The Reds will try to salvage a series win versus the Marlins in today’s matinee at GABP which wraps up the current homestand. Fortunately for the Reds the Brewers were also defeated on Tuesday night; so, the Reds lost no ground to them. However the Cubs won to pull abreast of the Reds for 2nd place in the NL Central.
Starting Lineups
| MARLINS
SP: Johnny Cueto |
REDS
SP: Graham Ashcraft |
| 1. Jorge Soler (DH) 2. Luis Arraez (2B) 3. Josh Bell (1B) 4. Jazz Chisholm Jr. (CF) 5. Bryan De La Cruz (LF) 6. Avisail Garcia (RF) 7. Jake Burger (3B) 8. Jacob Stallings (C) 9. Jon Berti (SS) |
1. Elly De La Cruz (SS) 2. T.J. Friedl (CF) 3. Matt McLain (2B) 4. Spencer Steer (LF) 5. Joey Votto (1B) 6. Christian Encarnacion-Strand (DH) 7. Tyler Stephenson (C) 8. Nick Senzel (3B) 9. Stuart Fairchild (RF) |
Starting Pitchers
| Pitcher | IP | ERA | WHIP | BB% | K% |
| Johnny Cueto (R) | 22.0 | 5.32 | 0.96 | 7.1% | 21.2% |
| Graham Ashcraft (R) | 113.0 | 5.18 | 4.46 | 9.1% | 16.4% |
| Links: Graham Ashcraft’s Stats | Johnny Cueto’s Stats |
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Graham Ashcraft
Ashcraft makes his sixth start since the All Star break today. He has compiled an ERA/ FIP of 2.30/4.90 in the previous five. However despite his efforts, the Reds are only 2-3 in those games. Ashcraft’s last start, versus the Nationals, was shaping up as gem when it crashed upon the the rocks via a 2 run, 2 out home run after 2 men had been retired to open the 8th inning. The HR knotted the game at 3. The Nats then scored 3 runs against Alexis Diaz in extra innings to win.
The Reds need a similar shutdown effort today from Ashcraft minus the shattering ending.
Splits DONE
| Split | PA | H | 2B | 3B | HR | BB | K | AVG | OBP | SLG |
| RHH | 259 | 68 | 11 | 2 | 9 | 26 | 39 | .304 | .388 | .491 |
| LHH | 236 | 52 | 8 | 1 | 8 | 19 | 42 | .244 | .315 | .404 |
Ashcraft has pronounced reverse handedness splits.
Pitch Usage DONE
| Sinker | Cutter | Slider | |
| Velo | 96.6 | 96.1 | 88.2 |
| Usage | 9.4% | 51.9% | 37.6% |
Developing a true off speed pitch like a change up or curve would make a good off season project for Ashcraft and possibly elevate him to the next level as an MLB starter.
Johnny Cueto
Old friend and long time Reds mainstay Johnny Cueto faces the Reds today 8 years and 4 teams since his storied run with the Reds ended. During the offseason leading up to 2023, Cueto was fan favorite to be a Reds free agent target. However instead of finding his way “home” to the Reds, Cueto signed with the Marlins.
Nostalgia aside, this turned out to be a good thing for the Reds since Cueto made only one appearance for the Marlins before a 3 month period on the IL. Today marks just his third appearance and second start since returning to the mound after the All Star break.
| Split | PA | H | 2B | 3B | HR | BB | K | AVG | OBP | SLG |
| RHH | 36 | 6 | 2 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 6 | .188 | .278 | .344 |
| LHH | 49 | 9 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 3 | 12 | .196 | .245 | .457 |
Cueto appears to be handedness neutral except for slugging %. LH hitters have tagged him for 4 HR vs only 1 allowed to RH hitters to create the skew in favor of LH hitters.
Pitch Usage
| 4-Seam | Cutter | Sinker | Change | Slider | |
| Velo | 92.1 | 88.9 | 92.0 | 83.8 | 86.1 |
| Usage | 40.4% | 15.1% | 13.9% | 15.9% | 14.7 |
Cueto has added a cutter and sinker since his tenure with the Reds. Along with his 4 seamer, he is using this varying fastball arsenal on nearly 70% of his pitches. His use of his fabled change up and slider is about the same proportions as in his peak years with the Reds.
Bullpens
REDS
Lucas Sims is the only Reds pitcher to have worked consecutive nights coming into today’s matinee but has thrown a combined total of only 7 pitches in those two appearances. Alex Diaz last worked on Monday throwing 22 pitches but should be available today. Sam Moll, Buck Farmer, Fernando Cruz and Derek Law threw about a dozen pitches each on Tuesday and will probably be available to do the same today.
Marlins
Tan Scott has worked both Monday and Tuesday for the Marlins throwing a total of 34 pitches. He would figure to be unavailable today. David Robertson threw 18 pitches on Tuesday; and given the short turnaround is likely unavailable today.
News Worth Noting
Got a few minutes before the game starts? You can check out how things went last night down on the Reds farm at Reds Minor Leagues
It went into the books as a triple and E-4; but the guys in dugout decided Stu deserved to wear the helmet and cape for this exciting escapade last night anyway.
RUN STU RUN@stustuuu pic.twitter.com/xExeYFkcFB
— Cincinnati Reds (@Reds) August 9, 2023
Where and When
- Time: 12:35 pm EDT
- Place: Great American Ball Park
- Weather: 80 degrees, partly sunny, 15% percent chance of precipitation
- TV: Bally Sports Ohio
- Radio: 700 WLW
NL Central Standings
| TEAM | W/L | % | GB | Last 10 |
| Brewers | 61/54 | .530 | – | 4-6 |
| Cubs | 59/55 | .518 | 1.5 | 6-4 |
| Reds | 60/56 | .517 | 1.5 | 3-7 |
| Pirates | 51/62 | .451 | 9.0 | 6-4 |
| Cardinals | 49/35 | .430 | 11.5 | 3-7 |
Wondering if the game starts on time given the chance of T-storms in about an hour (per The Weather Channel).
Need to hit Johnny Baseball hard and early. Last chance to Squish the Phish at GABP.
Moving toward clouding over here at 1145 about 50 miles north
That was a bad call on the error last night.
So Snzel and Stu over Benson? Is Benson in dawg house?
Reds Twitter says game will not start on time due to rain.
Maybe EDLC should go to the press and tell them he doesn’t like leading off. Whining sure worked for Senzel.
Checking everywhere, where is Benson?
Bell said something about day-to-day back pain.
If this is RE: Benson, if he doesn’t play today, he is probably in queue to head to the IL as the corresponding move to India’s activation.
That’s the way it usually works. lol When David Bell says something like day to day it usually means the IL eventually.
TWC radar and hourly says this band passes by 1 PM. I’m guessing it will be at least 1:30 PM before they can be ready to roll.
Senzel and Newman will be here until the end of the year and I hope they can help us win a few games.We know about them and we have a surplus of infielders that are younger in the minors ready to play in the big leagues.Fairchild really needs to take advantage of this chance while Fraley is out and was hoping Hopkins would but i guess there are no plans for him.To be clear not against Senzel or Newman but just can’t them part of next years team
When will the Cincinnati sports reporter(s (Jim Day) ask Bell at a postgame why he’s still batting EDKC lead off? They would be all over Boone’s butt in NY
Great question and they won’t ask the obvious question.
I like Day mostly.
But he lobs softball questions to Bell, and just accepts the “coaches speak” answers.
U saw what the Orioles did to their color commentator?
And he will not ask an open ended question to Bell. He always frames the answer for Bell.
Didn’t see OS.
Couldn’t find any news on them.
He made a comment about the Orioles poor record against the Rays and was pulled off the air.
https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/38153162/reports-orioles-broadcaster-kevin-brown-removed-reference-struggles-vs-rays?platform=amp
Come on now. You don’t think Big Bob would take revenge out on someone because he didn’t like what he said do you? lol Actually from what I’ve read and heard Big Bob is one of the biggest spiteful babies I’ve ever seen even to Reds fans.
Jim Day is not a member of the “independent media.” He is employed by the Reds — so when he interviews Bell, he is in effect questioning a co-worker. Tough questions from him should not be expected. As for the reporters for the “independent media” (Enquirer, etc.), yes, those types of questions — whether they are in truth asked or not — should definitely be expected.
Approx 1:10 start per the broadcast.
Tarp coming off
What does TJ Hopkins need to do to get a start? Funny how Senzel and his agent try to get him traded at the deadline and ever since Senzel has played more often than not.
Redheaded stepchildren can do nothing.
He plays OF. The Reds have TJ, Steer, Fairchild, Benson, and Senzel as viable starters.
He’s the 26th man on the roster right now. He didn’t impress in his time hear earlier.
He’ll be gone Friday if India returns.
I’ll say, he should have probably gotten 1 start in his time here, but it’s not the end of the world that he didn’t
Benson is hurt and Senzel and Fairchild are barely hitting their weight. Besides Benson didn’t impress at first and he has gotten a second chance.
I’ve been anxious to see him play as well. So far, the only thing he’s done is pinch run, I think. He has not had much of a chance. I would have started him one of these past few days instead of Fairchild — just to see what we’ve got. He’s played well at AAA.
OK, here we go!!!
No cookies to Soler, please.
Ty dropped what might have been a called strike 3.
Singled later in the AB.
Nice stop by EDLC. At first I thought Soler had beaten him, but that was MattyMc running across the bag.
Now for Bike Helmets on Bell.
Not looking forward to facing Cueto today. Not a good feeling about what he’s going to do to us. lol He’s gone at least six innings his last several starts. I read today where he said he almost signed with the Reds but didn’t get any specific offers. I know he’s been injured a lot of the year but pitching well now. I still would have rather had him than the alternative we chose instead in Weaver.
Just went back and watched Fairchild’s little league HR again, and I’ve got to give John Sadek credit in the booth for the call. He drives me crazy but in all honesty he might be one of the best I’ve heard when it comes to exciting calls for the Reds team that he clearly loves.
I miss seeing Ashcraft hitting triple digits. Makes me wonder if he is dealing with some kind of slight injury or just trying to focus more on location/movement/spin rate or maybe just saving a little for longevity…or something else possibly.
EDLC just struck out and I’m not sure in 5 swings that he swung at a single strike. I don’t understand why Bell keeps him at the top of the lineup. Challenge this kid by moving him back in the order, so that his pride takes over.
I don’t think any of us would have thought EDLC would strike out to start a game. Here’s hoping he figures it out soon. If not, here’s hoping that Bell does.
I really believe he will figure it out.
But let him do it lower in the lineup.
It must be that secret info Bell has on him.
Yes, the time has arrived for him to bat lower. WAY too many K’s. Not enough walks — not to mention hits.
The reason it’s so easy to K EDLC right now is because he swings at every pitch like it’s 3-0. He’ll learn to do better but until then he doesn’t need to be in the leadoff spot.
A whiff, a roll-over grounder, and …
… a weak fly. Same today as we’ve seen recently.
I need to go to the veggie stand.
I know. It’s getting to a point where I expect to see EDLC struck out every time he’s batting. How quickly things have changed.
It could be another long day for the Reds bats.
Nice 2nd from GA. Can Steer, Votto, and/or CES make anything happen against Johnny Biesbol?
Man, Spencer Steer has been a hitting the ball consistently hard the last week and a half right at them.
It is poetic that Votto was the first to get a hit off cueto
Stephenson’s lost. Three pitches.
He should not be the #1 catcher at this time. To me he has been the biggest disappointment this year.
A lot of people blame Stephenson’s injury from last year. Unfortunately I just don’t think he’s a quality hitter. Need a catcher on our off season shopping list.
Cueto can still pitch. Would be nice to have him right about now.
This is only his 6th start of the year.
So missing 4 months wouldn’t have been very fun.
Would have been better than having Weaver which is what we got instead. lol
Thus far it doesn’t look like Cueto is having to put up much of an effort. His pitch count per inning looks better than most Reds’ relievers.
Cueto could’ve had an era of 12.00, and he would pitch a gem against us just because, and the funk to go along.
It would have been cool if it worked out somehow to have Cueto and Chapman down the stretch this year.
I have a feeling not much effort was put out in either case, despite the party line from Krall.
Krall will let Miley walk, sign Minor and Weaver but no offer to Jonny Beisbol?
Same, for sentimentality. Chapman would have made a much larger impact imo.
The “miss” on Cueto is probably a good one, considering he has provided *22 IP going into todays game. Weaver has at least given them some innings, which has some value considering the injuries, youth, development, etc. To be clear, I would swap them in a heartbeat right now. I would also prefer to see Weaver never start another game.
(*Kevin Herget has pitched 22 IP for the Reds this year.)
Going to take a jab at my guy Stu, if you take a pitch at 2-2 and get the call, why do you chase the next one at 3-2 and be K’d?
They were both good pitcher’s pitches. There was nothing he could do with either of them except miss or maybe foul them straight back. After the 1st call went his way, just take the risk.
K-child and EDLC and India, even, need to develop the ability to foul off borderline pitches.
All of them tend to grip and rip, or stand and watch.
The down and away slider is killing all three.
You can watch them getting set up for it and worked.
When Elly 1st came Bell said, we’re just going to get of his way, weve seen what he can do(paraphrasing). I agreed then, but it’s time to get in his way.
Move him down, pull those unis up to the knees, shorten his swing path, maybe crouch abit.
Errand complete. I see I just missed Bell cranking one. Cookie or a good hit?
Pitch away and up just enough he could ride it out to LF. High fly that carried just enough.
Thanks.
Gabp special
Looking back on the 12g win streak – Friedl was usually the leadoff hitter and EDLC in the #4 slot. Bell should go back to that line up at least to see what happens – this nothing is going to change BS is getting old.
They’ve since found Elly’s weaknesses. I’d take as much heat off of him as I could-and slot him lower until his contact rate improved. Contigent on a few variables. Jimo
Just as they did Aquino’s and just as with AA, the Reds coaching staff didn’t coach them through it. It’s one of the reasons I never wanted these guys brought up while Bell was still here. So much for that.
That works.
FInally Steer!!!!
Spencer Steer!
Did Employee #19 just beat out an infield hit? 😛
Votto got wheels lol
And CES makes him pay for leaving one a bit up.
CES might not hit .600 again in MLB but I think he’ll develop into a finer hitter.
That’s 2 dingers from the Mahle trade in one inning.
1st time, I think.
Krall should feel good about that.
Pretty amazing.
I thought CES really earned his stripes at Louisville the last several weeks before he was called up. Prior to then, he had been batting behind a string of rehabbing MLB guys, McLain, and EDLC with 4A guys like Reynolds or Ramos behind him.
One by one everybody in front of him was gone, making him the main attraction. Yet he managed to maintain (barely) his OPS at >1.000 versus both LH and RH pitching. Even more impressive to me, he slumped for a couple of weeks dropping his overall OPS under 1.000 but rallied to bump it back up over 1.000
cES!!!
Strand…. have we finally unlocked Cueto
I know EDLC likes to “have fun” with his participation in the HR celebration photos, but perhaps somebody with a little more time on the team should encourage him to refrain until he strings together a few hits (not even HR’s) and cuts down on what seems like a 100% whiff rate. 😮
Agree.
I haven’t been keeping track but it seems like his K rate is higher than that.
+1,000 😀
I like that he isn’t pouting on the bench.
He’s staying upbeat about his teammates success.
Attitude is still good…and that’s a positive.
True points. But his priority (or maybe that of the coaches) needs to be reducing his K rate and improving his zone recognition. That’s the only reason I mentioned it.
Really think the Reds need to sign McClain and Steer to long-term deals in the offseason. The rest of these rookies still have a lot to prove, but those two are 100% going to be the core to bringing back winning baseball to Cincinnati. They are a cut above.
As I’m writing this CES just hit a two-run Dinger to left and when you watch a replay the pitch is inside and he somehow kept the ball Fair using a shortened swing to get it over the fence on what looked like a really awkward swing. That was an amazing piece of hitting.
Agree, I think the most impressive rookies this year are 1. Steer 2. McClain and 3. CES in his shirt time and EDLC. CES’s shirt compact swing will be even better with better pitch recognition. EDLC way too many holes in the swing along with bad pitch recognition.
I’m in agreement re: Steer and MattyMc. I think we’re seeing some fatigue and growth pains, but they continue to impress me overall.
Nice 2 out rally here.
I guess EDLC mugs with HR guys cause he’d never be on tv any other way. I know he’s only 21. YADA YADA Funny he’s the only one that does it every time. He should be downstairs in the cage.
With the machine set on “slider” and “changeup”.
Over and over and over.
LOL
Middle of the line-up gittin ‘er dun.
Top and bottom are creating extreme negative pressure differentials.
Smellzel should no longer be on this ream. He has shown to be selfish and disruptive, and they should send him and his .221 batting average to triple A or dfa him. He has almost zero trade value. Maybe someone like Kansas City or Oakland would pick him off the waiver wire.
At this point Senzel is going to cost another team ~$540K if they claim him on waivers but just north of $200K if he clears waivers and is subsequently released and then signed.
If I was sort of interested in him but not over the moon, I’d whisper to the Reds they should send him through waivers and release him if he clears and because I would sign him then.
It is a win/win situation for the Reds either way. If somebody takes him off waivers, the Reds are off the hook 100%. If he is released then signed, they get back the $200K the signing team has to pay as the remaining prorated minimum salary. Plus, either way, he is no longer the Reds problem.
More runs guys.
Larkin suggesting india goes back to lead off
It’s obvious to just about everyone except the guy who makes the decisions. Lets hope D. Bell has an epiphany
You just knew EDLC was going for two there. Outfielder made a good play on him.
The boys gave Cueto an easy inning there.
At least Elly De La Whiff got a hit.
Unfortunately he also got a TOOTBLAN
Have to tip your hat to Chisholm on that off-balance throw to nab Elly. I still would like to see him take the extra base as a stolen base and not on the single in those situations (good defender, hard hit ball).
Sadak TKO’d Barry over the leadoff numbers
I had the mute on doing some work.. what did he say?
There is aggressive and there is not smart. Think that crossed the line?
But if so, young and think he will learn.
You can play hard & smart at the same time.
Let’s see the fastest man in baseball could settle for a single and steal second or try and stretch a single and be a sitting duck. Great baseball IQ
Is young a code word for not smart?
Ashcraft solid today
Ashcraft has been really good since he came back from his stint on the DL…lately he has just been dominant. If you remember his last start when he gave up the two run two out dinger in the eighth inning he got super unlucky because he was breezing through the top of the eighth and with two outs the guy hit a little nubber towards first that was just far enough to be out of his reach and out of the reach of the catcher even though the runner should have been called out for running in the Baseline…and then he made a bad pitch and the next guy hit the HR when he was probably a little worn our from running on the previous play, but he really should have had a box of 8 innings with one run.
A little station-to-station here. CES, you have ONE JOB to do right now. Please don’t disappoint us.
Nicely done!
M & J grinding.
Yes sir@
CES was born to hit a baseball.
I love Senzel … I really do … but why isn’t Benson the PH’er here?
I hear he has a sore back.
that would explain things
CES gladly sees pitcher give him sinkers. He whiffed on a slider and yet the next pitch he got was a sinker and he sure didn’t miss it. It’s the same pitch he homered on. I guess Marlins fans are whining about the pitcher/manager right now.
Filthy GA end of 7!
Middle 7.
You can forget that. No way to get EDLC on that one.
What? Votto suddenly realized he’s not a home run hitter? He’s doing today what he should be doing. Let the HRs and XBH come naturally. He’ll be better off and so will the team.
Thanks for that. I’ll be glad to pass your genius baseball hitting technique onto the future HOFer. 🙂
@Chris, what’s the difference between Votto hitting a HR once in a while and Aquino? Other than Aquino could play defense. Votto’s fan club is vocal no doubt. But his time is past.
Like Larkin said EDLC keep running and force them to make a play on you instead of just giving up. But then again he’s young. LOL
And that is how they should have pitched Soler last night. Not a get ahead fastball thigh high on the outer half but a corner catcher first then jammed him inside.
Aaron Boone has raised the bar on Manager antics. Not Sweet Lou’esque but very creative.
And wasn’t that one of the grittiest manager’s arguments we’ve seen in a while 😉 Much better than a bobble head argument.
smh Tie game. Seems like it’s always one guy that kills us.
That guy being Bell – he has to micromanage. Takes out an effective RP who just stuck out a batter, has only thrown 11 pitches just to get his righty-righty, lefty – lefty combos.
I think the best thing that could ever happen to the Reds is that at some point MLB limits pitching staffs to 11 pitchers. That would force Bell to keep relievers in longer
Can’t stand prosperity.
Man, that was a buzzkill.
Bell should have stuck with Gibuat. Or walk Bell. He just never thinks.
Again, I just hate how Bell seems to always have to insert his over managing mentality into the game. Yes, I get it the Marlins’ best hitter was up, but he has NO power; why make the move?
Well, that move backfired.
Gibaut was pitching well. Why take him out?
Cause Bell has those gut feelings………
Great idea Bell. Take out Gibaut who just struck out the batter.
I just don’t understand pulling Gibault to face Arraez.
It’s not like he’s going yard on anyone.
And like I just said, even if he does hit a HR you still have the lead with two outs in the eighth. I’d much rather be worried about the next guy who’s the tying run at the plate and what this pitcher he would be facing if the left-handed hitter gets on
Wow! Graham got screwed. What a joke. Send Moll back to Oakland.
Berti may have bet this game 🙂
Ha ha!!! 🙂
Another thing that would be interesting to see. Has any other pitching staff in the majors allowed as many multiple HR games by a single player as the Reds? The Reds pitchers always seem to pick one guy and serve him up big, fat meatballs so he can have a multiple HR game.
Bell: ” The over-manager”
It seems like any time Bell changes pitchers with 2 out bad things happen, maybe he should give his pitchers a chance to pitch out of trouble. Bell never heard of the old idea that the more you open the bull pen door you will find a pitcher that will fail.
Once again David Bell pushing all the wrong buttons… the man with the magic touch. Not sure why you bring in a left-hander there knowing that if he gives up a walk or a hit then you bring the tying run to the plate as a right hander facing Moll. Why wouldn’t you just let Gibaut pitch to the left-hander and if he gets on then you leave him in there to face the right hander with the tying run?
Maybe I’m missing something but I can’t think of what it could be?
Bell switch hitter
Marlin’s Bell had already homered vs a RH pitcher in the game.
Somehow that’s ruled a hit.
The Reds official scorekeeper this year has been terrible and it’s been the same in some of their away games … very generous with the hits versus the errors.
Reds pen is toast. They look like the same guys until they start throwing pitches; but, they’ve lost their edge.
It’s the gift that keeps on giving
Nailed it…
I said back in May and June that Bell was running the ‘pen into the ground by being way too conservative with the starters. It seems like any time past the 4th inning a starter allowed a runner on base, that was it, Bell yanked them and went to the ‘pen. I remember Bell pulling starters with their pitch count in the low 80’s several times.
Well, this is what happens. The ‘pen is gassed, and have nothing left to give.
This is why I still think my prediction of the Reds finishing with 75 to 78 wins may still come to pass. The ‘pen is running on fumes, but unfortunately still have almost 2 months of baseball still to play.
Steer has him timed
Yeah but Scott is keeping the ball where Steer cannot effectively get the barrel on top of it,
It’s a nitpick, but you don’t “fight off” strike 1, Sadak.
I guess stealing a base and then following it up with putting a couple balls and play it’s too much to ask.
In play….
They have reverted back to homerun or striking out only it seems
I thought so at 1st, but this guy is super quick to the plate. Slide step
And it comes back to CES to right the ship. Appropriate given the day he’s having.
He had no chance Mark. 3 sliders away. Zero chance. I do think it’s a fixable problem but it will take coaching and CES put in the time to make himself a decent hitter against slider.
So if the inning ends tied, Bell will bring in Diaz and then if it goes extra innings, either Diaz goes long or the Reds are depleted. Three more years.
Bell, being Bell at his best! Takes out Gibaut after striking out a batter. No feel for the game in front of him. Pathetic beyond belief….
The home team is dejected after what happened in the 8th inning. I can’t see them winning this one. The last 2 Ashcraft starts are almost carbon copies of each other. This is a team that has lost it’s identity.
And the wheels begin to come off courtesy of Diaz
Misery
Why it’s Diaz in to pitch! Who knew? Everyone including the Marlins manager
All closers on the home team pitch in a tie game in the 9th.
No longer save situations.
Pretty widely known.
When the guy is already showing signs of fatigue, it’s not a good move. And everybody else does it is a lousy justification.
off day yesterday.
Off day tomorrow
And just like that, Bell’s predictably cost the Reds again.
Good news is Votto’s BA is climbing nicely and his HRs per ABs is a career high.
His HR/AB being a career high is actually not a good thing.
Everyone is suffering from burnout in the bullpen! Awful
I know baseball is a long season full of ups and downs, but if they lose this one, as it appears they will, it might be the back-breaker? I don’t know?
Yep. First half of season was fun. Classic second half collapse. They’re done for.
Well, that might just be the game.
What do you think, Bell? Are you happy with this bullpen that you ran into the ground?
Of course, his defenders will say “It’s not Bell’s fault, the players just aren’t performing!”. Yeah, they aren’t performing because Bell mis-managed them all season, and now it’s coming home to roost.
3 more years.
Diaz showed signs of fading before the ASG. He’s now really appears to have a tired arm.
Made maybe they’ll give Tommy Johns out cheaper by the dozen. This is really tragic.
Way to go Bell! Disastrous bullpen management again, again, and again. This one in on him…
Yeah, one really has to wonder what genius thought up bringing him back for 3 more years. A terrible move destined to negatively impact all the young guys. Votto will be back as well.
It’s not the moves that Bell makes as the constant “over-manager”, it’s the fact that he is making these moves with a 3-year extension in his back pocket….that’s what makes me sick
“We already have all we need”. Nick Krall
I still think what Nick is really saying is, “I tried to reach into the BobPhil wallet and got a series of mouse traps instead. They are happy with the uptick in attendance for now. All I could do was hand the contract they wrote to HDTBell and countersign it.”
Lifeless, even if we manage to find a spark and come back today.
Yeah which is exactly why this winter will be more of the same. They will sign some had been at the end of Spring training. Anyone expecting the Reds to spend 30 or 40 Million dollars on free agents this winter are out of their minds. I suspect their payroll next year will be around $55 million dollars.
I am afraid you can stick a fork in this bunch. Losing 5 out 6 on this home stand. 60 and 57 and the Brewers have come all the way back. Reds losers of 8 out of 9.
I’m no expert, but Diaz looks completely gassed.
Bike Helmets may help. Last call coming.
Yup. Diaz has nothing left to give.
Think of the value he’d have generated back in April/May. Not saying I want to trade him, but MAN!! How far things have sunk.
Bottom of the lineup
if the reds don’t come back to win this….I say, the most devastating loss of the year. And we again will get to hear Bell rambling on in the post-game about how everything is fine
Disheartening back to back losses. Marlins did to us what we did in first half: played spirited baseball and came back to win game. Collectively everything is falling apart for the Reds
And we’re still playing a man short (Benson) if I understand correctly.
Down to our favorite 14-year-old.
Larkin must be losing his mind. He said the mindset of a closer and used Dibble as an example. Myers was the closer in 1990 with 31 saves Dibble had 11.
Not a Larkin fan in the boot at all, in fact I can’t stand him in the booth, but his comment about Dibble was valid. After 1990, Dibble became their closer. Regardless, Larkin’s point was right. At the very least, you wait and bring Diaz in when a runner is on 2nd base in the extras.
And of course he lets Senzel bat. Amazing what a little public complaining will do for a mediocre players. “Oh no, Senzel don’t like playing for me. I need to play him more. “
Elly De La Whiff
That was surprising. Elly never strikes out.
He had one good pitch to hit….and he looked at it
I have to go mow. That’s another predictable activity for me, but at least I know the result will be a mown yard.
Back at it on Friday.
Who doesn’t agree that Bell should be fired.
Again, I say, 2 months of good baseball gets him a 3 year extension…just stupid
The organization doesn’t. In fact, they think he’s done such a swell job that he deserves another 3 years.
I really can’t believe that was Krall’s decision, given how smart he’s been about everything else. It stinks to high heaven of one of a knee-jerk Castellini order.
Boy I wish I knew.I agree Krall has done some good things and he paid Moose to play some place else and released Myers. Thats a bunch of money thrown away that I never thought would happen.I must think as you do C13J that Bob has given Krall a free hand in a lot of things but Bell wasn’t one of them.Overlooking 2020 2021 and 2022 all together and bringing him back on this year a little over half a season alone is well hard for me to grasp not for one more year but for 3 more years.
Bob Castellini
He’s the only one who counts – they’re not going to take a vote.
That’s checkout time for me. See you guys next year
The sky is falling.
Getting our butts kicked. smh
Terrible. Just terrible.
The Reds had this game won until Bell inserted himself into it. All he had to do was sit back and let Gibaut continue to pitch.
He just can’t help himself.
YES!!!!! I knew when he took him out that we had lost. Bell is the worst manager in all of baseball.
Great job managing Bell, 4 runs in the last 2 innings! This is another example why I have stated many times, nothing changes. DBell is what he has always been, look at his track record. So get use to it Reds fans. We have at least 3 more years of this.
Their De La Cruz is greater than our De La Cruz …
Pitiful!
Low point?
You ain’t seen nothin’ yet!
For sure
No….the low point was the day Bell was given the extension
The team has flipped. Bullpen and offense used to be our strength. Feels like ages ago now.
Not ready for prime time.
Bell beat us by himself.You choose which one.
I didn’t realize until I read this that the Reds would be undefeated with any other manager! That’s amazing.
Yes you’re right. The Reds record would be the same or worse no matter who is managing them. It doesn’t matter what moves the manager makes, what lineups, what batting orders, who plays, who sits, how and when the bullpen is used….it’s all completely irrelevant and none of it is on David Bell.
Feel better?
This team is now playing to finish above .500 and I know how I would bet on that. The Bell extension, Senzel’s complaining, no trades, a tired bull pen, some key injuries and the rookies running out of gas has done them in. The worst part, by far, is 3 more years of David Bell.
But yet people still defend the great manager Bell
I am not sure who has the RLN wrap up for this one but I am glad it is not me. Later gals and guys.
Copy and Paste!!! Same ole song
Cannot explain the collective struggling of bullpen. Hitters striking out has been a problem all year, with EDLC the emblematic one and as the baseball god had it, the last player to strike out today
Total meltdown. Bell can’t help himself, no pitcher is allowed to finish an inning. Also, De la Cruz in my opinion should be sent back to AAA for a major wake up call and learn how to get some plate discipline. It’s inexcusable to be able strikeout at this rate. The reds don’t have the guts to do it but he needs to be humbled. Pitiful.
Nah the Reds don’t have the cajones. They won’t even move him down the lineup. I mean come on be easy on the guy. He’s only 21 and having fun. Getting a personalized bat, declaring yourself the fastest man in the world, mugging for every camera in sight , reporters saying you should be on the All Star Team. Life is good. Maybe a shot of humility and lessons in hitting a breaking ball in order?
YES!!!!!!!!!
Time to end the Senzel experiment. He is what he is.
Offensively EDLC cannot hit off speed pitches, CES can’t make contact to slider, MM has not hit for power in a while, and Steer occasionally whacks a HR but plate discipline overall very bad, taking pitches to strike out in situations where he cannot afford that. Senzel and TS, at one time we thought Al would be part of the future, don’t seem to know how to play baseball, not just hitting, anymore. Th anything else anyone wants to add?
and lets have a guy lead-off that never walks & strikes out by the boat load
That situation is not like any other baseball team with a winning record. Big cause of our lack of production.
Maybe the Reds can be just a one game of a playoff spot or few games behind first place but In my opinion the Reds are out of race right now.. The illusion is fading away
Yeah and may leave Pittsburgh with a fight on their hands for third place.
Ashcraft said he needed to be pulled; that he’d given all he had in the last inning he threw. But let’s not allow that to cloud the narrative that the manager is always wrong.
If you support Bell, then you haven’t been paying attention the last few years…..take a look at 2021 down the stretch
@GPod, you are correct. I said he needed to go before the previous extension. Extending Bell and not looking for pitching at the deadline, confirms that the Reds aren’t interested in winning. They called up EDLC and company to boost attendance. Sadly, fans gave them that. They need to quit going to the games.
No, He’s always wrong
Pulling Ashcraft certainly wasn’t the issue here.
Bell’s micromanaging of the bullpen is fairly up for scrutiny.
This is the second game in a row where he’s misfired by pulling a reliever who is doing well and inserting another without considering the situation.
Sims hasn’t been starting his appearances well of late…so why insert him with runners on?
Moll came out of the game sore just the other day?
Does Bell consider that or is it more important that he again inserts himself into the game by playing his R / L obsession?
I know folks here tire of the Bell bashing but he makes one strategic blunder after another w both the pitching and hitting.
Players may appreciate his laissez faire / no accountability culture but he is simply not a good field manager.
And it costs the Reds another loss.
Will he self reflect on this?
Absolutely not.
He appears to have no sense of accountability even to himself.
No one questioned removing Ash. That was fine. I did not have an issue of him being extended during the Wash start either. One lucky hit and one good swing by the next hitter ruined that. Pitch was not that bad. Just a good swing.
The issue was removing Dumas to bring on the LH or whoever the heck called these pitches. Amazing how the other team seems to be ready to swing at 1st pitch fastballs. Reds hitters are perplexed. They have Cruz wanting to work counts that he’s taking fat fastballs. A lot of them do this really.
I don’t trust Bell to be the manager to develop this team.
Could the Reds put Bell on the IL?
Maybe the DFA!
How about DFA
Please let’s not have any more people get on here and defend Bell. The bottom line is what has he done as a manager. 2019 = 87 losses. 2020 backed into playoffs and didn’t score a run, 2021 September collapse. 2022 102 losses and now 2023 an ugly August collapse. Why in the world was this man extended?
I notice that the David Bell Fan Club has been conspicuously absent ever since the Great Purge happened on the Buddy Bell post a few weeks ago. They all acted like trolls, so I wonder if Doug banned them all.
I think most normal RLN posters are pretty fair in their assessment of Bell. Maybe we sometimes get too emotional and blame him for things he doesn’t deserve (I’m guilty of that too), but objectively, I don’t think there is anyone who would call Bell a “good” manager. He’s somewhere between “mediocre” and “bad”.
I don’t think there’s anything controversial about saying as much.
Craziest part is the guy makes the same mistakes over and over and over and over. 2021 looks exactly like this year. Over working bullpen, throwing the same guy out there to blow the game etc etc. He never learns or improves its actually quite bizarre. He is absolutely clueless most of the time and has the worst body language youll ever see on a pro coach/manager. He is the hunter biden of the bell family.
The bigger question is why was he hired to begin with? But we have 3 more years to go through games like today. Go REDS!
I knew all was lost last week when Bell went off on the home plate umpire and got ejected for it….The calls by that ump were correct calls…this was Bell’s weak attempt to fire up his team and get them out of this funk…..signs of a desperate man who has no other answers
I remember that game / moment. It was the Luke Weaver 40 pitch inning. My take is that was a planned event to buy Weaver a short blow. Already had been a mound visit by pitching coach and needed a break. I thought it was a very smart move by Bell.
Remember that this team lost 100 games last year and added no one. Lost 2 of top 3 SP, while one was awful before he got hurt. That’s not terrible managing. Did he burn out bullpen? Yes, of course he did. He had to manage each game like a game 7 or else the season would have been a disaster much earlier. The Reds played great for a very long stretch and realistically played over their heads. Now they’re coming back down; bully is tired, rookies hitting wall and scouting reports updated on them. Votto looks like a HOFer at end of career. Stephenson looks like a guy battling the effects of multiple concussions. Sure managers have an impact, that’s why there are managers in the HOF and others not. Jim Calipari has a saying that makes sense here. “It’s not about the X’s and the O’s, it’s about the Jimmy’s and the Joe’s”. Our Jimmy’s and Joe’s (particularly pitching staff) are not as good as everyone elses.
Seems like nobody wants to write the follow-up to today’s game.
Can’t say I blame them.
We must admit that when this team won it was in spite of Bell and he had nothing to do with it.
I agree Mark. I know Krall gets a lot of credit here, but not obtaining pitching this past off season or at the trading deadline this summer is a major failure on his part. Although many here like to excuse it, it was an abysmal failure.
You can’t go into a season depending on three rookie pitchers, none of whom, threw more than 126 innings in a season.
I know people here feel this team has a great future ahead of it, but again, this team will not be together very long. Once the Rookies become arb eligible the Reds will start selling them off one by one. I suspect the next rebuild will be well underway by 2026.
Kinda like Hunter Greene right?
They don’t sell off when they are arb ready. They’ve never done that with their own players. Quit exaggerating this narrative. That’s not what they’ve done. If anything they waited until they’re walk year to trade players and not get better value. At worst they will be here 5 full years. If they can’t get an extension done.
Oh wait? Extensions? Yes they do those. Like Hunter was extended. Won’t be able to do that with everyone. Not even the Dodgers can do that. That’s why holding on to as many top tier prospects made the trade deadline boring. They could have still found a way to get more pitching using fringe prospects. It didn’t happen. So now we will see if works out for the next few years.
If you guys like the way the Castellinis run this franchise then you should be quite please.
Zero reason to pull Ashcraft. Another micro-managed loss. Managers: Get out of the way of the game. Your moves do not work. When I guy is rolling, let him throw 120-130 pitches like 20 game winners used to do almost every time out. Absolutely humiliating to the game.
Ashcraft said he was done Left it all out there in the 7th.
I’m ticked too, but the last time Ashcraft pitched he gave up the game tying HR with 2 outs in the 8th too. Everyone blamed Bell for that too.
Bottom line is they are all to blame. It’s a long season, longer than any of these rookies have ever experienced and the pressure has been building. I hope they are learning and can turn around this year, but at least for next year.
I’ve defended Bell, but wouldn’t call myself a Bell supporter. But the crap he takes here is really ridiculous. Literally every single thing that doesn’t go right is his fault. And, when things are going very well it could be even better if they had a different manager so that’s his fault too.
Heads he loses, tails he loses.
I do think the extension timing was questionable, and correlation with his dads retirement announcement puzzling. No idea if that has anything to do with anything. I would suspect losing India and Fraley have something to do with it, along with nearly all the key rookies hitting walls.
Your right and every manager is viewed just like that.The fact he could have been fired after 2020 or 2021 or 2022 based on what took place in each year and wasn’t really is the story here.That was an ownership decision not to fire him just like it was to extend him for 3 years.Krall gave the reasons why and like it or not it is what it is.Bell is and will remain part of the good ole boy network and part of the family and he has a job for as long as he wants one.I respect that so we move on. He can’t make enough questionable decisions to lose his job so we should probably just move on
I honestly had a bigger issue with him surviving the 3-22 start last year, but Phil kind of cornered them into not trying to blame the manager at that point in time.
The rest of last year made me respect Bell more than I ever did previously due to the absolute crap roster he was given.
I’m still pissed at ownership, but am optimistic that Krall is putting together a plan that will work despite them. If they choose to spend money to supplement the moves he’s made – by free agency or signing more of their youth to longer contracts like Greene – that would go a long way for me.
Overall, I think the role of the manager is overblown by fans everywhere. Talent – and honestly dumb luck – wins out in the end. I think most of us were tired of Dusty’s “antics”, but he won in Houston with more talent. We could/should have won in 2012. Cueto’s opening injury and Rolen’s error in the clinching game against the Giants and who knows….dumb luck.
Bell: Use this lineup for Friday.
1. Friedl CF (tell him to draw walks and drop bunts)
2. McLain SS
3. India 2B
4. De La Cruz 3B (remind him to draw walks)
5. Benson RF (he’ll take pitches with De La Cruz on; leave him in RF)
6. Votto DH (he’ll take pitches with De La Cruz or Benson on)
7. Steer LF
8. Encarnacion-Strand 1B
9 Stephenson or Maile C
First hitters off the bench are Newman and then Senzel. Fairchild as defensive sub for Steer.
Abbott is set to start. Get him back to throwing strikes (7.94 BB/9 in Aug). If we have a lead, use Diaz and Moll to set up Diaz. Emphasize throwing strikes. Bullpen is among the worst in the league at BB’s and HR’s in Aug.
Let Abbott dictate how long he is going to stay in the game.
Your “B” fight card is: Law, Gibaut, Sims, Farmer and Young.
Cruz as set-up (typo)
Not sure if moving De La Cruz to 4th will improve his “not making much contact” rate but his lack of walks or getting on base is worse than any lead-off hitter. Can’t bat first with that performance.
This team is not the same one we saw in June. Been on vaca so havent seen all the recent games, but have still followed here and on other websites. Have them all recorded and have not had time to watch them all but that’s another matter, dont know if I really want to.
This team needs India and get back to the gritty ball they were playing in June. And, ditch the helmet and cape. Enough of fun. Time to work if they want to do anything this year.
I feel a bit for Bell as every move he made during stretches where the Reds were playing well worked. Curt Casali was getting a big hit, Stuart Fairchild was clutch, the Reds battled down to the last bat, never were out of a game, just had super confidence. Something shifted, not sure exactly what it was, maybe a combination of things. But it’s like the exact opposite type of team now. They get a good start and the bullpen blows it, no coming back in the 9th inning anymore, Diaz struggling, etc.
I don’t know maybe a healthy Greene, India and Fraley leads to playing really well in September, but sure doesn’t look like it.
I’m older than most of you on this blog. I’m approaching eighty and have been a reds fan since the mid-fifties. From Birdie Tebbits to David Bell, I’ve seen good, bad and great teams. Most of the teams have been mediocre or worse, unfortunately. But I loved just about all of the teams in the 1970’s. 1961 was fun, as was 1990. This team looks like it become really good in the next few years, but I don’t think they have the right manager to achieve that. I hope that I’m wrong.
I’ve been Reds fan since mid 1950s, too. 1961, 1962, and 1964 were fun. 1967 was exciting (comparable to this team with young talent). 1970s were the best, obviously. Late 1980s led to 1990 results but still a surprise. Mid 1990s very good. Late 1990s not bad. 2010s good for a few years. Reds are about .500 team since 1882 entry into NL.
Reds had best W-L record in NL from 1956 to 1981. Not Dodgers. Not Cardinals. Not Giants.
You two have a lot of Reds history to look back on. Amazing. 🙂
I’ve never seen a bigger bunch of crybabies in my life. You do know the best team in baseball will probably lose 60 games? And should they still cut Votto? He’s only leading the team in OPS.
There are a lot of problems with David Bell as a manager, but one of the most glaring is how he handles the bullpen, and it has cost this team. His philosophy is almost always to only use a reliever for one inning no matter how many pitches he threw or how successful he pitched. This basically means more pitchers, pitching in more games to cover more innings. Instead of letting a pitcher go another inning and thus letting more pitchers in the bullpen get days off. This is why we have so many guys in the pen with so many appearances (tops in the NL) and now this philosophy is blowing up the season because so many guys are wearing down. That is some concrete evidence why I think he is a terrible manager
Or, you could say the reason he’s had to do this is because they’ve had over 200 innings pitched by starters Weaver, Overton, Cessa, Stoudt, Kenndy, lol. Plus rookies (expected shorter outings) Greene, Lively, Williamson, Abbott, Richardson, etc. He’s chosen to shorten the games – and stay in them – because of the starters limitations, not because of some managerial preference. I’m sure he would prefer 5 starters who could pitch 6-7 innings a game (like he’s been allowing Ashcraft to do lately, btw.)
There were many, many games they won earlier in the year BECAUSE he pulled out the starter and used the bullpen to hold things down to allow the offense to catch back up. If this overuse of Bell is his problem, then they don’t even make it to this point in the season in contention imo.
No offense, but this is one of the more tired messages of this site. Blame the manager at all cost. Even when the manager is using pretty much an entire pitching roster of unproven and/or inexperienced arms, and most of the year without his #1 and #2 starters. Yet somehow they are still in the playoff race in August a year removed after losing 100 games.
Yes, it’s a real bad stretch right now. I hope he *can* help right the ship somehow. I very much expect India, Fraley, (now Benson?), Lively, Greene, Lodolo will help turn things back around much more.
Adding insult to injury: Michael Lorenzen no hitter against the Nationals….
I believe that doing things over, and over, and over again and expecting a different outcome from what has repeatedly occurred, is called insanity. It perfectly describes Bell’s bullpen mismanagement….
Have they had a closed door meeting of just the players like the “old days?”
Someone has to step up and light a fire and hold players accountable . Getting group hugs from Bell ain’t getting it done.