The Cincinnati Reds announced that Frankie Montas would be their starting pitcher on Tuesday when the club gets back on the field at Great American Ball Park against the Arizona Diamondbacks. He’s currently on the injured list and needs to be activated for that start to happen. There were some questions about who would get sent out to make a spot for him and today we’ve got that answer as the team optioned left-handed reliever Sam Moll to Triple-A Louisville.

Cincinnati acquired Sam Moll last year at the trade deadline in a deal that sent Joe Boyle to join the Athletics. Moll came to Cincinnati and posted a 0.73 ERA in 25 games after the move was made. This season he began the year on the injured list, but was activated two weeks ago. In that time he’s pitched in five games and not allowed a run. In his 30 games as a Red he’s allowed two entire runs and somehow he just got sent to the minor leagues.

Saved simply by the grace of not having options were Lucas Sims and his ERA of 6.10 and Emilio Pagan and his ERA of 5.93. And while they were never going to option their closer, Alexis Diaz is rocking a 6.57 ERA right now, too, and walking/hitting a bunch of guys along the way.

What happened here is pretty simple: Sam Moll has options and most of the bullpen doesn’t. So the Reds decided that sending down someone who has performed incredibly well was better than potentially losing someone who would have to clear waivers if they were sent down instead. Right, wrong, fair, unfair – that’s pretty much all that went into the decision. He had options available and others didn’t. Performance was not a consideration.

Cincinnati may not be done making moves. David Bell mentioned on Sunday that it may be possible that outfielder TJ Friedl returns on Tuesday, too. If he’s going to be activated there will be a need for another roster move. We’ll have to wait and see if that happens or not.

115 Responses

  1. Gpod

    If you are Sam Moll, wouldn’t you say: “this is total BS” ?

    • Doug Gray

      I’d be talking with the MLBPA about my options here.

      • ksdavis


        With not at least attempting to bring Mike Ford up, or maybe even trading for Arraez, it tells you all you need to know about the organization.

      • Jim Walker

        I’ve not tried to decipher the CBA legalese but I’m guessing by doing this today on an off day they saved not only a day of service time on him but quite possibly also the salary difference between MLB and MiLB for pre-arb guys on option to MiLB.

        One thing to watch is if he is back within 15 days (being a pitcher), the time he was on option should still count as MLB service time and it won’t count as being optioned. But it would take an injury to someone for this to happen.

      • BK

        @Jim, If he’s recalled within 20 days the option is revoked.

        @Doug, what would you expect MLBPA to do about this transaction? His velocity is down. Probably a better choice than Cruz.

      • Brian

        What will probably happen is that this will mess with the mental aspect of his pitching. I lol for him to have a pretty bad stretch when he gets back.
        He already knows now that performance has zero factor. He might not second guess himself but how does he not second guess the situation or the organization? Such a shame. It’s not really possible for a reliever to put together a better 30 game stretch.

    • Old Timer 50s Purist

      Dumb, dumb, dumb sending Sam Moll down to Louisville. So much for rewarding a star pitcher that was perfect in all 5 games he pitched. Instead, management constantly praise 5 and 6 inning starting 100 pitch count (mainly lefties) wonders that pitch every 5th day. That certainly won’t get the Reds even in the playoffs. I’m wondering if pitch count and every 5th day for starters has contributed to accelerated arm surgeries.

  2. RedsGettingBetter

    Well, lately the Reds are not considering the player performance as criteria to call up or option him…. it is a little bit hateful and it doesn’t seem to help…

  3. AllTheHype

    Moll, Santillan, Bruihl, Kravetz, Kriske, Legumina.

    A case could be made that the Bats have the better pen.

  4. James k

    Meanwhile, Tony Santillan continues pitching outstandingly well for Louisville. Seems great reluctance to letting go of anyone currently on the 40-player roster.

  5. Jim Walker

    The Reds just keep giving me chances to post song lyrics describing the goings on.

    Moll being optioned brings up another Eagles gem. From the song “The Sad Cafe”:

    Maybe the time has drawn the faces I recall
    But things in this life change very slowly if they ever change at all

    Composed by Don Henley, Glenn Frey, and JD Souther.

  6. Rut

    Don’t think this move makes the team better. Same with not calling up Ford — at this point we need some urgency, and instead we get more of the same.

    My prediction is that the Reds season will be toast by the time they return from their west coast trip on May 20…

  7. ksdavis

    So it is not about wining, putting the best players out there. It is about maybe a player will perform better at some point in time. With the joke of not attempting to see if Mike Ford performed better than any of the other players that the Reds have, this tells you the Reds are not serious about winning this year.

  8. Optimist

    I’ll remain optimistic and predict an extremely active trade deadline. No big names, but many transactions.

    • Justin T

      Re-shuffling the deck of borderline major leaguers. At what point do we come to the realization that after 1000 ABs the team is hitting .210 and may just suck at hitting? They need better players, it isnt going to happen this year. Now you have a terrible 45 million 3 yr deal on the books so you have to work around that.

      • Optimist

        Who are the “borderline major leaguers” on the current roster? Who would you trade?

        I’m looking at the contract status – anyone with contract expiring before 2026 or over age 27. Those are the trade candidates. Possibly anyone younger than 26 if they get the right offer.

        I doubt they trade any of the under age 26 players, but most of the bullpen, and several position players may get moved – I’d take the over if the number is 2.5.

    • JB

      I think they will trade for Mike Ford at the deadline.

  9. Jon

    I just don’t get how a Major League organization can continue to operate in this manner year in and year out. Not caring as much about winning as saving every dollar possible. What an utter joke. How many more games will Pagan cost the Reds before he’s gone?

  10. TJ

    Just thinking out loud. Are the Reds trying to bide time for a trade? Of course it makes no sense sending one of the Reds best relievers to AAA. Instead of jettisoning one the lesser relievers, maybe the Reds are looking for a trade partner. Even if it means eating a lot of the salary, getting a minor leaguer or two in return, or a major leaguer with options, would save the Reds some face. Just spit balling, I have no inside information or clairvoyance.

    • Stock

      They did know a couple of weeks ago that Montas was coming back. Why didn’t something happen in those two weeks?

      • J

        SOMETHING ??? something like what in those 2 weeks ???? Make a guy injured and just put him on the injured list before Montas returns ??? Maybe let it play out , maybe an injury actually does accure!! You can barely ” PREPARE ” in that way for a players return

    • Brian

      If I’m Moll, I request a trade. He’s kicked butt and has probably performed his job better than any other Red during that period for what he’s asked to do. I’m sure he plays to be on a mlb team. Unbelievable!!!

  11. docmike

    I agree that Sam Moll has a beef here. But blame for this lies not with the Reds, so to speak, but with the whole system that the MLB and the MLBPA have agreed upon.

    The problem lies with the fact that underperforming players such as Sims and Pagan who are out of options can’t be sent down without the risk of losing them for nothing. Why should that be the case? Wouldn’t it be better if all players were allowed to be freely sent down and recalled without being limited by a certain number of “options”, assuming that they would still receive their major league salary? Maybe those guys could go down and work on their mechanics, then hopefully get called back up.

    By all rights one of the underperforming players should be packing their bags for Louisville right now, but because of the “option” system, they’re safe. Baseball
    really is a zero-sum game. The same rule that helps players like Sims or Pagan, hurts guys like Moll. It stinks.

    • Mauired

      You make a pretty good point that I never considered. Why can’t the Reds who have to pay these guaranteed contracts send someone to the minors to get back on track. Why is it Major Leagues or nothing and get paid regardless of it hurting the team.

    • Jim Walker

      The option system dates back to the old reserve clause/ pre-draft/ pre-freeagency era. Its purpose was to keep deep pocketed teams from signing and keeping control indefinitely of a preponderance of the higher ceiling guys by stockpiling players in the minors.

      Under the rules then, the option system was seen as a friend to teams that could not compete for top players on the open market. It was also seen as good for baseball in general since it stopped the hoarding of top talent by the richer organizations.

      Any significant change in the option system in today’s environment would have to include a path to guarantee players a clear path to arbitration and/ or free agency of some sort not based solely on MLB service time as it is defined today.

    • Doc

      Why does Diaz, who has options, get a pass because he is “the closer”? Send Diaz down, move Cruz to closing, keep Moll. I don’t like the system as it has evolved, but even within the system as it exists, they could have made a different move. As far as I know, the CBA doesn’t give someone immunity just because of closer designation.

      • Jim Walker

        As far as I know, you are 100% correct on this 😉

      • jmb

        Yes, Diaz is showing that typical trend for relief arms of having a good season then a bad one. Though, it’s early still.

    • doofus

      Good points docmike. Stop making sense. I do not know how this forum will handle that.

  12. Roger Garrett

    Performance should count but it didn’t and well that kind of sums up what we all know about our beloved Reds.Its just a joke on how the team continues to be run but the honest truth is the joke is on us the fans if we continue to follow and support this team.I seem to recall the famous words of what else are you going to do and well i guess he was right.

    • 2020ball

      And yet, here you are proving him right.

    • greenmtred

      There’s an easy solution, Roger. If I ran the zoo, I’d have sent Sims down because I have a minor anxiety attack every time he pitches.

    • doofus

      Who was that owner that said he knows how it is done?

  13. Chris

    With the downright horrible play by a lot of Reds players thus far, this move makes me sick. Really disgusted with this organization right now. I think Krall should be only allowed to make trades, because virtually everyone of his signings has been terrible. Lots of money waisted on Candelario, Pagan, Martinez, and Suter.

    • CI3J

      Martinez and Suter have not been that bad.

      But Pagan and Canelario have absolutely been busts so far. I still think there’s a chance Candelario might become a useful player. I have no such hope for Pagan. His stuff is very, very hittable, and I just don’t see a way that changes unless he’s been injured all this time.

      • Melvin

        Someone mentioned recently the possibility of trading two underperforming players for each other. Candelario for Castellenos

        Personally I’d take that trade.

    • J

      Martinez & Suter aren’t that bad , Suter especially had like 1 bad outing and Martinez just needs to be in the bullpen ! He’s at his best letting it all go for 3 or 4 innings but after that is when he seems to get into trouble !! Candy man & Pagan weren’t great signings at the time ! Pagan always gave up too many HRs , why they thought that’s a fit in Great American Small Park is anyone’s guess ! Candy man is a .240 hitter with gap power , what were the expectations?? He definitely not worth the $15 million we can’t afford to waste lol !! Maybe he can get hot at the right time and we can just deal him for more ascending young talent that lines up with Elly , McClain, Steer , etc lmao ? ? ?

      • Chris

        Martinez was brought in here on those dollars to be a starter, so yes, he’s been that bad. Suter was the only signing I liked, and yes, he’s been decent, but overall, the signings have been among the worst of any team this year when you consider the costs.

      • greenmtred

        My recollection is that Martinez was mentioned as both a starter, if needed, and a reliever who could pitch multiple innings. The FA acquisitions may indeed prove to have been not worth the money, but we won’t know that until much later in the season.

  14. Justin T

    Risk losing Lucas Simms? No way! Eventually he is gonna be a decent reliever right?

    • J

      Eventually???? He’s BEEN a decent reliever in his career actually, it’s just this year is off to a horrible start

      • Ksdavis

        Simms has had two out of eight years where he has been good. Other years he has had ERA above 4.50. Sometimes far above so I think two years have been outliers.

      • earmbrister

        OR you could say that Simms has had one bad year in the last five years (2022) and is off to a bad start in 2024.

        Simms may just be an average reliever. Nothing wrong with that, the Reds just need to use him accordingly.

  15. CI3J

    Honestly, they should just release Pagan. He is 33 years old and has very middling stuff. I didn’t know much about him before he came to the Reds, but since watching him pitch, he just looks very underwhelming.

    If you look at his career, last season was very much an outlier. His ERA+ last year was 143(!), while in the previous 3 seasons, it was 88, 81, and 94. He seemed to be a pretty good pitcher in his late 20’s, but since passing 30, he’s been below average except for, again, last year’s outlier.

    Krall needs to admit he was duped and that he made a bad move, get rid of Pagan and get Moll (or Santillan, or Bruihl, or Kravetz, or Kriske, or Legumina) onto the Reds pronto.

    Isn’t the name of the game giving your team the best chance to win?

    Or is it “We paid for this guy, so we’re going to keep playing him, no matter what the results are”?

    • CI3J

      Sorry, my bad.

      Pagan’s birthday is actually tomorrow. So he’s 32 for a few more hours.

      • David

        Naughty, naughty CI3J!

        In my world, Sims AND Pagan would be gone, Moll would still be here and Tony Santillan would be on the 40 man/26 man roster.

        What are the odds that Montas does NOT do well tomorrow night?

    • Justin T

      8 million a year for this year and next year. Our Reds even gave him the option to opt out after this season. I laugh as I type that. Hey we don’t need a bat, we need a reliever who struggles to keep the ball in the park, and lets give him the biggest contract he has ever had at age 32.

  16. 2020ball

    An early sweep by one of the best teams in the league and everyone thinks the sky is crashing around them and venting as if your wife or 30 years just left you for a young model. Typical RLN.

    Im left scratching my head on Ford and Moll as well, however. These players that Bell is so certain will turn it around better do it soon because its getting harder to make excuses for guys like Martini who’s never shown anything other than his current track. The relievers im somewhat more willing to give rope to, but jettisoning a reliever performing very well compared to his peers obviously raises some questions.

    • David

      Nobody is turning anything around. This is just roster churning.

      And it wasn’t JUST this weekend.

      • 2020ball

        The doom and gloom routine after one month of the season is always completely ridiculous and typical of most Reds fans who I imagine are counting days until the buckeyes open practice. That you dont think this team can change some things with 80%+ of the season left just because of a couple minor decisions means its probably time to get the ol pigskin out and toss it around with the rest of the “fans” on the internet. Y’all can wax poetic about the Cubs manager together. Maybe the Reds next year can go 162-0 and have zero adversity just like y’all wish they would.

    • Jon

      Couldn’t care less about the Buckeyes (or the Bengals for that matter). Having the worst team batting average in the majors (behind rebuilding teams like the White Sox, Athletics, Nationals, and Marlins) is not the result of one bad weekend. The venting comes from almost two decades of poor results under a cheap ownership group and almost 30(!) years since the team has even won a postseason series.

      • 2020ball

        That doesnt make it right, i honestly hate that response and i see it a lot. That sounds like plenty of time to learn to approach this game reasonably and not with constant negative hyperbole, especially on May frickin 5th. I can tell you i’d for sure not want to go to a game with most of you and hear that the whole time, Its not intelligent baseball discussion. Maybe whatever im doing here isnt either, but at least I enjoy watching the games because i know how long the season is.

      • Brian

        2020, I’m sure that Jon wouldn’t want to watch a game with you either, neither would I. Some fans cheer for their team Irregardless(you), some boo everything and a good fan will do both when it’s justified.

      • 2020ball

        Wrong, ive posted plenty of criticisms here. Go to games and complain the whole time if you really like i guess.

    • JohnStofa

      @2020ball It’s not a panic over being swept by the O’s, it’s mind boggling personnel decisions combined with a complete lack of transparency. That calls the competency of the decision makers form this team.

  17. Moon

    With TJ Friedl coming back I am beginning to wonder about the number of options Elly De La Cruz has left….!

    • Grand Salami

      Lol. Yeah. And when Alex young is ready Lodolo will be on the move.

  18. Laredo Slider

    LOL, sending the message to your team that their performance doesn’t matter is always good for team morale.

  19. Josh

    I can’t stop thinking about the message this sends the team. Performance doesn’t matter. Winning doesn’t matter. I hate this ownership group. Just terrible.

  20. Mauired

    So let me get this straight. Reds are struggling and they make the decision to weaken the team.

    Yeah I do understand the offense has been the problem with winning for the most part. But why have two of the best relievers on the team in Louisville just to keep Farmer, Pagan, and Sims.

    Sims is the obvious one to release. He’s a free agent at the end of the year. He’s making less than 3 million. I think the Reds only would eat around 2 million. And oh yeah he’s been horrible. 6 era. 3 homers, 9 walks in 10 innings. But yeah let’s demote the guy with the 0 era and longest scoreless streak in MLB. He go dominate in Louisville with Santillan.

    • AllTheHype

      Pagan has to stay for awhile due to remainder of $16M owed if they DFA.

      Reds roped themselves into this dilemma with too many guaranteed contracts to relievers and not enough that are optionable. I warned of this in January:

      “The biggest challenge this pitching staff will have this year is, how will they manage the staff…….
      Most are not optionable, unless they want to expose them to waivers. They can use the DL to some degree, but it has its limitations.
      Still, the Reds used 30 pitchers through June last year. Some of that was injuries, but the rest was just swapping fresh arms. Of course, the overall staff is much better and deeper this year. But the roster flexibility is very limited.
      It will be interesting to see how they manage the pitching side of the roster ledger this year.”

      I guess we now have the answer to that.

  21. Jason Franklin

    So, here’s what the lineup may look like once July 1st rolls around:

    This is just my guy feeling about what the mastermind will come up with for a lineup. Should it be changed? Yes. Should they call up someone to light a fire? Yes. Will it happen? Probably not.

    My stupidly optimistic lineup (or maybe just stupid) would be this:
    Friedl (CF)
    Stewart (2B)
    Steer (LF… I guess)
    DeLaCruz (SS)
    Marte (3B)
    CES (1B)
    Stephenson (C but they really need a better defensive C)
    Anyone semi-capable (DH)
    Dunn (RF)

    • Jason Franklin

      Obviously Stewart is not going to happen, but they need someone to actually “hit” the ball and know what they are doing up at the plate. As some have said, the Reds could have gotten Arraez but that was never going to happen either.

    • Justin T

      Put their career averages next to their names. This is not a team that has alot of high batting averages rostered. They all strikeout more than average. This is how this team was built offensively. The thought is they will perform better in GABP. I guess they forget they have to play on the road too? They have 3 starters down, 2 are young guys with (very) limited experience and another who has been slightly above average his career. You think that was a storm they couldn’t weather? I looked at this team in feb and thought they possibly could be the worst hitting team the Reds have ever put on the field. They also could be very exciting at times. But w the exception of Steer I didnt see anyone that resembled consistency or had shown a track record of it in the big leagues. It still early but I dont know why anyone is surprised the Reds are a streaky team. They will probably go as Elly goes this year.

    • Dean

      Did you intentionally leave India out of the lineup? He’s one our 5 hitters not on the interstate atm.

  22. Michael Wilson

    My initial thought on this is that it is roster manipulation. Moll goes down, and then comes back in a quick turn around, after making sure Montas is healthy, Friedl is ready, Young maybe. Then the “real” roster move is made, Martini, Thompson, a bullpen pitcher not named Moll.

    • 2020ball

      Martini and Thompson are not safe, and neither was Fords if they made that move. The manager has chosen the ship he will sink with apparently until guys are back from injury/suspension.

      • 2020ball

        Should add in Espinal, however him and Stu are important for the defense since there arent any position players yet making enough noise in AAA

  23. Jeremiah

    If half the Reds starting lineup continues hitting .200 or below not sure it matters what pitching moves they make.

    Can’t give up on Pagan of course, paying him too much money. I think he could still turn it around a bit. Moll has been great…a bit of a strange move but sounds like a numbers game. I wonder if this type of move happens on other teams, probably does rarely/occasionally.

    Reds could really go in the tank here with the schedule they have. It will be interesting to see what direction this team goes.

    I think now the lack of confidence is a concern. It reminds me of last year when they stopped hitting…they got so desperate they brought in Renfroe and Bader and that didn’t help really much. I hope they aren’t to that level yet.

    • TR

      The Reds need someone to jolt and lead the offense like Gregg Vaughan did many years ago. It doesn’t appear there’s a leader on the current squad, so it’s up to Nick Krall to make the necessary adjustment and stoke the offense.

  24. Michael Wilson

    My gut feeling is there will be more roster movement really soon, eg. Soto up to maybe replace Martini, Roa will be released, someone in the pen who is out of options will be released.

      • 2020ball

        Ill be surprised if its not Thompson, but not that surprised if so.

  25. Eddiek957

    It’s sucks Moll has been pitching well when healthy since the trade. But it is what it is he does have an option. Have a feeling he’ll be back soon

  26. Mark Moore

    It’s baffling to me … but I quit trying to make sense of this kind of stuff. I’m sure Moll will be back in relatively short order. Here’s hoping Frankie is ready to rock and roll tomorrow.

  27. Melvin

    “Performance was not a consideration.”

    That’s always scary.

  28. MBS

    This is why I was so puzzled when we were signing so many FA bullpen members who were out of options. Depth is great, but lack of flexibility to use that depth is bad. This decision is the most egregious example of how it’s hurt us so far this year. The fact that we’ve kept Santillan in AAA this long when he looks like his old self is another example of poor offseason construction.

    Farmer, Suter, Martinez, and Pagan = half of a pen, add in Sims, and Gibaut, and that leaves you with 2 spots with options. Diaz, Cruz and Moll have any business pitching in AAA. So what was the plan?

    They should have signed 2 HL type arms was the smart move, instead of 4 pretty good arms.

    • Old-school

      Agree MBS. But hard to identify bullet proof relievers. Aroldis Chapman is 0-2 with a 4.91 ERA and blown 2 games .
      Maybe this kid in AA can blow up like Diaz and Cruz did out of nowhere.

      • MBS

        It is hard to get those guys. I think 2024 is just another steppingstone year. We signed a bunch of helpful, but not impact FA’s.

        I think you’re right about Maxwell. He’s looking awesome in AA. By midseason or so, 1 of Phillips, or Richardson may also get converted to the pen. Starting might not be in the cards for them.

  29. Old-school

    Joe Boyle is 2-5 with a 7.16 ERA for the A’s. The lowly marlins got 4 in the first inning on him yesterday. Reds got the best of that trade. Moll is good and controlled. Disappointing to see him sent down but collective bargaining is a 2 way street. Moll got screwed but the players association created a system that screws young guys and guarantees vets no matter what. Either way, pitching aint the issue. It’s the offense.

    Reds need to demand the vets and experienced players answer the bell. Looking at you Jon India and Tyler Stephenson and Jeimer Candelario. Steer and Elly look like young guys in year 2 who are ready to compete and are more than carrying their weight. Id go with India leadoff every day at 2b, Freidl every day in CF, Elly every day at SS, Steer every day in the 4 hole, Fraley every day against righties in 5 hole and Candelario every day in the 6 hole. Id call India Stephenson and Candy into the office and say I am counting on you to lead and be the players we signed you to be.

    CES and Benson can hit 7/8 because they still have ceilings and no one else is better, but young players do this. Fairchild and Espinal are role players. Stop playing them every day.

    Bottom line is India and Stephenson are 4th year players and need to step up. Candelario was signed for good money to hit and be a leader, mentor to the young guys, especially the Latin players. All 3 of them need to course correct this offense and I would tell them now is their time. Go lead. If they dont, they cant be counted on in 2025 as Reds players and find better younger cheaper better players.

    • Old-school

      Boyle leads the AL in walks with 23, has thrown 4 wild pitches and hit a batter. He is now on the IL. Doug told you all he couldnt throw strikes. Moll is a win.

  30. 50thyearRedsfan

    I am disappointed that the Reds would send down one of our best relievers rather then expose a horrible performing pitcher with an ERA over 6 to waivers, who would ever want to claim them? And if they did how does that hurt the team when we have better relievers at AAA? I guess I am confused because I thought the idea was to promote and play the players based on how well they are playing not try to hold onto bad players by keeping them free from waiver exposure, this is ridiculous and winning is not the number one priority here. If I was Sam Moll I would be searching for a way out as Mike Ford did because no matter how well you play you will not be given a chance with the Reds for some absurd reasons I cannot understand.

    • Ted Alfred

      That absurd reason is called DBell

  31. Jason Linden

    My goodness. Whole lot of people worked up about a month of stats from relief pitchers (pretty much useless) and AAA stats from a AAAA player (totally useless) who would be sent right back out as soon as Friedl was ready.

    Guys, I know it’s been a rough week or two, but this is baseball, not football. It’s a long season and it’s almost never as good or bad as it seems.

    • Harry Stoner

      I don’t get the angst over Ford, except in light of the futility of Martini.

      But that’s a pretty blase reaction to the Moll demotion. The guy has been very solid in contrast to the rash of relievers continuing to put games at risk or out of reach.

      If it truly is an ‘options available’ move, then it is another example of how the front office has poorly played options on some players (Aquino and Barerro come to mind) while taking a flyer on expensive signings for players without any remaining.

      It’s true the Reds have both Suter and Wilson as LH options out of the BP, but Krall and Bell’s tendency towards mumblecore in response to the wiffleball questions from the press online exacerbates the frustrations of fans.

      Of course, taking a blase, hakuna matata approach to the current team ineptitude on the field and in the dugout does reduce heartburn, which can certainly accumulate over the long season.

    • Rednat

      I always appreciate your positivity Jason. I think the frustration on this site is not the past 2 weeks but the past 25 seasons. I haven’t trusted a team to score runs consistently since the 1999 club.
      Just seems like we have been declining since. I know we had some good teams in the early 2010s but that was due to great pitching and a weak division. The offense really wasn’t explosive.
      I hope you are right and the team has a 90 win season but it just seems unlikely. I’ve jumped off the cliff when it comes to the reds years ago. Lol. Just waiting for that knight in shining armor to come andrescue me. Votto and Bruce and Suarez couldn’t do it. Maybe these guys will turn it around and give me hope!!!!

    • greenmtred

      And it wasn’t long ago that there was lots of optimism, lots of excitement. The Reds have lost five in a row. They’re streaky. But that’s the nature of baseball. The Rangers had an eight game losing streak last year. The Yankees and D’Backs had nine game losing streaks. There is no yes, but about the injuries and suspension; they have hurt a lot, and yet–somehow–the Reds have been competitive anyway. Unloading prospects for enough proven MLB talent to make a difference is completely unrealistic and short-sighted. It should be too early to panic, but it clearly isn’t. And it’s never too early to seize a bit of adversity and use it to fuel an ongoing narrative. This a game, for God’s sake! A pastime! It’s not a test of our moral fiber.

      • Justin T

        I understand your point. I just read the comments of people wanting to spin a negative to a positive by comparing the Reds to teams that have a front office willing to help when the roster needs it. The Reds are not the Rangers. The Rangers had a championship team and championship front office. As far as the Reds being competitive, thats the goal of the front office. Being competitive and being a contender are worlds apart in professional sports.

        Just not sure what this front office has to do to convince people they simply don’t prioritize winning. There is no end in sight and it will continue as long as there are butts in seats. This isnt my opinion, this is fact. They do it over and over and yet still are defended by fans. Believe your own eyes, the results are right there. Bell has done a decent job this year but he shouldve been fired awhile ago. He loses more than he wins. They have given him a few different rosters, he can pull .500 out of a decent roster and loses 100 w a bad one.

        This isnt about this year, it’s every year. You dont need a crystal ball to see how this season will shake out. The worst thing about last years winning streak is it gave them excuse to re sign Bell and the worst thing about this years injuries is it gives them an excuse for 2024. Goes on and on. I grew up a Reds fan. Ive been loyal as a fan and have spent plenty of money including season tix twice. I cannot root for another team. Im only asking to get real baseball people in there who dont worry about patting their own back and just want to bring a ring back to our city.

      • greenmtred

        I understand your point, as well. There is little doubt that Krall’s latitude to add players is limited by financial constraints, so it seems likely that going with young, relatively untested players looked like the best strategy to build a good team. I haven’t given up on these guys, this team: it’s probably in the nature of young players to have dramatic ups and downs, and the injuries are not an alibi; they’re a fact. There is time to right the ship this season. Whether they will or not I don’t know. I’m pretty sure we’ve discussed managers before, so no need to rehash it, but to my mind the next indeterminate period of time will be serious test for David Bell: If he doesn’t lose the team, if he he keeps it together and playing hard, he will be doing his job. If he doesn’t, he will have failed.

      • Pete

        Green: I don’t think it’s a matter of keeping them playing hard but rather can he get them to remove some of the pressure they seem to be feeling? When the camera panned the Reds dugout Sunday, the guys looked mentally beat to me. Obviously, it is a tall order but IMO it hasn’t been a Bell strength. The Reds have historically started and finished season’s poorly under his leadership – when I would suggest the pressure on the team is at its height.

        The team is immensely talented but they look a little like the Bad News Bears at the moment. They will eventually come around because talent has a way of willing itself out. Much like the players, David Bell is a hard worker but he strikes me as tense under pressure….

      • greenmtred

        Pete and Mauired: Thank you both for your interesting comments about the nature of leadership. I remember somebody saying what I thought–and still think–was a perceptive take on the subject: it was to the effect that the most effective way to lead is to be true to your nature. People don’t buy phoniness. I think it’s hard to evaluate any manager’s leadership style or ability because much of it will take place behind closed doors and wins and losses are so dependent upon the players, both his and his opponents’. Bell is also fairly new to MLB managing and is presumably learning and changing. I’ve seen evidence that the players play hard for him, but it’s also true that the team has had late-season swoons which, though they can be partly accounted for by injuries, would indicate to me that something is amiss if they continue. That’s why I’m interested in seeing if the team can rebound quickly from what is, really, short bad stretch.

  32. Jim Delaney

    The off season moves clearly have placed Krall on the hot seat. I am sure ownership won’t accept a season 2024 if the regress are are worse than they were in 2023. If this does happen and Krall dies on the sword that Bell somehow doesn’t escape .. Bell has become such a hate the face.. no emotion at all unless a Reds player gets hit by a pitch….

  33. Dan

    Sending down Moll is infuriating.

    This is a self-inflicted wound, one day after the worst series this team has played in a long time.

    They just can’t get out of their own way sometimes. Unreal…

  34. Melvin

    Good News. The Whitesox had a bad night and now their BA is worse than ours. We’re out of last place in that department. Things are looking up already. 🙂 Small steps? 😉

  35. Rob

    Injuries and a suspension are certainly part of the reason for the disappointing record of the team. But that excuse will begin to wear thin as we move into late May and early June. We have known that Marte and McLain will be out until at last July since mid to late March. That is 6 weeks and 35 games and counting. It has been “addressed” with the additions of Espinal, Thompson, Martini, and more playing time for India. That is a reasonable band aid and if working could be extended beyond the band aid period. I would suggest 6 weeks is a reasonable band aid period and the initial conclusion is that it is marginal at best and bordering on the need for resuscitation. We still have 7-8 weeks to go before even one of them returns. We have a 9 game west coast road trip coming up followed by 4 gams with the Dodgers and I would suggest that is the end of the trial period. If we are at or above 500 and within 5-6 games of first place, maybe we can say Whew and things are OK for now. But if we play like we have for the last 2 weeks, look adrift, and fall 8+ games out of first, then I don’t see anyway you can ignore the situation. And you have to make at last 1 significant trade for a RH OF bat. Between the lousy Chisox, Rockies, and Marlins (surprisingly), there are plenty of very talented proven candidates here. They have plenty of prospect ammunition plus some interesting throw ins to make this happen for just about any RH bat that they want.

  36. Tom Reeves

    I the best thing Reds can could do is fill the stadium for this series and begin the game with a standing ovation for the team. Pump some energy and life back into the teams. The last thing anyone needs to do is panic like this comment thread.

  37. VaRedsFan

    Raise your hand if you are scared if the Reds lose Sims if they try to pass him through waivers?

  38. AMDG

    It seems way too early for the Reds to begin tanking.

    But when the rest of your bullpen has a combined ERA above 5.00, and the only guy who can seemingly get guys out is sent to AAA, something sure looks wrong.

  39. Michael Wilson

    A week for promotions and demotions? Fast track Maxwell and Lowder.

  40. wkuchad

    Last night was a much-needed break from baseball. Now let’s start a winning streak tonight!

  41. LDS

    Rosecrans on the Athletic has a good article pointing out just how bad the Reds hitters are.

    • Justin T

      i thought it looked like it was written by a team employee. Alot of sugar coating. If he is too critical Bob doesnt like that.

      • LDS

        I agree, it was somewhat generous and given that, not particularly encouraging.

    • Dean

      No article necesssary. Worst team BA in MLB (and I thought the ChiSox offense was anemic), and truly NO proven high average hitters in the lineup. I can’t believe I watch baseball in an era where .250 is considered a decent hitter. Nonetheless, we have two guys hitting over .250, and one only has 68 at-bats (Fraley), and will likely be under .250 by 100 ABs.
      Honestly, though, I’m not sure anyone should be surprised. Stephenson, India, De La Cruz and Steer are the only guys who I have faith in to hit around .250.
      Fraley, Friedl, CES and Candy may crack .200. Guys like Benson, Espinol, Maile, Martini have little chance of hitting .200. Bubba Thompson likely won’t get a hit in the Majors again. May not even get one in Double A. And I though Billy Hamilton was a waste of speed …
      Too bad all are potentially decent hitters are in Dayton, 2 years or more away. Giving up on Senzel, despite all the injuries and crybaby attitude, was a huge mistake.

  42. Mike W

    MK, I hear what you’re saying, but how is it EVERY starting player in our batting order seems to have a worse batting average than last year?
    Several were with us last year and a few were on different teams playing for different managers last year. Now they all wear the same uniform and have the same manager.
    What other common denominator do you attribute to all of their performances declining?
    (And unrelated to our hitting Sims is sent down. THAT is his reward for doing so well? That is how management rewards and motivates him? What is going on? Sure doesn’t look right. Management owes their fans an explanation for all that’s happening. Be upfront. Full disclosure. Own it.)

  43. Mike W

    Oops, meant Moll was sent down, not Sims.
    But point is the same. “He’s doing well. Let’s send him down.”
    Let’s score half a dozen runs today!
    Let’s go Reds!

    • David

      We can all agree that sending down Sam Moll, who has generally been pretty effective, was unfair to the man.
      But, in terms of the roster and options, it was about the only logical choice.

      I believe Moll will be back up very soon, as I think there will be some other roster moves made. If he languishes in AAA for months, then this too is an indicator that the TOP MEN who run the Reds are really not that concerned about winning.

      I also note that David Bell is very anxious to get TJ Friedl back. He knows. He knows what is going on. I give him some credit for not openly roasting his players and the team. Regardless of all the “tough love!” philosophy here about “holding players to accountability!”, the players KNOW how bad it has been and really (probably) resent being lambasted in public,
      My problem is that the Reds, as a team, are probably just not that good.
      There are several talented players, some guys who are “league average” and then the rest. And frankly, it is still too early to tell if the pitching is good or bad or just “league average”.
      I hope they start a winning streak tonight. I hope they win a lot of games in May and June, and are in first place in a few weeks. I hope things go great. I want that to happen.
      But hope is not a plan. I think Mr. Krall thought he had more talent than he actually does. I think he hoped he did.

      • Justin T

        When did David Bell roast his players?

      • David

        Well, that was the point. He did not do that publicly. I don’t think that does much except make the manager look like a tough guy.
        I don’t think it really encourages the players to get better. It just builds resentment. They live this every day, they know how bad things are right now.

  44. greenmtred

    He said that he didn’t publicly roast them.

  45. Mauired

    I think Steer said recently in an interview before the sweep (didn’t age well) that the players like the fact that Bell is pretty much the same whether the team wins 10 games in a row or loses 10 games in a row. Is being calm under pressure a good thing? Sure. But there’s also not accepting losing as a normal just fine thing which Bell seems so blaise about. Yeah the franchise has the longest playoff win drought in the world. No big deal. Yeah outside of covid, the franchise has not even won a wild card in over 10 years. No big deal. Yeah 23 franchises have made the playoffs outside of covid besides Reds since I was hired. No big deal. I’d personally like to know when winning is a big deal and requires attention and urgency. Because it always seems a little late or not at all with this team and manager. But like Castellini said “where are you going to go?”