain was the best the best all around player and the straw that stirred the drink. CES, if healthy, was the missing big bobber. It might be possible to make the playoffs without those 2 if Krall would make the right pick up, he won’t, so here we stand hoping for 2025. Finally, sadly, many devout Reds fans are getting old and can’t continue to always wait until next year. 1990 seems like forever ago.

  18. Grover

    The game played out exactly how you’d expect it to, 2 excellent starters but with the Reds handicapped by devastating injuries to their starting 8. Sooner or later the Pirates would score while you are not sure the Reds would have score if it went 20.

  19. Gpod

    That’s why when you get a chance….go for it….like last year ….no real moves to help the team get over the hump…and of course….a couple of seasons ago when we were in position to do something special, had the weakest schedule going down the stretch & the reds imploded and never made the playoffs under the direction of our great leader Mr. Bell ….i would have ended the Bell era after that season because there was no excuse for what happened at the end of that season

  20. Indy Red Man

    Zzzzzzz. New dead ball era has arrived and we don’t know how to slap it and use our speed.

    Couple of things tells me the ball is dead though. Espinal did a pose and hit it as hard as he can yesterday and it barely eked over the fence. Their guy same thing.
    Wisdom the other day crushed one down the line and posed. They caught it on the track. I’ve seen it alot.

    You could combine Machado, Fraley, Wisdom, and a couple of other guys and not even combine for 20

  21. Jim Delaney

    Bryan Reynolds bat is smoking hot. He is a career 345 hitter in month of June. Why in the world was Martinez given the go ahead to pitch to him in 8th inning.. make anyone else in there lineup beat you… Again shows the Manager sleeping at the switch and the analytics team not performing either… Some heads should be rolling after this one…

    • WCRon

      Was wondering why we did not just give him an intentional pass. Sad to see us blow such a good effort by Greene. He is getting better each game. But he is not very lucky

    • still a red

      Two outs, Martinez normally lights out, hung a change up…it happens. Can’t fault Bell for that one.

  22. Doc

    Doug,

    When you wonder why subscriptions are flat, perhaps you should review the content of comments. It is just not enjoyable to read the same negative gripes over and over and over again from the same people. It is almost one big gripe session day after day.

      • JohnnySofa

        Is this better:
        Awesome! Reds rolled two singles today! Only a half game out of last place! Got a guy leading the charge with a .251 average! Hey, we won a playoff series 30 years ago! And our manager has a contract that will keep him around for years!
        Some of us live in the real world, not under a shower of pixie dust. People who keep propping up the organization only proliferate the frustration.

    • Doug Gray

      There’s zero subscriptions offered for Redleg Nation.

    • citizen54

      “Same negative gripes over and over and over again from the same people. ”

      Despite all the injuries, the Reds are only 1.5 games out of a wild card spot. Yet this place is still about as fun as a morgue.

      • Doug Gray

        TBF – nearly everyone is “in the race” because half of the league gets into the playoffs. Of course, that’s how the owners want it to be because it means they don’t have to try as hard, which means they don’t have to compete as much for players, which means they can spend less money and still say “we made the playoffs”, “we were competitive”, etc. YMMV but I HATE IT

      • DW

        Yeah, well put Doug. Great point on the owners, the expanded playoffs, and spending.

      • citizen54

        Don’t get me wrong. People need a place to vent and you do a good job allowing comments. It’s just not fun to see the same comments over and over again blasting Krall and Bell for every mistake or bad thing that happens. Pitchers give up home runs. Teams go on losing streaks. Happens to every team.

        On a brighter note, Lodolo and Greene look like they can be 1A and 1B. Abbott looks like he could at least be a solid #4. You have Lowder who should at least be at #3 so the Reds should have a good cost controlled rotation for the next 3-4 years. If there is a FA bat out there that’s worth it then they Reds will be able spend.

      • Jeremiah

        Good point Doug, it is interesting the new format. I think it is kind of cheapening the importance of the regular season, but it’s keeping more fan interest for teams that are right around .500 or a few games below that they are still in it to bout the last 5-6 game of the season.

      • BK

        OTOH, we’re seeing less tanking with the expanded playoff format and better attendance. These along with shorter games have fan interest up.

        Perhaps the fact that a few teams can blow the other teams out of the water for truly difference making free agents because they have triple the revenues of some teams has more influence one the spending of baseball owners. Why don’t other leagues have cheap owners to the same extent as MLB?

      • Jim Walker

        @BK>> Because other sports have hard salary caps and huge national TV deals at the league level that share the TV revenue more equitably.

        But to your main point about cheap owners, during the lockout that interrupted MLB a couple of years ago, many media folks wrote/ spoke that many, perhaps even most of the owners, shared more common ground with the MLBPA than with a hardcore group of 5-7 owners including of course Castellini.

        If memory serves, Manfred needed 23 votes and had that, barely, for the deal he really wanted but caved to the outliers on several points because he wanted even more a unanimous agreement on the MLB side of the deal.

      • BK

        @Jim, there’s a lot of local revenue in the NBA and no they really don’t have a hard cap–teams can bust cap to retain players they have under contract. What the other leagues have is a guarantee of the percent revenue that is shared with the players. This aligns both party’s (players and owners) goals with growing revenues.

        Back to the NBA and it’s slate of 82 games–not a small number of games under any definition. Their CBA has worked to build parity among franchises which has led to “national” partners offering two-and-one-half more for their “national rights.” By improving the game, the national TV package has become a lot more valuable.

        Small and mid-market teams are behaving exactly as an economist would expect given the disparity among teams. Castellini has not run the Reds well at all, but he was right to push back on higher CBT levels in the CBA–they were only exacerbating the problem.

    • DW

      What does the content of comments have to do with subscribers? The comments section doesn’t come with the subscription. And you can read Doug’s articles without having to read the comments. Either you choose to support Doug’s work or you don’t. I can’t imagine anyone not subscribing because the comments section is too negative. If so, what a poor reason, and how unfair to Doug.

    • Melvin

      I’m generally a person that likes to be positive and encourage people. I’m also not a person that lives in pretend never never land. That doesn’t do anyone any good being that way. While striving to have the proper balance I fully admit I fall short on several occasions. However I will say that anyone who comes on here even on a semi regular basis and is not willing to subscribe and pay the measly $4 per month ought to be ashamed of themselves. 🙂

    • Jedi Joey

      People complaining about people complaining. Classic internet!

    • Brian

      Doc, what is extremely obnoxious and arrogant is when a fan tries to tell another fan what kind of fan they must be. Some are optimistic, some pessimistic and some of us are realist. Have the Reds won a playoff series in the last 34 freakin years? I’m not sure but they may even have the worst record in baseball during that time. Some fans get frustrated with incompetence. Some fans will carry water for whatever the Reds do. Be the type of fan you wanna be and give others the respect to choose what type of fan they wanna be.

      • Doug Gray

        There’s a difference between being a pessimistic fan and logging on 35 times during a 3-hour game to say David Bell and Nick Krall suck 115 times a year.

      • Brian

        Doug, Doc said “people”. If you have one nut case, why not ban him? I personally post positive and negative comments. When your team loses year after year, for decades…. It makes sense that there will be more negative comments than positive. Unless someone doesn’t appreciate honest dialogue and some tough truths then it should be expected and acceptable outside of an obsessed individual that you seem to be referencing.

      • Doug Gray

        Because it’s not just one person that does it. There’s probably 5-10 of these people.

    • Jonathan

      Agreed…the site has become very negative.

  23. GafMan

    Why they we are not hitting and know they are very limited offensively with the lineup, don’t they try to change things up and lay down a bunt once-in- while. The best candidate would bebElly. I know DeLa Cruz would say I’m not payed to bunt, but I think he’s paid to help win games. He probably never practices bunting but he should be made to a little bit. He will usually beat it out even if it isn’t a good bunt. Get him on and let him steal 2nd and even possibly 3rd so you can score on a fly or ground.out. In a game like this you need to try something.

  24. Reddawg2012

    I will never let myself get excited about this team during the off-season again.

    • TR

      We’re all Reds fans, so excitement comes and goes. And we’ve all got other interests to fill the day.

  25. Old-school

    Really good to see Greene and Lodolo step up into top of the rotation starting pitchers. Give Pirates credit. Skenes is already an ace and Keller is solid 2/3 with Jones looking like a solid top 3 for awhile.

    Abbott has been a good mid rotation guy but after that, Williamson 2024 is a loss, Ashcraft is in AAA purgatory, Phillips has gone backwards and Petty is up and down like a yo-yo. Other than Rowder, who looks like the next really good Reds pitcher?

    Hitting is a cluster. Candy has been a savior to this lineup but going forward, who is a future stud? McLain looks good, Marte has potential but CES 2024 season is a dud. He was my breakout guy. All 3 arent playing and arent going to be Barry Larkin or Pete Alonso or Manny Machado this year. No one in AAA or AA is poised to do anything anytime soon.

    I dont see any internal solutions to this woeful hitting and guys like India, Fraley and Benson who folks assumed would be better are all in the sub .700 struggle bus. The number of AAAA guys getting at bats in the same sub .700 OPS club are too many to count. This aint getting better in the next few weeks.

    Greene and Lodolo are pitching like elite guys so that is a big development, just not enough in 2024.

    • DaveCT

      CES’ failure to hit this year, aside from the impact of his injuries, was predictable given his strong tendency to swing at pitches out of the zone. In my most wishful state, i hope he can use this time to work on solving the problem, as it is wholly unsustainable against Major League pitching. Some AAA time on rehab and as practice not swinging at stuff out of the strike zone should be helpful. If/when he accomplishes that, CES’ power would be a huge addition.

    • DW

      I agree with much of this Old-School.

      The next really good Reds pitchers are likely Lowder and Petty. I’m not ready to get too worked up over Petty’s struggles early on this year. I think he will be fine. Phillips is pretty dang concerning at this point, as his struggles have been so dramatic.

      The offense is very concerning. And they are wasting the quality work of Greene, Lodolo, and Abbott. I still have hope that Ashcraft can right the ship this season, and maybe Montas as well.

      The defense and base running are quite concerning. Candelario cannot be our future 3B. India is very poor at 2B. Overall a weak defense.

      Seems like McLain and Friedl are the glue and spark plugs of this team.

    • Jim Walker

      Much too soon to write off CES. He looks to me like a natural hitter who will come through in the fullness of time. I suspect we have yet to scratch the surface of what all was going on with him this spring and up to his departure to the IL

      • Melvin

        Absolutely. CES is a great asset and will get better as time goes on.

      • Old-school

        Agree Jim

        But,,, the question is who rights this ship offensively in 2024 with backs against the wall in late June? It’s not coming internally. CES might be good in 2025, we all love McLain but he might start a rehab in august and I’m a big fan of Marte potential but he’s not gonna come in and be manny machado. We’ve Seen India Fraley benson Fairchild and the AAAA crowd and this offense isnt getting better

        Lance McCalister tweeted the reds have scored 2 runs or less in 32% of their games. There is no internal solution to this problem in the next 4-6 weeks and that doesnt address the defense or baserunning or bullpen or 5th starter

        I got no internal solutions and suddenly the minors are underachieving for big trade options.

      • jmb

        In a couple years, Collier will play first, and CES will be DH. Steer will be gone, having trade value but not having a position. Will India still be with the team? If so, CES may be out.

  26. Kevin H

    Well Bell didn’t use Sims, and yet people complain about not using Moll. Do I think the reds win with Bell as manager? NO

    However nitpicking every decision the dude makes and the lineup he uses has made this site unbearable at times.
    I took a break and was hoping things were different, and I was wrong.

    Real quick if you can do better to those who constantly complain and nitpicking. Go apply for the job and see if you do any better. It’s not as easy as watching on TV, and I swear some act like mlb is a easy game.

    • Harry Stoner

      It’s true.

      A person steps away for awhile and when they return, they bring the same message:

      “Bell knows things!”

    • JohnnySofa

      LOL! The old “let’s see you do better” line. I’d love a shot at it. Pay me just 1 of those 5 mils and surround me with a staff. Let me wear a cap at work and eat from gourmet buffets every day. I’ll write down a lineup, spit, yell, lose, mumble nothingness through a press conference, ignore the complaining, and do it again the next day and the next. Buy me out. Please. I’d make more in that amount of time than I’ve been able to grind and save for 20 years. Bell is managing a major league baseball team, not volunteering for Little League — although sometimes it’s hard to tell the difference. High expectations from the fan base are part of the gig, or they should be.

      • VegasRed

        Now that’s funny Johnny! Sometimes the funniest things are full of truth.

      • Jedi Joey

        Well said, Johnny! Now this was a rant worth reading and it made me smile.

  27. DaveCT

    Noelvi Marte starting at 2B today with Louisville.

    • Melvin

      I’m watching. He Kd in the first. Jordan is not playing but Soto is. I want to take a look at those guys. Soto batting 3rd and walked first time up.

      • DaveCT

        Both Marte and Dunn with infield hits to short. I watched Phillips a bunch last year and his stuff looks quite a bit less electric. That and they are hammering him …

      • Melvin

        @DaveCT – Marte looks like he can handle 2B so far wouldn’t you agree?

      • DaveCT

        Sorry Melvin, mussed this last night. Yes, Marte looks good at 2B. His arm, i think, is suited for 3B so i wonder if he becomes the guy who plays sll over this year.

      • Melvin

        Speaking of playing all over it would be good if he could learn some outfield too.

  28. Daniel Kals

    2020 Reds regulars with OPS over .750:

    Jesse Winker .932
    Curt Casali .866
    Joey Votto .800
    Mike Moustakas .799
    Nick Castellanos .784
    Eugenio Suarez .781

    2024 Reds Regulars with OPS over .750

    Jeimer Candelario .792
    Elly de la Cruz .781

    In case anyone is wondering how many hitters we are away from being in contention to lose in the first round of the playoffs!

      • Daniel Kals

        Nah, I’m sure the 1-2-3-4 punch of Will Benson, Jacob Hurtubise, Stuart Fairchild, and Luke Maile will turn it on soon enough!

      • Melvin

        Thought so. Sounded like you were getting a little crazy there for a second. 😀 😉

    • Tom Diesman

      It’s not near as grim and you are painting it. OPS+ is your friend when comparing disparate MLB season.

      2020 MLB OPS .740
      2024 MLB OPS .702

      2020 Reds OPS .715 OPS+ 85 (27th in MLB)
      2024 Reds OPS .681 OPS+ 92 (23rd in MLB)

      2020 Curt Casali .866 OPS+ 123
      2024 Jeimer Candelario .792 OPS+ 121

      2020 Eugenio Suarez .781 OPS+ 100
      2024 TJ Friedl .701 OPS+ 98

      • Daniel Kals

        You make a good point. However I will say this. When you take the OPS+ of the entire roster of position players vs. just the regular starting 9, obviously it evens out a bit because the guys at the bottom of both squads are pretty bad. In fact, the 2020 bench players were far more horrific than the current squad, including many with an OPS+ UNDER ZERO! A few examples: Jose Barrero (OPS+ 6), Josh Vanmeter (-13), Phil Ervin (-10), Travis Jankowski (-32), etc. This year’s bench is much more respectable, hovering around the OPS+ 50 range. The problem is, the “starters” aren’t much better than the “bench”.

      • Jim Walker

        Thank you, Tom. I had the same thought but was feeling too lazy to run down the examples.

    • jmb

      Never thought I’d want Moose back! But the 2020 Reds barely made it to the playoffs and were eliminated lickittysplit.

  29. Melvin

    Down on the farm Phillips has already given up three runs with one out in the 2nd.

    • Melvin

      Make that three home runs and six earned runs after three. I’m afraid he’s not looking too good obviously.

      • DaveCT

        Mentioned above, his stuff looks like it has really backed up.

    • Harry Stoner

      Would not be surprised if there’s some undisclosed injury situation with Phillips.

      We’ve been there before.

      • Melvin

        Yeah. Seems like he’s regressed too far too fast.

  30. kyhoward77

    No consistent offense. Most starters are batting in the 230’s or less. Miss McLain, Marte, and CES. Elly and Steer just need to play every day to figure it out. I like India but he will never be more than a borderline starter as his average bat does not make up for his below average defense.
    Starting pitching of Greene, Lodolo, and Abbott have been very good. I think these young guys have turned the corner and are proving to be the 3 starters for the future. Injuries have really decimated any chance for this year but the future is still bright.
    Going to be a year of growing pains. I hope management stays the course as far as the roster but we do need a big league manager.

    • Jimbo44CN

      The entire league average is 241, and yes we are below that with the 230s, but not by much. Pitchers have the advantage. Just remember how hard it was to hit a baseball at 75 mph when you were a teenager. I remember at 40 trying to hit a guy throwing 85. It looked like a Pea and was by me before I could blink. Now think about the average fastball this year. 93.7, with many pitchers in the high 90s or 100s. Awfully tough. Sometimes I think we just need to bunt more and hope for the best. Seriously though, it’s much tougher than it used to be.

  31. Rednat

    And in other news, notre dame defeated Army 6-3 on a 30 yard field goal!. George Gipp lead the Irish wit 150 yards on 50 carries out of te wishbone offense. Newt Rockne saod ot was the most exciting game he has ever witnessed.

    Come on baseball…. get it together. Get into the 21st century! Its all about the offense now.

    Many more rule changes are needed for mlb to survive.
    1. I agree with Doug the pitchers are evil wizards full of trickery and deceit. Maybe make them pitch the whole game.
    2. ban the shift completely. Paint a 5 foot line at all the positions and make the defenders stand on that line until the pitch is delivered.

    I dont know… something…. tgese games are quite boring now

    • Harry Stoner

      I don’t know, maybe there’s a simpler solution that would be of immediate help to the Reds:

      _If you get picked off first with no outs, it’s $1000 fine to Cincinnati Childrens’ Hospital.

      _If you get thrown out at 3rd for the 1st run of the inning, it counts as 2 outs.

      _If you throw to the wrong base after making an outfield catch, or make a lame soft toss in the ball while the runner scurries back to base after a TOOTBLAN, see 31 above x 2 and acknowledge that the RLN fans mysteriously supporting you might be dreaming.

      _If you get a Golden Sombrero, you ride the pine the next day.

      _If you K instead of a SF, see #1.

      _If you K instead of advancing the runner, see #1.

      _If you’re the #4 RH platoon outfielder and RLN favorite and you can’t get a simple bunt down or try to score from second with a poor jump and a routine play, join the Golden Sombrerodoros on the bench.

      _If you’ve swung and missed for the 50th time at the same down and away slider, you take a 15% pay cut.

      _If you mumble your way through yet another post game interview mewling your same pablum following yet another display of poor approach to hitting which you do nothing to address: $5K contribution to the Cincinnati Zoo.

      _On your 5th offense of the above, you resign your managerial position and publicly state: “We don’t want to be ‘who we are’, but ‘who we need to be’.

      And agree to a lifetime ban from the broadcast booth.

      No guarantees here, but a lot of simple things to try first.

      • Votto4life

        Harry if it was one or two players who keep making dumb plays I would agree with you. The fact that most players on the roster plays poor situational baseball leads me to believe it is a systemic problem in the Red’s organization.

        I think there needs to be a review of the Red’s whole player development department. The young players may be being taught how to hit, pitch and field. But, they don’t seem to have a good grasp of situational baseball.

        If we are really in a new Dead Ball era, it’s going to be crucial for players to understand baseball fundamentals.

  32. LDS

    As Doug, or someone noted a few days ago, pitching is vastly tougher than it was during the 70s or the 90s, etc. And that’s true, though I suspect that guys like Maddux would still be successful. What hasn’t happened yet is the hitters adapting. Some have. There are numerous .300 hitters, like Ohtani, a bit of a black swan, and even guys like Ozuna, some with power. In the Reds case, not too many. Launch angle, exit velocity, and other “analytics “ are only part of the story. Where is the plate discipline, the pitch selection, the patience, working the count, etc. Jumping on the first pitch, striking out 10+ times a game, walking occasionally, etc are development issues, as is the lack of focus, the poor base running and other fundamental errors that the Reds make routinely. When I hear someone critical of Lopez, Hurtubise, and others for their lack of power, I just shake my head. Luis Arraez is hitting about .319 right now and .325 for his career. He is below average in most advanced batting metrics, EV, HH%, BB%, ISO, etc. But he also doesn’t SO all that much. Does anyone here actually believe that a lineup of nine Arraez like hitters couldn’t outperform the Reds most days? So for those “tired” of the criticism of Bell and the Reds organization, how do you want to address these deficiencies? The 5+ seasons that Bell has managed, it’s clear that the team isn’t going to play their way out of it. Yes, they’ll have good streaks, 7 in a row, 12 in a row, and folks here will get pumped. Then they’ll lose 6 or 8 in a row multiple times and reality sets back in. The Reds roster, even without the injuries, was unlikely to win the division. Marte coming back soon, Friedl, and the rest aren’t going to suddenly boost them to WS contenders. For those thinking Bell knows things and Krall has @ grand plan, sorry folks, you’re dreaming.

    • DW

      Very well put on your take concerning the pitching and approach to hitting these days LDS. I certainly agree. And your point with Arraez sums it up well.

    • still a red

      Except for Candalario, most of these guys are basically sophmores, India and Stephenson only juniors. And no Trouts, Machados, or Harpers (altho I suspect there was learning curves with them too) There is alot of learning still going on. Now, is Bell and staff the ones to teach it on the run?? I guess you’d like to see some progress, but you are still going to see mistakes. And the tuff love stuff by humiliation, public or private, just isn’t going to work.

      • LDS

        You misunderstand completely. No one is asking for public humiliation. Humiliation and accountability are two different things. What we are seeing this yes with the young guys doesn’t differ much from what we’ve seen from far more experienced players under Bell.

  33. Jeremiah

    While we get frustrated with our Reds, the National League is full of parity and mediocrity. 9 teams within 1.5 games of each other!…if the season ended today the 36-37 Cardinals, and Nationals would both be in the playoffs.

    It’ll be interesting to see who separates themselves from that pack. Even the Mets are back in it. What would help the Reds separate from the pack at some point?

    For the Central, I like the Reds and Pirates talent better than the Cubs. Not sure what to think of the Cardinals.

    Reds should take 2 of 3 from the Red Sox I think. Probably big crowds, a lot of excitement with Boston in town, I’d be disappointed if they don’t win that series.

    • Jim Walker

      “…National League is full of parity and mediocrity. 9 teams within 1.5 games of each other!…”

      As Reds fans, we should embrace the opportunity for our team to get into the postseason. Even if we don’t like the proposition of almost half the teams making the first cut, 6 NL teams are going to get in; and, it might as well be our team as another mediocre team filling out the field.

      And besides, with Greene and Lodolo at the top of their rotation, the Reds would be a team well set for postseason short series where pitching often rules the day.

      • Melvin

        “As Reds fans, we should embrace the opportunity for our team to get into the postseason.”

        Yeah. Whether we like it or not it’s right there in front of us so ought to embrace it.

  34. Jeremiah

    One other NL Central thought…got to hand it to the Brew Crew. They seem to officially be the class of the NL Central. Reds, Pirates, Cubs especially thought of to have up and coming talent, and St. Louis spending a lot of money on pitching, and the Brew Crew still leading the division comfortably approaching mid-season. They seem to be a step ahead of the rest of the division. I still think they could struggle a bit at some point, but probably still win at least 85-86 games which maybe wins the division. And if they get hot and add a bat or starting pitcher, who knows maybe a sleeper team to make a run in the playoffs.

    • still a red

      So is Craig Counsell a great manager or meh? Won lots with Brewers, said to be a guru, but give him the Cubs and they are no better than last year. Meanwhile, Pat Murray’s first full time pro gig, and the Brewers just like they have been. So what’s the deal. How much difference does a manager make?

      • Melvin

        The Cubs have brought down mania a managers over the years. 🙂

  35. Brian

    Doug, Doc said “people”. If you have one nut case, why not ban him? I personally post positive and negative comments. When your team loses year after year, for decades…. It makes sense that there will be more negative comments than positive. Unless someone doesn’t appreciate honest dialogue and some tough truths then it should be expected and acceptable outside of an obsessed individual that you seem to be referencing.

  36. Steven Ross

    Postives: Starting pitching! Lodolo and Greene. Impressive. Cruz in Relief has been solid…for the most part. Moll having a good season. Defensively, Fairchild and especially, Espinal. Dude is a wizard with the glove.

    Negatives: Bell sucks. J/K Doug. I feel like the team needs a new voice in dugout. I’ll leave it there. Without CES, McLain, Friedl and Marte, you’re asking a lot from others. Speaking of Friedl: Hamstring, thumb, wrist, hamstring, Oblique, hamstring. Like him a lot but always something. Benson. We can do better.

    Sadak: he’s fine but the minutia comment is spot on. Honestsly, I don’t care one bit about “exit velo”. I know if the ball was hit hard. The 3 Player Parlay is a joke. Never pays off. 2 times this season?

    Finally, stuck in mediocrity rings true. We’re only a game and half out of the Wild Card. Who isn’t? If that’s your goal, you’ll always fall short. The aim should be win the Division. Feels like another lost season.

    • west larry

      I agree with much of what you said. I would add that Farmer has been a pleasant surprise, and India is way better than the last two years, where he had leg and than foot issues. He is not great defensively, but again, much better than in thee last two years. If he continues to hit like he has in June maybe he will bat for a .270 average. Offensively, I’m really disappointed with all of the outfielders. Candyman has been the reds most consistent hitter, and Elly looks to have a bright future. The starting pitching has been great, particularly Greene, Lodolo and Abbott. When Marte comes back, the reds offense should be a little better. I’m really looking forward to 2025, with a healthy McLain, CES and FrIedl. I’ll be 80 before spring training, and I hope 202 is the year. I’m running out of time! G reds!

      • Votto4life

        I agree things are likely to improve next year but I don’t expect McLain will be back to form until 2026. It will probably be 2026 until Lowder is on solid footing and this year’s draft pick probably won’t be ready until mid 2026.

        I suspect 2025 to look better than 2024, but not by leaps and bounds. Borderline WC team.

        Of course, injuries to Green, Lodolo or Abbott and 2024 can be worse.

      • west larry

        Say it isn’t so. Injuries to Lodolo, Greene or Abbott would be devastating
        those three are the heart of this team.

      • TR

        I’m a Super Ager, meaning 80 and beyond. It happens to everyone if they live long enough. MLB is a daily occurrence for a big chunk of the year with a lot of ups and downs. A game at a time does it for me.

  37. Oldtimer

    In March 2024, I thought the Reds lineup and pitching staff would look like this:

    1B CES 2B McClain SS EDLC 3B Marte DH Candelario or India C Stephenson LF Steer CF Friedl RF Fraley or Benson. Pretty good lineup. Four of those missing last night.

    SP Greene Lodolo Ashcraft Montas Abbott. Ashcraft back in AAA now.

    Bullpen CL Diaz RP Martinez and others. Diaz not great but still 16 saves (on track for 35 saves). Martinez better in bullpen than SP.

  38. old-school

    Krall gave a state of the union type Q&A yesterday and very bland and very vague talking points.

    Young team needs to develop consistency
    Young players in years 1-3 still developing
    Core young players missing

    no mention of trades at all.

    It would seem what you see is what you get until end of July.
    Softball questions. Nothing about K rates, baserunning blunders, or underperformance of players or glaring positional needs- Outfield bat, high leverage reliever and 1 good SP.

    • DataDumpster

      Read the article earlier. Lots of questions from “Charlie G.” with some of them trying to tease out some specifics about the state of play and plans for improvement but “consistency” seemed to be the only recurring non-answer. If Krall is preparing the ground to lower expectations of any significant trade moves or change in strategy, I suppose he was successful. If the reader is already convinced that The Ownership is fine with staying pat with the results obtained thus far and/or that this team will never get much better results this year under the tutelage of David Bell, then that is probably also correct.

      • Rob

        Well stated. To gain a playoff spot, we have to play about 14 games over 500 in the last 85+ games. Something like 50-36 or 581 baseball. And that is just squeaking into the playoffs, not catching the Brewers. Yes, this sounds to me very much like “lower expectations” than the preseason chest pounding …..with some of the injuries. Does he not think this below 500 team is underperforming or needs a high powered injection to get to 86 wins? OK but lets not be betrayed in August and September and 2025. At least he will not have to trot out his whiny “prices too high” to get the big bat.

    • Jim Walker

      I liked that at least Krall expressed a different attitude about the guys out with injuries than the pining for their return we continually hear from the manager…..

      How much are you expecting from McLain and Encarnacion-Strand during the second half of the season?……


      “Right now, they’re not here. We’ve got to play with the players we have. Those guys need to rehab and continue to get better. I don’t want to put any stock into what a guy’s timeline is, especially coming back from a long-term injury.

      Just maybe the manager’s rocking chair status isn’t as safe as many believe??

      https://x.com/CharlieG__/status/1803774892636053820

      • Rob

        Krall also said last year where he didn’t see the value in trading for a starting pitcher when Greene and Lodolo were coming off the IL in late August. Roll with Weaver and Stoudt and Kennedy until then. Wouldn’t this have been an ideal situation to acquire a rental to cover you in August and in September if Greene or Lodolo hic-cupped? To protect your first place standing. And Scherzer was free minus the cost of 2 prospects. (Phillips and X). And the Rangers snuck into the playoffs and WS because of this trade and others. Water over the dam now but just shows why we shouldn’t see Krall’s rational as win focused. It is far from it.

      • Votto4life

        Nick Krall won’t fire Bell unless Bob Castellini gives him the OK. I don’t see that happening, especially with two years remaining on his contract.

        I think Nick Krall is on thinner ice than David Bell. Phil Castellini can’t be pleased with Krall spending $50,000,000 last winter and winning fewer games.

  39. Mike W

    I could get our team into the playoffs and would charge nothing if I didn’t.

    MLB is not an easy game. It’s very complex. I get that.

    I also know over almost 6 years, Bell has proven he cannot make the playoffs no matter who he has for players. The franchise should have made a change two years ago, not an extension. I’m ready.

    • Jon

      “I also know over almost 6 years, Bell has proven he cannot make the playoffs no matter who he has for players.”

      Not a big fan of Bell myself, but am even less a fan of Krall and the Castellinis. And it’s not like Bell has ever had a full deck of cards to play with.

      2019: not expected to contend.
      2020: odd Covid season.
      2021: terrible bullpen. Still should have made playoffs though. If there was ever a time to fire Bell, this was it.
      2022: rebuild.
      2023: no starting pitching.
      2024: no hitting (injuries + suspension + inexperience/sophomore slumps?).

  40. still a red

    Sorry, just have to share this from the Nats re: Winker:

    “He has good at-bats,” Corbin said. “He’s a professional. He’s been around for a long time, hits lefties, hits righties and works walks. Those are guys that can help deep in our lineup. A great swing by him right there to get us on the board and take the lead for good.”

    “These guys were playing a game in spring where you had to put the ball in play and situational things,” Law said. “He was just doing it left and right — flipping it to left, flipping it to right. I’m like, ‘Man, this guy just has crazy bat control.’

    After batting .198 in 26 games played in May, Winker this month has a slash line of .380/.483/.460, with a .943 OPS, nine RBIs and one home run.

    • Melvin

      ““These guys were playing a game in spring where you had to put the ball in play and situational things,” Law said. “He was just doing it left and right — flipping it to left, flipping it to right”

      Maybe we ought to play those types of games in practice mid season. What do you think? 😉

      • Still a Red

        Sure. Why not. I suspect Votto helped Winker with that skill.

  41. m2

    Mr. Greene has made strides forward this year from a thrower to a pitcher, however, he needs to continue – being gassed in the sixth or seventh inning at best is inconsistent with the monicker of staff ace. This means location – pitch efficiency. Seems he’s starting to realize that he can read and set up batters accordingly. I look forward to him continuing this necessary process.

    • Jim Walker

      Brantley pointed out Wednesday that Greene was not getting the kind of support he needed from his defense when Greene was forced to do extra work by blown GIDP opportunities that resulted in only 1 out.

      Believe the way Cowboy put it was that Greene was bailing his defense out for plays they should have made but did not make versus the defense making Greene’s job easier like it should be able to do.

      He also added that “little things” like that which don’t get done are often what eventually make the difference between wins and losses.

      • MBS

        True, a good defense makes the pitchers job so much easier.

        McLain was silky smooth at SS, and EDLC was GG quality at 3B. I’d love it if we went back to that alignment next season.

        I’m a bit pessimistic about Arroyo making it up to the Reds at any point in 2025, but he’d make an awesome 2B in 2026.

  42. Melvin

    Recently on The Riverfront Podcast it was discussed how David Bell actually has a winning record in the months of June & July. I did a quick check (may not be completely accurate). 2019-Now

    Opening day through May 31st: 119-150

    June & July: 122-111

    August through the end of season: 127-153

    Here’s to hoping the winning continues in June & July and carries over this time until the end. I just wanna win. 🙂

  43. Melvin

    Just watched Santillan pitch the 9th inning for the Bats. He looks good. Had his slider working. Two Ks and a groundout. He doesn’t look like he’s overweight near as much as he just looks like a big dominating guy. I don’t see how he couldn’t be an asset to the Reds staff over somebody. Could be a major asset in my view. Picked up his 12th save.

    Marte 0-5 with two Ks. Played 3B this time after playing 2B last night.

    • Melvin

      Ashcraft got the win by the way. You can read more about it in Doug’s write up. He does a lot better than I do and is a lot better at it. 🙂

    • Jim Walker

      9 pitches and 7 strikes for Santillian. When is the last time we’ve seen a Reds reliever do that when on to close out the 9th?

      I also noticed that Tony’s weight seems to be heading back upward after appearing to have gone down as the 2023 season progressed.

  44. Bill J

    Bob Feller, 1946 may be his best season. He went 26-15 2.18 ERA, 1.158 WHIP with 348 strikeouts in 371.1 innings. He threw 36 complete games with 10 shutouts.
    We will never see anything like that again.