The Cincinnati Reds and Toronto Blue Jays have split the first two games of their series. The winner of today’s contest at Great American Ball Park will grab the series victory. First pitch is set for 1:40pm ET.

Starting Lineups

Toronto Blue Jays

Cincinnati Reds

Whit Merrifield – 2B Stuart Fairchild – RF
Bo Bichette – SS Matt McLain – 2B
Brandon Belt – DH Elly De La Cruz – SS
Vladimir Guerrero Jr. – 1B Spencer Steer – LF
George Springer – RF Joey Votto – DH
Daulton Varsho – LF Christian Encarnacion-Strand – 1B
Matt Chapman – 3B Noelvi Marte – 3B
Danny Jansen – C TJ Friedl – CF
Kevin Kiermaier – CF Luke Maile – C
Hyun Jin Ryu – LHP Hunter Greene – RHP

Starting Pitchers

Pitcher IP ERA WHIP BB K
Hunter Greene 73.1 3.93 1.35 31 100
Hyun Jin Ryu 14.0 2.57 1.07 4 8
Links: Hunter Greene’s Stats | Hyun Jin Ryu’s Stats

Hunter Greene

After missing a little over two months with a hip injury, Greene is back after a good showing on rehab in the minor leagues – including his last outing for Louisville where he allowed one hit in 5.2 innings and struck out nine batters. While in Louisville he threw a splitter in two of his starts (while also throwing his change up).

The splits for Hunter Greene are pretty big. And they are reverse splits. He has dominated lefties and held them to a .618 OPS this season. But right-handed hitters have found success against him and have hit for a good average, a solid on-base percentage, and they’ve hit for a good amount of power against him. Not shown below is that his ERA at home is 5.18 (3.31 on the road) and his OPS against is .851 (.698 on the road).

Splits

Split PA H 2B 3B HR BB K AVG OBP SLG
RHH 169 42 13 1 7 15 47 .276 .349 .513
LHH 149 26 8 1 2 16 53 .200 .295 .323

Pitch Usage

4-Seam Change Slider Splitter
Velo 98.8 91.4 88.2 88.3
Usage 55% 7% 37% 1%

Hyun Jim Ryu

After missing more than a year after undergoing Tommy John surgery in 2022, Hyun Jin Ryu has made three starts for Toronto since his return. The lefty had to exit his August 7th start early after he was hit in the leg by a batted ball, but he returned and didn’t give up an earned run in 5.0 innings against the Cubs in his start last week.

Using splits for him in recent years doesn’t make much sense given he’s missed most of the last two seasons. With that said, for his career lefties and righties don’t perform all that differently against him, with their averages, on-base percentages, and slugging percentages all being within 10 points of the other side.

Pitch Usage (AAA rehab & MLB)

4-seam 2-seam Cutter Curve Change
Velo 88.6 87.9 84.8 70.3 78.0
Usage 41% 7% 11% 16% 25%

When and Where

  • Game time: 1:40pm ET
  • Where: Great American Ball Park
  • Watch: Bally Sports Ohio, MLB.tv (out of market)
  • Listen: 700 WLW AM (Cincinnati area)
  • Forecast: 87°, sunny, 0% chance of rain

News and Notes

Happy Anniversary Ken Griffey Jr.

Standings

Team W L GB Playoff Odds
Brewers 67 57 0.0 85.6%
Reds 64 60 3.0 30.7%
Cubs 63 59 3.0 51.3%
Pirates 55 68 11.5 0.1%
Cardinals 54 70 13.0 0.0%
Playoff Odds via Fangraphs

259 Responses

  1. Wayne Nabors

    Does anyone know how rare this is to have all rookie infield except catcher?has it happened befor or is this a 1st

  2. RedAlert

    Fairchild leading off and Votto batting 5th … Bell would have been better off drawing names out of a hat ….. dude never learns a single thing about lineup construction –
    never has , never will ….. stubborn and
    clueless …. Welcome back Hunter !

    • LDS

      Yeah, whatever he’s smoking must be really good. I haven’t seen anyone hallucinating like this since my college days 50 years ago. Votto should be on the bench. And did Hopkins just vanish from the planet? He didn’t even get to pinch run last night. And maybe Friedl is just batting where he is to provide Marte with protection – yeah that’s the ticket. David Bell knows things.

    • CI3J

      I’d rather have Fairchild leading off than Newman, who Bell usually puts in that position against a lefty.

      It’s actually kind of shocking Newman isn’t playing at all.

      • Old-school

        Newman on the IL with an oblique

        He wont be back anytime soon

        Re-injured pregame the other day

      • Ted Alfred

        Fortunately lady luck smiled on us and resolved the Newman problem of Bell hitting him lead off versus left handers, hopefully forever.

        Unfortunately he has now decided Fairchild would be best to take on that role.

      • LDS

        Friedl is .281 against LH. Fairchild .244. Bell once again nailing those analytics. THREE MORE FREAKING YEARS.

  3. Jim t

    Really want a win today which will give us the series. Love the fact we are playing meaningful games.

  4. LT

    The only way to heal wound from yesterday loss is to win today. Unfortunately we’re up against a lefty. It’s going to be an uphills battle from the first pitch. Having Greene and Marte start generates some buzz ?, hopefully it rubs off on the offense. #gottowintoday.

  5. Moon

    It seems the majority of games the Reds have played lately result in them going down in order in their half of the first inning. Lets hope they can do something different today.

  6. Rob

    When you have a 39-year-old .206 hitter batting fifth, you are not serious about making the playoffs, winning a pennant or using every available lineup spot to develop your young talent.

    What’s left of Votto should be a late-inning pinch hitter in times of desperation when a home run might tie or win it. Let him swing for the fences a few more times and then, hopefully, retire gracefully.

    • Moon

      I am not too concerned about them making the playoffs. If they do, great. What a wonderful bonus. But I like what is happening with the young pups. Play them. Continue to do the sorting and get ready for a better run next year. We may have found a pretty solid starting 5 with Greene, Ashcraft, Lodolo, Williamson and Abbott. And we have some decent pitching talent in the minors that are beginning to look ripe. Reds still have some holes to address but beginning to think we are not that far off. It is a totally different vibe than the end of last year with all that dead weight the Reds were carrying on the roster.

      • Ted Alfred

        There’s one huge piece of dead weight that matters more than any other and they just re-signed that dead weight to three more years…yuck

      • Mark Moore

        +50,000

        That’s where I’ve landed at this point. I’d love to see some October baseball, but I’m very excited about line-ups like today featuring young, talented guys for the next several years.

    • JB

      I watched an interview with Votto the other day and he talked like he had no desire to retire. He said he will play in Cincy or somewhere else next year. Good luck Joey. Hope it’s not here.

      • Mark Moore

        I find that a pretty sad statement, personally. Setting aside his “promise” to the fans, it would seem he’s having trouble coming to grips with the reality of his aging and the change in pace of the game.

  7. MBS

    Why is Fairchild leading off? I don’t complain about the lineup very often, but this is absurd. Friedl is the leadoff hitter, and has a better BA against LHP .281, than he does against RHP .273.

    Newman had equivalent numbers against LHP .278 BA, but Fairchild has a .244 BA against LHP.

    Just set in stone your 1 Friedl, 2 McLain, 3 EDLC, 4 Steer, and make changes elsewhere.

    • AllTheHype

      Bell employs a handedness bias irrespective of a players actual splits, and Fairchild is his personal pet.

    • Old-school

      Fairchild has some pretty significant handedness splits. Against righties, his OPS is .688 with a paltry .299 OBP.

      Against lefties, his OPS is .751 with a good OBP of .361. Speed plus very good OBP against lefties is probably why he is leading off.

      friedl has a .714 OPS against lefties and an OBP of .324.

      • west larry

        Great comment, Old-school. Appreciate the information on Fairchild.

      • MBS

        Do you really think a 37 pt difference in the OPS is reason enough to move your leadoff hitter out of the leadoff spot, to the 8 hole? Fairchild is a part time MLB’er, and Freidl is an everyday starter.

      • Old-school

        @ MBS- I’m a Friedl fan and believe he is a core player and CF outfield piece now and next year. Fairchild is a role player. Im simply pointing out why Bell probably has him leading off.

        Friedl has cooled off considerably since early summer.

        Friedl by half:
        1st half season- .304/.380/.458/.838 OPS+ 131
        2nd half season- .215/.252/.397/.649 OPS +73

      • MBS

        I’m not trying to argue, I know the reasoning behind the move, I just don’t agree with it. Like I said in my 1st comment the 1 – 4 should be set regardless of matchups. If you don’t have your 4 best there, then that’s a different problem that needs to be addressed. For example there are some good arguments that Benson should be apart of the top 4, but this team needs some consistency.

    • Jim Walker

      Friedl’s seasonal creds vs LH are a result of his exceptionally strong start vs LH pitching. Since the All Star break his OPS vs LH pitching has been under .600.

  8. Jim

    I don’t understand either about Votto in the lineup when we are fighting to keep our head above water??
    In my opinion Votto was one of the Reds Best Hitters ever, not overall best player, but best hitter. I have been following the Reds for 60 years. But honestly, he has overextended his right to be in the lineup!
    Sure he loves to play, but Johnny Bench loves to play but when you become a liability to the team you should have enough respect for the team to step aside!

  9. JB

    First Newman and now Fairchild. For the love of God I swear Bell bets on the games. He should bat Votto second . At least get the two worst hitters out of the way early. Now saying that, I hope both go 5-5. Once again Bell puts a slow runner between the 8th and 1st guy. Nothing like clogging the bases. Bat Votto 7th and Maile 8th. Friedl 9th.

  10. Beaufort Red

    On another not hand listened to Grande call Griffey’s inside the park HR. What a refreshing call.

    • Doc4uk

      Anyone else worried that offering an extension for Greene might have been a bit premature?

  11. Indy Red Man

    Freidl is a very solid player, but his obp has fell from .382 to .339 since July 6. Too many balls with air under them. McLain is starting to walk a little bit. That’s how they’ll get going again. See more pitches = see more mistakes

    • Pete

      Yup, he’s hitting more home runs but at a the cost of popping up the ball much more. I think I’d rather see the line drives to be honest with you. We have enough power down the lineup. Creating havoc is Job #1.

    • Jim Walker

      Since the All Star break Friedl’s OBP is .252 that’s total overall OPB for the period. Versus LH pitching it is an even .200, same as his BA vs LH pitching for the same period, i.e. 0 BB as a LH batter in 25PAs before today.

  12. GreatRedLegsFan

    Was there an open spot in the 40-man roster?

  13. Mark A Verticchio

    i will just call it like it is a horrible line up, your 1st and 5th batters have no business in the line up.

    • RedAlert

      Totally agree ! Fairchild playing WAY TOO MUCH and VOTTO needs to just retire period

  14. Daytonnati

    Anybody see Bell’s post-game press conference last night? Marte’s steal of 3rd was news to him. He did not call it. Marte decided to go on his own. Bell said it was “courageous”. Weren’t there two outs? (I can’t remember.) If Marte had been thrown out, would it still have been courageous? Jim Day seemed gobsmacked that that was not a called play.

    I am pretty agnostic on Bell. Like most things it life, he is not as bad nor as good as he is portrayed. But I really did have the feeling that it is the inmates who are running the asylum … I am wondering how Sweet Lou would have reacted to a rookie making his first appearance taking a base-running gamble with the game on the line??

    • Pete

      It was a double steal and only one out. I can’t believe both runners decided on their own to steal a base. I guess anything is possible if not probable.

      • Jim Walker

        Just heads up play by the trail runner to take off when he saw the lead guy go. Those two had a month or so together at Louisville. Maybe they actually had a be ready sign to flash between them from their day at the Bats?

    • VaRedsFan

      There was only 1 out.
      So getting to 3rd was important.
      Bell must not have thought so.

      Since both guys were running, somebody had to call it, or else the guy on first would have stayed.

  15. Mark Moore

    Buckle up, folks. Last chance to watch a full game for me until Wednesday. I really hate West Coast weeks.

  16. JB

    Bichette was half way and stopped. McLain gloves that , he had him in a run down.

  17. Mark Moore

    I thought the LLWS was on ESPN … 😮

  18. JB

    Holy crap. Well you got to expect this with a rookie infield.

  19. VaRedsFan

    Defense slept in this morning….except for Stuey.
    3 misplays.

    • Melvin

      No way that was an error on McLain. Although a tough play I thought Friedl should have caught that one in the first. Marte just purely made a bad throw.

  20. Indy Red Man

    Maybe 1 of these new splitters to Belt? HG still just throws rather then pitches. Have to mix it up a little? Granted McLain should’ve had it, but it was still scorched

  21. Dennis Westrick

    Not to beat a dead horse but I was born and raised in Northern Kentucky so I do know a thing or two about horses!

    Conventional baseball wisdom/strategy calls for a sacrifice bunt when the first 2 batters reach base in the late innings with NO outs!

    Still perplexed that Bell The Brilliant did not have TySteve at least attempt to lay down a sacrifice bunt in the bottom of the 9th in last night’s game. IF successful, you would have runners at 2nd & 3rd with only ONE out AND you would greatly reduce the probability of a double play!

    The other option, of course, is to attempt a double steal.

    Well, neither of those things happened and we all watched the feeble effort by Ramos (Strikeout) with a runner at 3rd.

    In the middle of a playoff run that just can’t happen!

    Hope Bell doesn’t have to make a similar decision today!

    • Mark Moore

      Fear not … HDTBell knows things we don’t and will make decisions as he always does. His own private Magic 8-Ball.

  22. Mark Moore

    Mercifully out of the inning without major damage. Hope any jitters from HG are now in the books. Same for Marte.

    Now to the hitting. Hoping our blind hog leadoff hitter finds his acorn. Him hitting there is 100% on the idiocy of HDTBell from where I sit. It’s why he’s the #50 big league manager out of 30.

    • Dennis Westrick

      New math? That ranking may be too high!

      • Mark Moore

        I’ve been adjusting it downward for a while. When you start at #30 with a bag of rocks and cement cleats … 😛

  23. VaRedsFan

    Anybody know why 3 california teams are off today…
    Several played doubleheaders yesterday.

    • RedsMonk65

      Hurricane/Tropical Storm Hilary hitting Southern California today.

  24. Indy Red Man

    Soft tossing lefty. I’ve seen this movie before.

  25. Mark Moore

    Elly at least went with the pitch and made contact. Chapman had him played perfectly.

  26. VaRedsFan

    Soft tossing lefty means our guys will be trying to pull everything out of the yard.

  27. Dennis Westrick

    We are our own worst enemy! Poor defense, poor base running and poor decision making when batting!

    We are running out of games to catch Milwaukee or pass the other 5 teams vying for a NL Wild Card spot!

    • LDS

      Come on @Dennis, there’s no rush. There’s plenty of time. After all these years, you still don’t see the wisdom of David Bell. You can’t put pressure on these guys. Each in their own time.

  28. VaRedsFan

    Diving slider at 85 with 2 strikes.
    MLB caliber put away pitch.
    Love that from Greene.

    • VaRedsFan

      followed by the hanging slider.
      Not MLB caliber.

  29. dimondfvr

    Does anyone of our statistical gurus on this site know how many times we’ve come to bat in the bottom of the first this season, already trailing in the ballgame? That is the assignment before the end of today’s ballgame. No looking at your neighbor’s analytical papers!

    • JB

      A good start would be to look at Weavers games

  30. JB

    They are tattooing Hunter today. Might need 7 or 8 runs to win today. Offense can’t get that.

  31. Mark Moore

    3-run hole early. Welcome, Hunter. But we’ve all seen this movie before … and recently.

  32. Old-school

    Greene is pitching to contact!!!

    • Ted Alfred

      Honestly this looks like a few of his starts earlier this year. He just doesn’t have good enough control…hangs too many breaking balls and he’s never been able to locate his fastball well enough within the zone. He has always had more strikes in the middle of the plate and not enough on the corners. Until that changes he’ll never be close to a #1…more like a #3.

  33. Indy Red Man

    Oh if we can only hang in there til the mighty Hunter Greene gets back.

  34. RedAlert

    Wow Greene throwing batting practice

    • Melvin

      Is that Weaver disguised as Hunter Greene? 🙂

      • Oldtimer

        Nope. Weaver helped the Reds win 12 of his 21 starts.

      • Harry Stoner

        Yep.

        Check how many of those games Weaver was taken out with the Reds trailing.

        Game logs are available for those interested.

        Weaver was credited with a total of two (2) wins.

        You can make things up, but that doesn’t mean they are true.

  35. LT

    HG is getting hammered. No movement in his 4 seamer. Probably need to throw the slider or his 3rd pitch, whatever that is.

  36. Mark Moore

    It dawns on me that somebody had to replace Dream Weaver what with giving up a bunch of runs and providing the opportunity for a mighty come-from-behind win.

    Rough afternoon ahead on the banks of the Ohio.

  37. Indy Red Man

    Anyone that starts our future rotations with HG, etc etc etc.

    Just know you’re wrong. He’ll never be the best pitcher on this staff. If he is then we’re threatening 100 Ls again

    • VaRedsFan

      He was until he left injured.
      Recency bias much?

  38. LT

    Another 99mph fastball hit for a HR. Shm

  39. Bet on Red

    Is luke Farrell still available…. lol

  40. Mark Moore

    Crew Chief review … does that mean we lose our challenge? I’m thinking not.

  41. west larry

    He needed this start.Take him out SOON.

  42. MBS

    Well I guess the lineup isn’t the big problem today, bad defense, and the long ball seems to be the bugaboo.

    • RedAlert

      Get the dude out the game …. Just pitiful

    • Doc

      Isn’t the defense part of the lineup?

      • Melvin

        The offense isn’t exactly scoring a lot of runs either. As a matter of fact there isn’t a whole lot working in any aspect of the game for the Reds today.

  43. Mark Moore

    Hit – Homer – Strikeout …

    Is that today’s pattern for the Jays?

  44. LDS

    With apologies to Ray Charles – “Oh it’s clete’ing time again, I’m gonna leave you”.

  45. Mark Moore

    Oddly enough, I’m not tempted to Clete today (at least not yet). Nothing else to watch. Perhaps I’ll just put away the laptop and take a little Sunday afternoon snooze 😉

  46. LarkinPhillips

    So glad that nothing is going to change, for the next three years. Middle of a playoff race and there is absolutely no sense of urgency. Team came out flat after blowing a chance to win yesterday. Two errors and weak grounder in the first.

    • Mark Moore

      That’s the most discouraging aspect of all of this. I can take us not getting there in 2023. Didn’t expect to to start with. But knowing we face another 3 seasons of HDTBell and this ownership group’s shenanigans, it’s very hard to be a loyal Reds fan.

      • LarkinPhillips

        Exactly. I don’t mind us missing the playoffs. I just don’t want to watch Bell do dumb stuff for another 3 years. It’s ridiculous to get a 3 year extension for one good month or so stretch after being awful for so long.

  47. Tom Mitsoff

    If you’re wondering what’s going on, Greene has thrown twice as many fastballs other pitches combined. When you can guess as a hitter and be 67 percent right, things will go well more times than not.

    • Mark Moore

      +5,000

      Apparently rumors of mixing it up and a new pitch were unfounded.

  48. dimondfvr

    We need to look at the bright side?….The infielders and outfielders are getting a lot of work!!!???? LOL

    • Indy Red Man

      All the OFs test their strength training by bouncing off the wall

  49. LT

    Please pull him. He’s afraid to throw his secondary pitches. Threw a slider and got a strike but then threw 5 straight fastballs.

  50. Indy Red Man

    Wheres the changeup or this new splitter? It’s a travesty how they think high velocity alone makes a good starter. Fastball straight as an arrow and the slider hangs more then it bites usually. He has nothing else?

    • LT

      He threw the change up once and got a foul ball. Either Maile didn’t call for more change up or HG shook him off because he felt more comfortable throwing cheese.

    • Mark Moore

      He will. We here on RLN may not … 😀

      But he will.

  51. Old-school

    Holy cow the blue jays can hit a fastball

    Springer/Bichette/ guerrero/belt/chapman/merrifield

    They got SP and a bullpen

    They are legit

    Reds need another 2 big bats next year.

  52. RedAlert

    Joey is awful at this point … it’s ashamed

    • Mark Moore

      Careful … the ardent supporters will say he still contributes. Just not lately very much.

  53. Indy Red Man

    CES is trending well! I think we might make it a game if they get tired of lapping the bases

  54. gusnwally

    I honestly believe I could have put a better swing on that pitch that Joey struck out -on. By the way, I am 76 and have an oxygen tank in one hand and tubes up my nose.

  55. Mark Moore

    More LL-style ball … and this time it’s the Jays!!

    Nice bluff by Steer to get them all wound up.

  56. RedsMonk65

    A little chaos to stir the pot. Two runs score. Let’s see if we can hang in.

  57. Melvin

    Talk about a gift. Thank you VERY MUCH for that poor defense and giving us two runs. CES made a bad decision and should have been out easily.

  58. Indy Red Man

    RF not backing up the throw gifts us a run.
    I don’t think our OF was backing up last inning either. Hustle shouldn’t be in question with 2 “playoff” teams

  59. Melvin

    That was not E3 on that last play. Friedl would have beat it out anyway.

  60. LT

    Got 2 runs out of a fly ball? Marte must be the good luck charm. TJ can hit lefty, at least recently. No need to pull him from lead off spot against LHP

    • Melvin

      No there’s not. He can always bunt if nothing else.

    • Ted Alfred

      Yep Marte hit a weak pop fly to short left on a 3-2 pitch, but at least he didn’t strike out… made them make a play and they blew it and gave us two runs. If he strikes out those runs don’t score… that’s why they’ve got to start putting the ball in play more often. Every game with 10+ K’s ain’t gonna get it.

  61. VaRedsFan

    Our best offensive play is them throwing the ball away

  62. JB

    Apparently nobody can play defense today.

  63. Mark Moore

    Did Stewie smack his noggin on that crash into the wall? Replay kind of looked that way. Makes me wonder how long we’ll play a man short on the roster before he gets replaced (assuming they eventually put him on the IL or concussion protocol list.

    • Jim Walker

      The concussion list is 7 days. If the guy doesn’t pass the protocol by the 7th day, he rolls to the 10 day.

      I would think if a guy has concussion symptoms it would be mandatory to do the diagnostic protocol and declare him at that point if he fails the protocol. However it can be done retroactively per this link.

      https://www.mlb.com/glossary/injuries/7-day-injured-list

  64. Mark Moore

    Slider for a K … how about that (HT: Mel Allen).

    • LT

      I know. He needs to do what Ashcraft does, even mix of slider and fastball and throws in a change up here and there. Ashcraft has success throwing 2 pitches, HG can have success too.

  65. Mark Moore

    Clean inning is much appreciated on multiple fronts.

  66. Mark Moore

    Attaboy, Hopkins. Keep your bat on your shoulder like the others. Too bad all you’ve gotten to date is the standard batting practice time rather than game experience.

    But he’s getting paid MLB salary and meal money at least.

    • RedAlert

      Fits right in don’t he ! … awful AB , standing up there star gazing

    • JB

      Can’t really complain. The guy never plays.

    • Melvin

      Hopkins doesn’t look to me to have the confidence to play in the major leagues.

      • Hanawi

        Yeah. He has not looked close to ready at all.

      • Melvin

        Why they even brought him up I have no idea.

  67. LT

    Let’s chip away here, a run or two here will give HG more confidence pitching next inning.

  68. Mario

    From Twitter’s home run report

    Brandon Belt, HR (12)

    8/20/23 @ CIN, 2nd
    vs RHP Hunter Greene

    87.6 MPH / 33° / 344 ft to RF
    Off a 99.4 MPH four-seam fb

    It’s a home run in 5/30 parks.
    (Only in CIN, CLE, HOU, NYY, SEA.)

    • Indy Red Man

      No way is that gone in Cleveland with that wall.

  69. Mario

    Kevin Kiermaier, HR (6)

    8/20/23 @ CIN, 2nd
    vs RHP Hunter Greene

    97.0 MPH / 40° / 354 ft to RF
    Off a 85.3 MPH slider

    It’s a home run in 22/30 parks.

  70. Indy Red Man

    I’m out. That’s just dumb pitching. Fb out over the plate again. He just had decent offspeed last inning

    • Ted Alfred

      It’s been Hunter Greene’s problem his entire Major League career so far. Can’t throw good off speed pitches for strikes consistently to keep them off balance, while far too many fastballs are right over the middle of the plate. If he doesn’t develop his control much, much better to where he is hitting the inside/outside corners/high and low/ in and out throwing the fastball for pitchers strikes vs hitters strikes he’s never going to be anything other than average at this level.

      I’m sure David Bell has a reason to not even try to win this game, but why is it that he basically let Greene pitch us completely out of the game by the 4th inning where when the other starting pitchers are actually pitching WELL with similar pitch counts he pulls them out immediately if they give up a walk or one base hit? Why are the standards so different for Greene vs the rest of the staff? I assume we’re trying to win this game just as we’re trying to win the other games, so what’s the damn difference?? It was obvious to anybody after the 2nd inning his stuff was terrible.

  71. RedAlert

    Candy pitch on a silver platter ….
    That’s terrible pitching

  72. JB

    Walked out of the room. Walked back in to another homer.

  73. LT

    Another Hr off fastball. What will it take for Maile and Greene to learn that FB is not cuttting it today?

  74. west larry

    Do we have to let Greene throw 90 pitches? He’s a good pitcher, but not today

  75. JB

    Brandon Belt loves Reds pitching. Deja Vu

  76. Bet on Red

    This is just home run practice now

  77. RedAlert

    Even worse …. Unbelievably bad Greene

  78. RedsMonk65

    Ahem…Mr. Manager. It is time to take Hunter out of the game. Please.

    • Melvin

      Naaaaaw!!! It’s not like we’re in a pennant race. Let him pitch and get his confidence back. We’re only seven runs down in the fourth inning (and counting) anyway.

  79. Melvin

    I guess the idea that we didn’t need pitching help at the deadline because we have Greene and Lodolo coming back is not looking too good at the moment.

  80. RedAlert

    Just started his bullpen now …. That’s
    awesome game awareness and urgency Bell

  81. Soto

    I’m really disappointed in what I’m seeing from Greene. From the reports that I had heard, I was expecting him to mix in some splitters. All I am seeing is the Greene that we have seen over the last couple of years. He throws hard with very limited movement, has a good slider, but doesn’t have a quality change of speed pitch. He has no deception in his delivery and hitters seem to pick up the ball very well out of his hand. If he has great accuracy and pinpoints his fastball, he is effective, if he doesn’t, he gets hit hard. I’m afraid if he doesn’t develop that splitter, change-up, or some other quality change of speed, he is never going to be a top of the rotation starter. He is not inexperienced or overly young. Everyone says he’s young, be patient, but I just haven’t seen the type of develop that I have been hoping for.

    • Melvin

      He just didn’t have it today for whatever reason(s). We left him in there anyway to give up NINE runs in less than four innings. Sometimes I think David Bell just gets “stunned” then freezes before making a move. In game management is not his strength to say the least.

      • Tom Reeves

        I think it was about Greene eating as many innings as possible to save the BP a couple of innings. If course, Greene didn’t make it 4 innings. Bad day all around for the Reds.

      • Melvin

        Except we’re in a pennant race. That could be past tense soon the way we’re going. smh You can have the best talent with the best rookies in the world but there are no guarantees you will get this close again. We haven’t won in so long and just keep on talking about “next year”. smh We’re just BLOWING IT…..again.

      • Tom Reeves

        That’s probably a total surprise to the Reds and David Bell. I’m guessing he doesn’t know.

  82. Mark Moore

    So … I’ve made myself a snack (fresh guacamole) and I’m thinking it’s time to bow out. Seems like we should be in the 8th by now. Perhaps I’ll watch whatever LLWS game is showing.

    Rough week ahead. Not looking forward to it no matter how much I get to watch.

  83. west larry

    I think Greene has a 90-pitch limit today. He may reach that this inning.

  84. Melvin

    Talk about ridiculous. This is just playing HR derby.

  85. RedsMonk65

    OK. Clete. I have better things to do.

  86. Indy Red Man

    Well that’s it for Hopkins cause here comes auto out Casali back to hold HG’s binky for him and put him down for nappy tome

    • Indy Red Man

      Bell could actually take the kid out and not try to ruin him mentally?

      • Doc

        He’s got $50MM guaranteed. He needs to pitch like he deserves it, not get his feelings hurt.

  87. Soto

    But at least Bell and Greene will tell us how they felt good about his start and they saw some good things.

    • Ted Alfred

      I mean, how do the Bell defenders watch something like this and not understand how terrible of a manager he really is? He gave up any chance of trying to win a really important game by the 4th… and as an added benefit totally destroyed Greene’s confidence… what other manager in baseball would have handled this situation like this?

      • LarkinPhillips

        Bell defenders: as usual this on the players.

        The rest of us: it’s a new set of players yet again doing the exact same things that have happened since 2020 playoffs.

      • Tom Reeves

        Because he has a team of rookies somehow in a pennant race. That’s the hallmark of a terrible manager.

      • Melvin

        I’d say it’s more like the rookies have David Bell in a pennant race and he’s not doing a great job helping them.

  88. Hanawi

    Greene can’t succeed without mixing in something off-speed more often. His fastball is too straight. It’s not Mariano’s cutter or anything.

    • VaRedsFan

      Hunter Greene is ranked 24th in ALL OF BASEBALL in horizontal movement of 4 seam fastball

      • Hanawi

        That’s not really that great when it’s the majority of what he throws and there is almost no vertical movement, which, to me, is the much more difficult problem for hitters. The ball staying in one plane of hitting is much easier even if it is moving horizontally.

  89. RedBB

    Hunter Greene doing his best Luke Weaver impression..so much talent but can’t locate.

    • Doc

      Talent can locate. There are hundreds of pitchers who can’t locate.

  90. Mark A Verticchio

    This is the beginning of the end, by the time they return home it will all be about next year.

  91. Randoxu1

    The kiss of death is when Greene did a jake Sweeney commercial just like 3M. I’m glad the the front office was banking on him coming back, not.

    • RedBB

      LOL ya. Funny thing is Moustakas has been decent this year. OPS+ of 103

  92. LT

    You think about worst case scenario and then you have this happen, beyond any worst case scenario anyone can fathom. He did all those rehab starts and all the reports sounded very rosy. And then this happened. At 5-2 the game is not out of reach by any stretch of imagination and then threw it away.

  93. west larry

    I think The Reds need to score about 12 more runs to be competitive in this game.

  94. Mark A Verticchio

    64 and 61 most likely a game out of wild card, I look for a 3 and 7 road trip. The truth is they have played poorly since the Bell extension, coincidence, you decide.

    • Ted Alfred

      Actually, assuming the loss today they are 15-22 since they were truly in playoff contention, starting with the Brewers series before the break when they were 10 over .500. That’s a dreadful .405 winning percentage since. Seems David Bell’s fantastic decisions as to lineups, batting orders, pitching/bullpen usage haven’t worked out too well. Apparently he’s pushing a lot of the wrong buttons. I would have to guess a different manager making very different decisions as to lineups/batting orders/Bullpen decisions etc would be getting very different results…although the Bell Defenders would have you believe it’s all on the players and the managers don’t matter. Like when he decided to start Nick Senzel for game 2 in Chicago after winning 3 of the previous 4 in LA and the opener vs the Cubs. He then started Senzel seven of the next the nine games after he complained about his playing time in which the Reds went 0-7 and sent the Reds into a tailspin from which they haven’t recovered…. fantastic decision by Bell. We see what happened to Senzel afterward…guessing the guys in the clubhouse weren’t on board with that stupidity. The only thing he’s good at is managing a below average team that has no expectations. Once that dynamic changes he is in over his head managing a talented team that actually has post-season aspirations. Welcome to the next 3 years of wasted opportunity.

      • Doc

        Bell’s dreadful decision to injure India and IL him.
        Bell’s dreadful decision to injure Fraley and IL him.
        Ditto Greene.
        Ditto Lodolo.
        Ditto Ashcraft.
        Ditto, ditto, ditto.

        There are very few teams in this league that can stand the extended loss of most of their starting rotation, and several of their starters, and still compete.

        It’s just not a problem for some people when facts get in the way of a preferred theory. They stick to the theory anyway.

  95. Votto4life

    Preview of next Friday’s headline: “Hunter Greene is much better in second outing”.

  96. LT

    The risk of 2-pitch pitchers is when one of their pitches is off, they are dead in the water. Ashcraft went through a stretch where he was hit as hard as Greene today. Little margin for error when hitters have 50% chance of guessing the right pitch. If Ashcraft and Greene don’t develop 3rd pitch, abbot and Williamson will be Reds top pitchers. I need to see Lodolo pitch more to know who he really is.

    • Ted Alfred

      Look at the difference for Williamson this year in his own words once he developed an effective cutter which he didn’t have before this year. Greene is going to have to put in the time and develop a really effective 3rd pitch like a change, cutter etc or this is who he is.

  97. Beaufort Red

    Greene and our rookies both are products of misleading minor league stats. Rarely do minor leaguers see fastballs like Greene’s. In the majors it’s called batting practice. Rarely do position players see efficient breaking balls or quality out if strike zone pitches. They see mostly average pitches from throwers. In the majors they’re easy pickings for quality pitchers. Throwers vs pitchers

  98. west larry

    We’ve kept them under double digits s far. I wonder if we can borrow the angels rally-monkey?

  99. Hanawi

    Feels like soft-tossing lefties have been the Reds’ Achilles heel for about a decade now.

  100. Hanawi

    I was all on-board (and still am) about bringing EDLC and CES up and letting them learn in the big leagues, but I don’t think Marte was ready.

    • VaRedsFan

      He didn’t dominate AAA like the others did.
      And then to say the 3B job is his going forward is even more baffling.

      I’d like to think he’d at least have to earn it.

  101. Jim Walker

    Sitting here wondering who gets the call if Stu goes on the concussion/ IL list??? One of the prodigals, Barrero or Senzel; or, perhaps Micheal Siani who is also on the 40 man and toiling at AAA.

    • Hanawi

      I’d love to see them bring up Dunn, an actual OF, even if that means dropping one of those guys off the 40 man.

      • Jim Walker

        Forgot about Fraley. I believe he is eligible but I’m am not big on a guy trying to play through injury that is eventually going to require surgery. While we don’t know that India is going to require surgery, it didn’t work out well for the team or him when he tried to play through for at least a month.

    • MBS

      In a weird way that might be the opening Casali needs to get back. We’d have Benson, Friedl, Hopkins, Ramos already in the OF with Steer also being a factor. The infield is set with Marte, EDLC, McLain, CES, Votto, and Steer being a factor there as well.

    • Melvin

      Might as well be Siani if he’s going to play as much as Hopkins. He WOULD play more if for no other reason than he hits left.

  102. LT

    Greene is a thrower whereas Ryne Hu a pitcher. Albeit it does not take much to fool Reds hitters.

  103. VaRedsFan

    Reds needed a win and we wanted Greene to deliver, and he didn’t.

    But I don’t think it’s cause to crucify the guy on here.
    He was the Red’s best pitcher when he went down with injury.
    Sure, he has warts to iron out.
    Try to remember he is only 200 innings into his career.

    • Melvin

      He had a bad day. The crime is leaving him in there.

      • RedBB

        Why? So the BP can be even more overused? Even at 5-2 our chances of winning were very slim…

      • Melvin

        Down 5-2 early in the game is not that bad when you’re in a pennant race.

    • Rob

      Good advice on Greene’s mlb experience. Wish you could have whispered that to Krall the last part of July. Might not have made any difference with the hitting of late though. Think the Scherzer opportunity was the one we should have swung for the fences. Playoff caliber pitcher down the stretch. Understand it would have taken Arroyo plus. But 1.5 years of Max with this young staff?

  104. MBS

    I’m not super concerned about Greene’s 1st outing being a clunker. His arm looks good, his location could use some work. 23 is all but over, this team is gassed, let’s just get these guys in a good position to excel in 24.

    • RedBB

      Hope you are right but he has displayed with lack of location in the past quite often.

    • Soto

      MBS, I wished I shared your optimism about Greene. He just turned 24 and has been a professional since he graduated high school. I am very disappointed that this organization has not helped him develop a quality off-speed pitch. He has been in the organization for 5 years. Very few successful starting pitchers only have two quality pitches, especially when one of those isn’t a cutter or 2-seam with nasty movement.

      • Ted Alfred

        Honestly I’ll bet you the way he pitches now is eerily similar to how he pitched in high school when he just overwhelmed all those High School hitters with 100 mph fastballs and a slider and that was it….but back then nobody could catch up to it. I don’t understand how he couldn’t have developed better off speed pitches in 5 years in this organization.

  105. Soto

    I think Barrero will get the call. It may be his last opportunity to stick with the Reds.

    • Hanawi

      You may be right, but I’ve gotten the feeling that we’ve seen the last of both Senzel and Barrero on the Reds.

    • Beaufort Red

      Where’s he gonna play? He’s behind EDLC and McClain at SS and Friedl is probably our most consistent hitter and best defensive outfielder.

      • Jim Walker

        McLain is probably anchored at 2B for most if not all of the remainder of the season. They can swing Steer in there for a necessary day off for McLain; but, essentially they have only the 2 middle infielders with India and Newman gone. Still that wouldn’t translate into much PT for Barrero unless someone else got hurt.

  106. RedBB

    MLB umps are such overpaid Garbage. We need to fire them all and go to Robo Umps already…yeesh

  107. RedAlert

    Send Hopkins back to AAA … he can stand there and watch pitches go by there just as well …. Can’t play at this level … SWING THE BAT !!!!!

    • RedBB

      Hopkins eye was WAY better than that overpaid Ump…that called strike 3 was 4 inches off the plate.

    • bug

      >>>SWING THE BAT !!!!!

      Thank you!!! Someone needs to say it.

  108. Protime

    Paying the price for numerous disastrous decisions: Bell’s extension, standing pat on the pre and trade deadline decision. Consistently poor lineup order, the inability to play fundamentally sound baseball to execute actions, i.e., bunting to advance runners or hitting sacrifice flys, etc, productive outs that keeps you competitive with your opponent. No, we don’t already have the players we need to be a legitimate contender. That option was not exercised when we had the opportunity and momentum. The present was squandered for the mantra of the future looks bright…

    • LarkinPhillips

      +1000. I am genuinely worried that we are more the second coming of the white sox rather than the second coming of the orioles. Each had a strong core and strong farm system. Ones window never really opened and fell apart, while the other has the best record in baseball right now.

  109. LarkinPhillips

    Guy is throwing 86 mph fastballs and has 7 strikeouts through 5. It’s absurd how watching these guys make adjustments and improve in AAA has went out the window. It’s all or nothing suddenly again (just like our collapse in 2021) there is no way some or most of the blame doesn’t fall on the coaching staff.

    • RedBB

      Add to that an Umpire that is extending the Strikezone by 6 inches helps.

  110. LT

    2 on nó out and went down quietly. Sounds so familiar right? 9 inning last night. Hopkins and Elly looked at 3rd strike again. Elly is still fooled by the curveball. Such slow learner.

  111. RedAlert

    7 whiffs and counting … lot of game left too …. Reds hitters can’t put the ball in play … terrible

    These dudes average double digit strikeouts almost every game , doesn’t matter who’s pitching it seems like

    • bug

      You got that right!!! And they seem like they could care less. There is zero shame when a player strikes out half of his at bats, or more. Most of the time Elly is an automatic Whiff!!! Reds need a new hitting coach. And they need to let some of these players know that constantly striking out is NOT okay.

  112. Melvin

    Probably doesn’t mean anything but Barrero not in the lineup today.

    • Jim Walker

      We need a spy at the Des Moines airport (or wherever a person catches connector flights out of Des Moines.) 😉

      • Melvin

        Louisville is becoming less and less interesting to watch. Need to bring some more prospects up there. 🙂

      • Jim Walker

        @Melvin>>> I agree about interest in the Bats. Not the same watching career 4A guys as legit MLB rehabbing guys and prospects.

        Folks are telling me the AA Lookouts are a good watch right now though. I watched them quite a bit the year Greene started there. Think Lodolo was there a little later too. All and all it is still pretty good baseball to watch. Some of the TV production in the AA ranks isn’t as good but then the Bats don’t have the most sophisticated home TV setup either.

      • Melvin

        Maybe I will start watching the Lookouts a little Jim. By the way Barrero did make it into the game today.

  113. Doc

    Welcome back to the big leagues, Mr. Greene.
    Where is Luke Weaver when you need him?

  114. DataDumpster

    Maybe a little hope for the Reds. They are replacing that 80 mph phenom pitcher that the Reds couldn’t even tag for 1 earned run. He was pretty crafty and our crew seemed befuddled at best. Lots of whiffs. As Quick Draw McGraw used to say: “Exit Stage Left.”

  115. LarkinPhillips

    Yet again runner on second and no outs that we can’t even get to third. Terrible fundamental baseball per usual.

  116. Bow Red

    Roomful of cranky old Reds fans. SMDH

    Come on! The fact that this team is even in the fringe of the playoff mix is gravy this year.

    Frustration is understandable after our hopes got lifted before the ASB, but this team was never really ready for a stretch run.
    I’m okay with withholding judgement until 2024. The Reds Fans Lament– wait until next year.

  117. Dennis Westrick

    Beginning to believe the Reds made a HUGH mistake signing HG to a long-term multi-million dollar contract! The only pitch he seems to be able to throw for an infrequent strike is a fastball with little or NO horizontal OR vertical movement! Nine (9) runs, 5 HRs, 4 walks, 90 pitches in 3 innings is light years from a Quality Start! Maybe they should bring back Weaver!

    Guess what Boys & Girls, ML hitters feast on fastballs that are often straight, belt high and predictable in the count!

    Today’s blowout is another reason why last night’s 9th inning disaster and subsequent loss was doubly important!

    Hate to rag on Bell, but I have NO confidence that this, or next year’s team, will make the postseason under his “guidance”!

    Oh well, my Irish play their first NCAA football game in 6 days!

    • Jim Walker

      Those Irish better be good and ready for September 23 when the Buckeyes visit South Bend. The Buckeyes are not going to be fooled or dazzled by the trick uniforms the Irish are allegedly going to be wearing. 😉

      • Jim Walker

        Of course if the Irish wore blue helmets with a couple of golden stripes from front to back, the Buckeyes defense might forget everything they’d planned to do in the game 😉

  118. Dennis Westrick

    Another double-digit (11 so far) strikeout game for the Reds “hitters” I see! Maybe a visit to a local eye doctor is in order?

  119. LT

    So Hopkins looked at strike 3 three times today? Is it really real?

    • LT

      He must be boycotting Bell or something. It can’t be real.

    • RedAlert

      Dude has punched his bus ticket back to Louisville with this outstanding performance ….doesn’t need to be up here any more this year

      But he ain’t alone , 11 whiffs and counting …. Reds need a new hitting coach immediately …. This is ridiculous , Reds with double digit Ks on a regular basis

      • doofus

        I would think that all these young guys should learn the strike zone better with more experience. I do not think the hitting coach is at fault here. Hitting coach needs to put food on the table for his family.

    • Melvin

      I’m thinking this is his last day in the majors at least for this year.

  120. Xman84

    It’s fashionable to lob stones at D. Bell here, but shouldn’t some of the blame for our lousy pitching performances this season be directed toward the Reds “Director of Pitching”, Derek Johnson? Reds may not have the most talented hurlers in the game, but shouldn’t some of these guys be improving? He’s been in the big job for nearly two seasons and from where I sit we’re spinning ours or even regressing. Comments?

  121. Beaufort Red

    The body language of certain players stinks. Not naming names. Pretty obvious. Opposite of the winning, never give up attitude shown earlier.

  122. doofus

    Friedl trying to hit it out instead- ends up with fly ball out to CF. He should be making contact, get a single to keep the line moving.

  123. doofus

    Friedl looks like a solid 4th outfielder as the evaluators said he would be. This looks especially true after our esteemed colleagues on this forum revealed his 2nd half stats this season.

    Offseason needs: Find an assassin with the bat that can play a corner outfield spot, an everyday centerfielder and a decent defender behind the plate.

    • Jim Walker

      I think Friedl’s greatest shortcoming as a CF is that his arm is not quick enough, long enough, or accurate enough. His range is probably borderline for a CF; but, despite his issue at the wall today, he typically catches balls he gets his glove on which counts for a lot.

      A CF who brings elite defense across the board can skate by with an OPS+ in the 90s which Friedl can probably do if he gets back to contact swings. However, I don’t think his defense is quite up to being elite.

      • Melvin

        EDLC looks like a great third baseman. However, judging by what I’ve seen so far, I think I’d much rather try him in CF than keep him at SS (not that he’s terrible there). A good centerfielder like you mentioned is extremely valuable and hard to find. As we all know we have plenty of infielders now and coming up relatively soon.

  124. Jeremiah

    Think they brought back Greene at least one start too early i think.
    Hopefully he picks it up. I think the offense is more concerning to me. Just seems they hit a wall. I think defense is better with McClain at ss and Elly at 3b too…not sure Marte at 3b makes the team better defensivle. I am excited to see how he hits. But as someone said not sure they should hand him the 3B job right away.

    Losing India and Fraley might be too much to overcome offensively…really mainly Fraley I think though. Though if India was really healthy he could have been a spark possibly too.

    You look at the “veterans” and they in many ways have been disappointments, not all their own fault sometimes because of injury. But little veteran production when needing it most. I don’t think there’s one position player or starting pitcher veteran that will have had a full productive season statistical season…such as a Starter going 175 innings, position player playing 130-145 games or so.

    • Jon

      What veterans? India and Stephenson are only in their 3rd season, the second of which was filled with injuries for both. Fraley has already had more ABs this year than any previous year, and he’s a platoon hitter. Votto is still above average, though anything is a bonus given that he’s coming back from major injury and is on the verge of retirement. Newman was never expected to be anything more than just average. Myers was another one of Krall’s dumpster diving reclamation projects. And Senzel hasn’t done anything since his rookie 2019 season.

      Pitching-wise, the only veteran is (was) Weaver. Enough said.

  125. Bill J

    The way it looks they need more than just a hitting coach, a new manager and coaching staff.

  126. Andrew Brewer

    37 games left to make a statement. Remember that it ain’t over until it’s over …

    • Melvin

      “Remember that it ain’t over until it’s over …”

      Seems like I’ve heard that somewhere before. 😉