Just when you think you’ve seen everything on a baseball field Elly De La Cruz shows up to teach you something. After falling behind 4-1, the Cincinnati Reds battled back not once, but twice in the game to tie it up before De La Cruz set the baseball world on fire by stealing third and home on the same play just a few pitches after his RBI single gave the Reds a lead. Alexis Diaz would shut the game down in the 9th and seal a win over the Brewers that guarantees the Reds will be in first place to start the second half of the season.
| Final | R | H | E |
|---|---|---|---|
| Cincinnati Reds (50-40) |
8 | 13 | 0 |
| Milwaukee Brewers (48-42) |
5 | 9 | 1 |
| W: Sims (3-1) L: Peguero (1-2) SV: Diaz (26) | |||
| Statcast | Box Score | Game Thread | |||
Milwaukee didn’t waste much time taking the lead on Saturday as Willy Adames hit a 422-foot solo homer off of Luke Weaver in the 1st inning to put the Brewers up 1-0. Cincinnati got that run back on a home run of their own in the top of the 3rd inning when Will Benson sent one over the bullpen in right field to tie things up.
The game didn’t remain tied very long. In the bottom of the 3rd inning Joey Wiemer singled and then came around to score on a double off of the bat of Christian Yelich that caught the kick-out of the stands and bounced towards center field instead of continuing down the right field line, making it easy for Wiemer to score on the play. The Brewers weren’t done, though, as Willy Adames hit another home run and made it 4-1.
Elly De La Cruz led off the 4th inning with an infield single and he was awarded second base when the throw from Willy Adames threw the ball away. He moved to third on a balk and then Jake Fraley walked to put runners on the corners for Joey Votto. He tied the game up on the first pitch he saw when he hit it 423 feet over the bullpen in right center. Will Benson would triple later in the inning, but he would be stranded at third.
The Brewers would take the lead once again in the bottom of the 4th inning after Brice Turang triples with a runner on first base. With the infield in a little bit, Joey Wiemer hit a grounder to Elly De La Cruz, who looked the runner back and then got the out of first. That would end the day for Luke Weaver as the Reds called on Ian Gibaut to come in and face Christian Yelich with two outs. Gibaut got the job done, getting a ground out to end the inning.
Cincinnati wasn’t going to roll over. Matt McLain led off with a single and then stole second. After a pitching change, Jake Fraley came to the plate to face Bryse Wilson. He had been 0-9 against Wilson in his career, but he came to the plate ready to swing and doubled on the first pitch he saw to tie the game up at 5-5. Joey Votto thought he had an RBI hit, but a leaping catch on a line drive by Owen Miller at first base robbed his counterpart of a hit and ended the inning.
Ian Gibaut returned to the mound for the bottom of the 5th inning and he did what seemingly no other Reds pitcher has been able to – he didn’t give up a home run to Willy Adames, but it wasn’t due to Adames not trying as he flew out to the warning track. Gibaut got through the inning to keep the score tied up at 5-5.
Daniel Duarte took over in the bottom of the 6th inning and got the first two batters out in the inning. But Milwaukee would follow up with a single and a walk. That led to a pitching change, with Lucas Sims coming out of the bullpen for the Reds. He walked the first batter he faced to load the bases, but he got a ground out from Christian Yelich to end the inning.
TJ Friedl and Matt McLain started the top of the 7th inning with singles, but Jonathan India grounded into a double play that moved Friedl over to third base. That’s when Elly De La Cruz took things into his own hands. He singled into left field to put the Reds up 6-5. Then he stole second base. And then he stole third base, with no throw to the base as the third baseman couldn’t cover with where he was positioned. The catcher then stood up and tossed the ball back to the pitcher, who casually caught the ball and turned his back to walk to the mound. That was a mistake and De La Cruz knew it, and he sprinted for the plate and beat the throw home. The Fastest Man In Baseball stole third and home on the same play without there being an error.
ELLY STEALS SECOND, THIRD, AND THEN HOME!
?? REDS LEAD 7-5 ?? pic.twitter.com/PnTHQXixNU
— Bally Sports Cincinnati (@BallySportsCIN) July 8, 2023
De La Cruz became the first Reds player to steal second, third, and home in the same inning since 1919 when Greasy Neale did it. Surely you recall that game, right?
After Lucas Sims got a 1-2-3 7th inning, Buck Farmer took over in the 8th. He gave up a leadoff infield single to Raimel Tapia, but retired the next three batters in order to hold onto the 2-run lead and send the game to the 9th.
Cincinnati picked up an insurance run in the top of the 9th after TJ Friedl picked up an infield single and moved up to second base on a balk. Another infield single, this time from Matt McLain, moved Friedl to third base. Jonathan India then hit a sacrifice fly to make it 8-5.
Alexis Diaz entered from the bullpen for the Reds in the bottom of the 9th and he got to face former Red Jesse Winker, who came off of the bench to pinch hit for Joey Wiemer. Diaz would strike Winker out and then he’d do the same to Christian Yelich. William Contreras singled with two outs to keep the game going. Willy Adames then came to the plate and he ended the game by grounding into a force out.
Key Moment of the Game
Elly De La Cruz singling in the go-ahead run in the 7th inning and then stealing three bases on two pitches to add another run to the Reds lead.
Notes Worth Noting
Will Benson’s home run in the 3rd inning gave the Reds a homer in 22 straight games, setting a new franchise record.
Joey Votto doubled and homered. He’s now hitting .259/.365/.685 in 16 games since being activated this year.
Matt McLain’s three hits raised his average back over the .300 mark, pushing him up to .301/.368/.512 on the year.
Elly De La Cruz has 16 steals in 29 games this season. He’s also hitting .328/.366/.533 after picking up two more hits on the day.
Alexis Diaz picked up his 26th save of the season and lowered his ERA to 2.03.
Luke Weaver’s ERA sits at 7.00 on the season.
Up Next for the Cincinnati Reds
Cincinnati Reds vs Milwaukee Brewers
Sunday July 9th, 2:10pm ET
Ben Lively (4-4, 4.11 ERA) vs Wade Miley (5-2, 3.36 ERA)
Wow! 1st place at the break. What a fun half season of baseball. Great time to be a Reds fan!
Código de Trucos is Spanish for Cheat Code and that’s what he plays like!
Curious. How many of Weaver’s starts did the Reds win? I think it’s a high % but not sure.
The Reds are 10-5 in Weaver’s starts and have won the game in his last eight starts.
We don’t need another pitcher that can throw well. We just need another pitcher with the “luck” of Weaver. 😀
Weaver by himself could wear out the Reds” offense; when he pitches, the weight is on their shoulders.
I think it’s 9 straight. What do you think the odds in Vegas would be if you gave them Weaver stats from these last 9 starts and then bet that the Reds won all 9… that would be a nice ticket to have
We could ALL retire.
Great win! Elly is must see TV. Don’t sleep on Fraley’s game 2 out game tying rbi either. He had a bunch of those when we were 21-28 or whatever it was. Diaz looked like he had more life today which is great! Weaver needs to hit the road. Enough is enough already.
Finally, India is killing us. Drop him down after the break please. I’d take Fraley, Steer, or Benson in the 3 hole > India.
If I was making out the lineup card, I’d put Votto back in the 3 hole and build from that.
Votto is doing this as a role-player; starting and pinch-hitting mostly against righties. It’s working, too. One of the reasons, I think, that Reds are so good at coming from behind is that their entire batting order is capable of sustaining a rally, so keeping Votto, Benson and Stevenson nearer the bottom than the top makes sense. As for India: I’d wait and see how the rest he’ll get over the all star break affects him. When he’s hitting, he has the combination of power and on-base skills you want in a 3-hole hitter.
Elly did what?!
Does anyone, and I mean anyone, want to stick with the idea of benching Votto? Upper deck, gents.
Another Weaver wonder, another wild win. ?
Regarding Bell: He’s not tolerating Duarte or Cruz walking batters in key situations lately. Out comes the hook if they do. And some of you armchair guys must have been stunned today to see Sims trotted out for a second inning. Stunned! ?
Farmer held his own. Good to see. Diaz didn’t load the bases before getting the Save. The homers keep coming.
WTG, REDS!
Votto has proven me wrong. I’ll admit it. I thought he could be useful and hit some HRs & walk vs the lower rung righties, but he’d probably hit .220 and fail against the hard throwing bullpen guys. Instead he’s been locked in! Here comes the walks now when they pitch around him
Seriously, just put Votto at 3 and move India down to 6 after the break…or tomorrow. Votto’s got that twinkle in his eye right now and you can just tell that he is seeing the ball great and he is very relaxed and very locked in. Never know, Votto back at 3 where he’s hit most of his career might catch lightning in a bottle in the second half. And if he doesn’t get it done at 3 after a couple weeks it’s no biggie…just move him back to 5 or 6 and on we go with Steer or Elly or McClain at 3. I think it has huge upside and little downside. If we get the old Joey you essentially fix the biggest hole in the batting order with the Hall of Fame player for the second and you move India down where he’s going to be more effective anyways. If it works you could get the production of a blockbuster trade without having to actually trade for anybody.
The only person I would ponder moving is India. Here is a wild idea… swap him a Benson. I know… veteran vs rookie blah blah blah, but India is not a 3rd place hitter. Benson is not a ninth place hitter. Benson is walking, hitting pitches hard and is being very selective. Good lord, could you imagine having Friedl, McClain, and then Benson going 1-3??? I get the fact that the Reds have a scarily balanced line up at the front and back, but maybe India would do better in a less stressed spot. Just a thought. Probably wrong but throwing it out there for fun.
Joey is killin it. Some of these hits he gets are just HUGE! The man still has plenty of gas in the tank as long as David Bell keeps him rested up and fresh!
If they’re afraid of Votto it’ll just make everyone else better. A strong Votto could be key to a playoff run. He’s shown more power than anyone on the team. How amazing would it be to see Votto as a key member of the team in the middle of a playoff run. It could solidify his place in the hall. I haven’t been part of the votto fan fair at all. He’s been my favorite player for more than a decade but I would rather that he retired than come back and play. He blocks ces. I just don’t think there’s a chance that ces would be making more of an impact right now. I would love to see ces up here right now but we would have to ship an everyday player of some kind to make that happen. I think Newman is a very valuable player right now. Nick Senzel has had hiccups but he’s a very valuable player too. They fit in more on our team than they will with anyone else. They’ve been put into a position to succeed and they have. That’s what happens when people around you perform….. it’s contagious
I’m confused. Today Bell did the thing all the armchair managers have been wanting to see him do more often, and it worked just as we hoped. Are we supposed to be stunned by the result, or by the fact that Bell did it?
By the fact that Bell did it. (I have no problem with Bell’s bullpen management. I believe he’s been protecting Sims from further injury.)
Did what?
Bell seems to have inserted a certain energy into this team. A never say die sort of drive. Bell seems to have improved and takes blame when he screws up. What will you guys do when Bell wins Manager of the Year? I really think he has a chance (and Krall has basically already won for exec).
I’ve apparently missed Bell taking blame for screwing up. What did he admit screwing up?
I don’t think most of us are understanding how Bell contribute to this team. It’s HIS team. It plays the way he played. Despite its gaps, this team is winning and that’s a reflection of Bell’s leadership.
Good for Bell. He learned something, even if he should have learned it awhile ago.
Just like it took him a long time to figure out that Friedl can hit lefties or that Newman should not hit leadoff against righties. He still hasn’t learned not to bat Newman leadoff against lefties. And he also still hasn’t learned how to construct the lineup for maximum efficiency (hint: India should not be hitting 3rd).
He does learn. Slowly, but he does. I’ll take whatever progress there is as a positive sign.
I can’t disagree.
You should DM Bell, tweet at him or something. Your talents are being wasted on RLN.
Nope, not my job.
Bell will figure it out. Eventually. Like I said, he’s slow, but he does eventually come around to the correct solution.
I’m reminded of Churchill’s quote: “The Americans will always do the right thing after they have exhausted all the alternatives.”
Replace “The Americans” with “David Bell”, and it pretty accurately sums him up.
You are such a wasted talent.
This win is gonna take the steam out of the haters who stormed the gates and conquered RLN yesterday.
Fantastic win, exciting baseball. Guaranteed 1st place at the AS break. There isn’t a single Reds fan on Earth that predicted that. I hope Krall finds a way to get the rotation the help it clearly needs and doesn’t waste this moment.
It was like they thought the Reds would never win another game. I just ignore them.
Random thoughts:
1. Shout out and thank you to Dennis, Jonathan and others for complimenting my posts on Wednesday and Thursday. It feels good to be appreciated for my work. Much better than being told I have little knowledge about the Big Red Machine when the reasoning behind the statement was clearly pointed out in my post.
2. Update on the Reds OPS+
2023 Platoon: 1095.2
1976: 1077
2023: 1058
1975: 1001
3. Now that Joey Votto’s OPS (1.050) is greater than CES (.992) maybe it is time to put to rest bringing up CES.
4. Runs per game (for 2023 since the calling up of ELDC)
2023: 5.90
DH adjusted 2023: 5.65
1976: 5.29
1975: 5.19
5. Nick Senzel had a great final two innings in the finale vs. Washington. I say we don’t trade him unless we get a huge offer. And that isn’t happening.
6. Joey Votto is playing like he is 25 again. Has the atmosphere in this clubhouse unaged him. He has the highest OPS on the team right now. I think he will be in a Reds uniform in 2024 and possibly 2025. This is a problem for CES.
7. Two trades the Reds should make:
a. Blake Snell for Carlos Jorge and Lyon Richardson
b. Logan Allen for Arroyo and Jay Allen
8. Everyone should spend some time at RedsMinorLeagues.com next week. The draft is approaching and Doug does great work in covering the draft.
9. Doug should also update his top 25 this month. It will be interesting to see his new top 25 with the graduations of Steer, EDLC, McLain and Abbott by the 19th of July. Will the Reds first pick on Sunday make Doug’s top 5? Even with the four graduates just mentioned, my top five of Collier, Petty, Marte, CES and Cabrera will be a difficult one to crack.
As someone who has read a number of your post over the years, they are always thoughtful and interesting. Keep them coming!
Thanks BK
Good stuff, Stock. You make it easy for a guy like me to digest these key stats.
Joey looks completely healed. While I don’t think anybody should consider 2024 at this point, I do think this 2023 version of Joey is legit. And he’s humble about it, willing to play or sit when it suits the team’s needs.
I’ll be interested to see what transpires in the “smoke filled rooms” next week and if we go into the 2nd half with another starting pitcher. Good advice on letting Doug lead us through the draft. He really shines on that front.
Thanks Mark. I know I will be on RML tomorrow night.
A lot to ponder in this, but about #7 – did you run that thru the trade value calculator? It’s very intriguing if realistic.
I am interested to see what people think of these two offers. I know some posters (Greenfield Red) are against trading prospects. But people against trading prospects may be okay with trading prospects for prospects. Arroyo’s path is blocked right now.
I like the Snell offer the most though. Snell is a FA at the end of the year. Snell is good enough to offer him Arbitration. So if he leaves and signs elsewhere the Reds get him 2 months and hopefully the playoffs. Then they get an additional 1st round pick next July. But from what I have seen I think he will resign with the Reds. Watch a Joey Votto interview. He is so excited about being a part of this team. I think everyone would be. The Reds have plenty of cash and if they provide a competitive offer he would resign. Just my gut feeling here.
Additionally, trading for a player like Snell sends a message that the Reds want to win. The Reds need to sign EDLC to a Wander Franco type contract this winter. Sign McLain long term. Sign Benson long term. And sign Friedl and Fraley long term. These five have so much energy. Sign them this winter. Send a message this month that they want to win. Just my thoughts.
PS. Greenfield Red I did not verify you were the one not wanting to trade prospects for veterans. If this wasn’t you I am sorry for placing your name to this. If it is you I would love your opinion on the second trade (or anyone who is against trading prospects).
OK Stock – I just ran it thru the simulator, and it’s almost straight up Jorge for Snell, which is what I was thinking. Richardson nearly doubles the return to the Padres. All of which is likely due to the money and short term vs. the years of control of Jorge/Richardson.
I’m not adamant about prospects for veterans, but I do lean toward pitching for pitching/hitting for hitting.
All that said, the have so much youth, and so many starters rehabbing, I’d lean toward relief pitching at the deadline, but if they can get a quality rental starter that would be hard to pass on.
Hey Stock, thanks for caring about my thoughts. And, yes, I am not for trading any of these young guns. I think the Reds are in a unique position to become dominant, and I think Arroyo could an an all-star type SS or maybe better in his career. So, I would not want to trade him unless they are receiving an all-star type potential player in return who is similar potential but at a position of need (i.e. a 19 year old Luis Castillo type).
I prefer to not trade Carlos Sanchez, but I do think his current 1.5 year’s worth of stats value him higher than his future will turn out to be. So if they can turn his hot start into a pitcher who will help this year and maybe next, I could go with that.
A trade of Carlos Sanchez and/or maybe a Blake Dunn type is the kind of trade in the margins I write about when I talk about not trading away the future. There is evidence building that the 2023 Reds can be more than an easy first round opponent for LA or Atlanta, so some improvement, again on the edges, could be really good.
And again, all of this is just my opinion.
One more thought for you Stock is that you and I both are on the Joe Boyle bandwagon, but, he has not stepped forward this year. Some other organization may think they can straighten him out. So if you combine Dunn and Boyle or Sanchez and Boyle, the Reds may get a nice reliever back. And although there is still potential in those guys it is unrealized in every way right now.
Thoughts?
Good post Stock. I still think bring up CES. He will only make our team stronger. We need that when we’re “going for it all”. :)…and I think we are.
Thanks Melvin.
I assume you release Casali when you bring up CES. You don’t bring up CES unless you plan to play him. Who do you bench?
Votto has been fantastic.
Benson has been better.
The Fraley/Senzel platoon is fantastic.
Friedl needs to play everyday.
You can’t bench EDLC or McLain.
Steer has been great.
India has been average. But I would not risk the chemistry of this to play CES.
Everytime you play CES you have to bench India or a player better than him. I keep him in AAA and let him play everyday. Is CES a trade candidate? Possibly. I think Votto is coming back in 2024.
I would be all in on adding CES and Espino to the Guardian trade above.
Stock – I’ve talked about this in the past and I know BK has too as well as some others. All that needs to be done is move Stephenson to full time catcher and he sits when he needs a break without DHing. You take the other eight from today’s lineup, add CES, then rotate giving everyone a day off from starting every nine games or so. Everyone stays fresh and the bench is improved immensely.
I love your stuff Stock. I don’t always agree with your conclusions from the statistics but you are one of the most thought provoking contributors on RLN. Keep ’em coming!
Thanks Redsvol. The exact reason I compared the current 2023 offense to the 1975 offense was exactly a thought provoking task. That and partly because I am so excited about this offense.
Knowledgeable baseball observers have long said that BRM of 1975 and 1975 is the Best. NL. Team. Ever. They’re right.
You’re Not. Even. Close.
Do the standings go by best OPS+ and ERA+ or best W-L record?
Your post was your opinion. Nothing else.
So I did OPS+ and ERA+ comparison.
2023 OPS+ 98 and ERA+ 9. 0-0 in playoffs.
1990 OPS+ 95 (107 if P excluded like now) and ERA+ 118. 8-2 in playoffs.
1976 OPS+ 120 (129 if P excluded like now) and ERA+ 100. 7-0 in playoffs.
1975 OPS+ 108 (117 if P excluded like now) and ERA+ 107. 7-3 in playoffs.
Yep – most never even get to the up-the-middle-defense. 4 consecutive years GGs at C, 2b, SS, CF.
Different game, different era, but still . . .
Johnny Bench once said something like that the biggest honor he gets from playing on the Big Red Machine is everyone comparing other teams to them. They are the standard that everyone wants to match. 🙂
Read my post Oldtimer. I never once said this is the best team ever. It isn’t even the best team in 2023. Possibly not in the top 10 this year.
But I am saying this is a fantastic offense. The #9 hitter in the lineup has an OPS of .888. This team never quits. This team has great chemistry, instincts and talent.
Did I say the 2023 offense is better than the 1975 offense? Let me quote what I wrote:
“Is the 2023 offense better than the 1975 offense? The 1975 offense was one of the best of all time. One might argue the 1975-1976 Big Red Machine was the best offense of all time. But lets compare the first 3 months of stats of the current lineup vs. 1975. For some players the stats are less than 3 months since EDLC, Benson and McLain spent time in AAA.”
I created my post as an informative post, similar to this one. I am excited about this offense and wanted to share my excitement with a well received post by everyone but you. I compared the 1975 team to the 2023 team. I also compared the 1975 offense to the 1976 offense and the last sentence of the first paragraph was as follows:
“Fortunately, Morgan has his career year and the 1976 offense is even better than that of 1975.”
No. Just no. This made me LOL.
and
Since you don’t know much about the BRM in the mid 1970s, the best offense among those Reds teams was 1976
I am sure most people on here would say that I know my baseball including the BRM. Your condesending remarks were uncalled for and not necessary.
Go back and read the post. I never said the 2023 offense is better than the 1975 offense. And you slammed me because I did not know the 1976 offense was better than the 1975 offense. Problem is I stated that the 1976 offense was better in my post.
My post was not my opinion as you state here. I never said which offense was better. My post was strictly a comparison. If you don’t like my posts that is fine. Don’t read them. However, I would appreciate you not twisting my posts into something they are not.
Optimist ran my trade proposal through the trade generator and determined my offer for Snell was too much. I loved his post. I don’t mind being wrong when I am wrong. I just think Richardson will be limited to being an opener and therefore don’t provide him much value. But I admit Optimist is probably right.
Melvin and I disagree about bringing up CES and having his start to give give the other players a day off every week or two The idea of keeping players fresh is intriguing, but don’t agree to benching a superior player weekly for a less talented player. I have no idea if the lesser player will be offset by having fresh players so he may be right. I just disagree.
I am a stat geek and love sharing my insights and stats with those on here. I think my posts sometimes educate people on here. I know posts of people on here have educated me. If you disagree with me post your disagreement on here. Please don’t be condesending and tell me I know nothing about the BRM or baseball, especially when you know that I know my stuff.
I forgot to state that the following two quotes were from you.
No. Just no. This made me LOL.
and
Since you don’t know much about the BRM in the mid 1970s, the best offense among those Reds teams was 1976
Thanks for doing a comparison Oldtimer.
“2023 OPS+ 98 and ERA+ 9. 0-0 in playoffs.”
Your comparison is way different than mine. I was comparing the offense of the past month to the BRM. Your comparison is comparing the lineup that included Myers, Vosler, Newman and Barrero.
Thanks for letting me know that a lineup that includes Myers, Vosler, Newman and Barrero is inferior to the 1975 offense. I hear that guy named Morgan had a pretty good year in 1975.
I agree Melvin. The Big Red Machine is the Gold Standard. It is still early but I am excited to see if the current group of players can compare. They have had a great 30 days, but the baseball season is a long one and time will tell.
I will say I have never been more excited to watch a team play before. That includes the BRM of the 70’s.
Oldtimer makes a great point that the big Red Machine was not only a great offense but very good defensively. I do like the left side of the 2023 team a little more than the 1975-1976 pair of Rose and Concepcion. I also love Friedl’s defense but when you compare him to Geronimo he loses defensively. Morgan and Bench were fantastic defensively and India and Stephenson are below average.
Great posts this entire season! I read everyone’s post, but yours are well researched, and thoughtful. You’re my number one poster. Someone in redleg nation seems a tad envious, just ignore it.
keep up the excellent posts.
“Which major league starting pitcher was the starter in 26 games won by his team in 2023, while finishing the season with a 2-2 record and an ERA of 7.52?”
Weaver? ?
We’ll find out!
I’m still stunned. And then we get the very good version of Diaz to nail it down. Counsel had to be baffled beyond belief. And, quite frankly, he got run out on what looked like a bogus call and an over-zealous Chumpire. I think he was asking for an explanation when he approached. But them’s the breaks, right?
Yeah.Diaz’s velocity had been down to 92 and 93 but after a couple of games off against the Nats and again last night he hit 95/96 on the gun today and his slider was just nasty to Wink and Yelich.Counsell is a really good manager but these umps well kinda of wear their feelings on their shoulders sometimes and at times kind of dismiss the manager when they should listen and then explain the call.
I feel like all season many umpires have been giving the boot way to quickly for many silly things.
Lots of “Notes Worth Noting”. Must be fun to right about games like this. De La Cruz highlights will be around the nation tonight. Votto is becoming a glue for this young team.
Yep…Votto is the glue. I really believe without his presence in the order yesterday and today this game probably doesn’t turn out this way and likely looking at a three-game sweep tomorrow. Joey was the stabilizing force that settled everybody down. Now switch he and India, move him back to 3 and India to 6 to fix that rather glaring problem and lets roll into the 2nd half
Kudos to the Bullpen. I do hope the rotation is addressed soon. Bullpen is solid, however another lefty wouldn’t hurt.
One last thought, Williamson has looked okay his last few starts. Something to build on, Ashcraft well again Something to build on. Then Abbott. A bad game which we all knew was coming.
Until Greene and Lodolo get back to the rotation. Well…..
Lodolo wasn’t good before he got injured. Greene was mostly good before IL.
Maybe Lodolo wasn’t good because he was injured (we knew he was pitching with what they all thought at the time was some weird calf discomfort – it was probably due to the stress fracture they didn’t know about).
Most likely he was injured. I agree.
Lodolo pitched well in his first 3 starts of the year. He had a 2.12 ERA and 17 innings pitched going into his April 19 game against Tampa Bay.
From there, things really fell apart. He suddenly started giving up a ton of home runs and struggled to last 5 innings. It would seem right about this time is when he started feeling his injury, as his pitches were missing that bite and movement that led to his success before. It would make sense that if he could not firmly plant his front leg, he couldn’t get leverage on his pitches any more.
I have high hopes Lodolo will return to form once he’s fully healed. The Lodolo we saw in the 4 games before he went on the IL was clearly an injured, struggling Lodolo. If he comes back healthy, he should go right back to being a top of the rotation quality pitcher.
This is about as bizarre a statement as I’ve read in awhile.
Lodolo was hurt before he went on the IL as many players are.
He didn’t go on the IL while he was healthy.
His injury wasn’t a traumatic one, but a progressive one.
How hard is that to think through?
Note: Greene and Lodolo are two different people with two different injuries.
Comparing them in this way is pointless.
You’ve tried to make this supposed point about Lodolo before but it isn’t anymore credible than the first time.
What I liked about Elly during that whole steal thing was his “baseball knowledge”. I mean, while he was at bat, he got 2 strikes on himself, then he buckled down, looked like he was thinking, “Just make contact”, and he did that, getting a single in the process and driving in a run.
Then, “baseball knowledge” again. Most players, after stealing any base, may consider calling TO, take some time, wait for the pitcher to get to the stretch again, etc. After Elly stole third and saw no C throw to 3rd, Elly never really did stop. As the C had the ball, Elly just took a couple of small steps off 3rd. As the C starting throwing the ball back to the P, Elly started lengthening his lead. Then, when the P starting “goofing around” with whatever when he got the ball back, all while that time Elly was lengthening his lead even more, Elly seemingly said, “Let’s go.”
Baseball knowledge, baseball intuition, whatever you want to call it, I loved to see it. It wasn’t just “talent”, which I believe is just physical. It was “mental talent”, also.
Good description of what happened. He kept his head in the game and swiped home by a wide margin. Absolutely ELECTRIC!!
As soon as the pitcher turned his back on EDLC, I was thinking “Oooh, you’re gonna regret that.”
Great points all the way around. It kind of goes with Elly’s struggles hitting righty for the first month, but then the last two or three games hitting right handed it seems like he’s getting it figured out. He is a quick study. It is going to be a lot of fun to see the kids wearing number 44 jerseys this summer. I would imagine by next summer the number of 44 jerseys in the Reds Ballpark will be ridiculous and probably popping up around Major League ballparks everywhere.
Maybe Nike will give him his own shoe? 😉 Air Cruz? 🙂
Great post Steve. I love EDLC baseball instincts. After the game they interviewed the third base coach. He was ready to give EDLC a high 5 after stealing third but said Elly would have none of it. He knew as soon as he got the steal he may have a chance to score on the same play.
Welcome to EDLC baseball.
@stock – im not a big Blake snell fan…think he is over-rated plus his attitude at the end with the Ray’s. Shane Beiber (sp). Would be a different story for me. I would rather sign Madison bumgarner and trade for michael lorenzen.
I would keep Arroyo as SS in 2025. Then McLain can go to 2nd Base with ELDC to 3rd base.
Idk. Snell would be a high priced rental, but he’s very good. Their park is pitcher friendly but his road era is even better (2.72 vs 3.40).
He could help the Reds win the division and battle for the 2 seed.
Interesting what Yelich said….if you have a chance then go for it because you don’t know when it will happen again. Mortgage the future? No, but all these young guys won’t make it or atleast won’t make it with the Reds. I trust Krall…..how can you not at this point?
I agree with you. I mean, with our SS prospects, we have 4 SS’s projected for 2026 for the big club. Why do we need 4 SS’s in 2026? Make the trade, or move their position. It’s quite simple.
I agree with you on Arroyo JL. He might be redundant next year but in 3 years (He is in A ball) I don’t think he will be. India will likely be gone – meaning an opening in the infield.
If anyone is redundant it is probably Marte – unless they make him a left or right fielder. But Marte better get us more than a 2 month rental. Marte could be the centerpiece for a Bieber or Cease or someone with another year or two of control.
Weaver may be known as the most inefffective and luckiest pitcher in baseball history.
Keep it up, Weavz!
I would love to see some posts on the following during the break and would even be willing to write a post or two but because I am a bit controversial, I doubt that would ever be a consideration.
1. Who will win the Reds Rookie of the year? The Reds have 5 contestants thus far (Steer, McLain, EDLC, Williamson and Abbott). Will someone catch Corbin Carroll? Will Benson has few enough AB to qualify as a rookie but has exactly 45 days on Cleveland’s roster last year. In essence he is the 6th Reds rookie.
2. During last night’s Reds baseball game broadcast, it was mentioned that the addition of EDLC made other players better and as a result produced more wins for his team. I agree. It would be a great read if someone wrote an article on this.
3. A trade posting. Some should pick one or two trades and explain why they make sense for both teams. Then they should ask others to submit proposals or explain why they don’t want a trade. Many on here are against trading prospects for 2023. Here are the two trades I would love the Reds to make (Please note that one of these trades avoids the prospect dilemma):
a. Blake Snell for Carlos Jorge and Lyon Richardson
b. Logan Allen for Edwin Arroyo and Jay Allen
4. What to do with Joey Votto in 2024. You have CES ready but Votto is a stud this year. Should the club exercise his option or choose the payout? Is Votto going to call it quits after this year (I say no)? Will he be in a Reds uniform in 2025?
5. Do the Reds try to sign EDLC and/or any other players to long term contracts similar to the ones signed by Ronald Acuna, Wander Franco, Hunter Greene and Albies?
6. Do the Reds trade Jonathan India this month? This winter? I say no to this month because I would not want to disrupt the chemistry this team has. I say yes to this winter because:
a. He is, at best, the 7th best offensive player on this team.
b. The team would improve defensively with McLain at 2B, EDLC at SS and
Marte at 3B. This team would probably improve offensively with CES at DH
and Steer at 3B.
+1,000 for laying down a good challenge.
I’ll answer one for you. Number 5. Sign EDLC ASAP to at least 10 years. The longer you wait the more expensive it will be and the less likely it will be the Reds that do it. I’m already confident that he is at least reasonably durable.
I agree Melvin. A while ago on either this site or RML I commented that EDLC was a hall of famer. Nothing he has done in the last 30 days has changed my mind.
Say Hey its EDLC. Maybe it is too quick to make this comparison, especially since I consider Mays the best player of all time.
4) With Votto, only if he has a monstrous season. He’s done it before, but no one, including me, a Votto fan, is expecting it.
Plus, I would feel pressured more to go ahead and bring CES up, making him pretty much the year long DH. I mean, you can’t hold that guy in the minors that long.
5) With Elly, I was just thinking that myself. I was thinking. . .I normally wait till at least 1.5 seasons before I even think about extending any youngster. For, I want to see how they perform after the league makes their adjustments.
But, Elly definitely would have me rethinking some of that.
6) Then what with India? Don’t get me wrong. I’m an Elly fan. But, I feel he’s being misused here. He’s a much better leadoff hitter than 3-hole hitter. But, with the emergence of Friedl, Bell doesn’t want to fool with that, which I can understand.
But, because of that, Bell apparently has no problem putting a hitter in the 3 hole who has simply a horrible slash line for the last month?! Do something else with him. Right now, it would even make sense to make him tradebait, with how much he’s helping us in the 3-hole.
1) I give it to all of them. If I had to pick one, right now, I give it to McLain actually.
2) I believe Elly has definitely lifted this team some.
3) I’m not getting into trades. Too much analysis necessarily to make trades reasonable.
Thanks for the post Steve. I am torn between McLain and Steer at this point. Based upon stats I go with Steer at this point. But if you include intangibles maybe McLain is the pick.
1. I’m still in the Spencer Steer camp. But MattyMc is a very close 2nd.
2. Anecdotally, Votto’s interviews have suggested exactly this. Everybody is better as a result right now.
4. Unless a wave of miracles happen, we need the money in 2024 and beyond for other positions. I think 2023 is the last lap for Joey and he’s certainly doing his part.
5. Maybe sign EDLC. There are others such as you have mentioned. Boras will have a lot to say about how long and how much.
6. Not until the offseason when things have settled. If he stays, it probably needs to be LF or maybe 3B (though we have better 3B candidates in the fold now).
1) EDLC, and it won’t be close. If it’s 1st half ROY, the Steer.
3) Most don’t like my trades, but I’d say if you can get a guy like Snell, Giolito, or Bieber I would think we should move some pretty good pieces to make it happen.
4) Way too early to say, but if this Votto sticks around you pick up his option.
5) Yes, in the offseason I look to do a “Greene” deal with EDLC, and a toned down version for McLain, or Steer, but not all 3.
6) Below is my batting order.
1 EDLC 2 McLain 3 Friedl
4 Steer 5 Votto 6 Stephenson
7 Fraley 8 India 9 Benson
There isn’t a 8 hole hitter that I’m afraid to trade.
Great post MBS.
I think your 1. is spot on.
3. I would not trade for Bieber because I think he is injured but am open to Snell, Giolito and Cease.
6. I am okay with your lineup. I may do something on my lineup later today or during the all-star break. Benson’s OPS since his call up in May is 1.089. How nice is it to have a hitter with an OPS greater than 1 hitting in the 9 hole. This is the exact reason I wrote my original post. The depth of this lineup is incredible. There is no fall off.
Agree on all your points about trading India
Thanks Ted
1. Right now steer because he’s done it all year. He’s going to finish the year with RoY numbers considering his current pace. His season is better than India’s was.
2. Certainly a different energy. I was texting my friends because after vottos homer Elly celebrated at the plate with him and then they went and watched video together on the dugout. Gotta love him taking advantage of a HoF teammate.
3. I think you’ll overpay for a top flight starter. Maybe you can snag a guy, but it’s risky, especially since there have been a ton of injuries so everyone is thin on pitching to some degree. The real problem is there are a lot of teams who aren’t out of it yet, and the ones that are out of it are basically there because they can’t pitch. I’d look at another lefty reliever and another multi inning guy if possible. Trading for a starter is an offseason job, but you should have the firepower to do it.
4. If you win the WS, votto retires. He cares about his legacy and I think that would be everything he’d ever want to accomplish. He wants to go out on top. My hunch is regardless the front office will decline the option. They want to go younger, and they will do everything they can to be respectful to joey, but I believe the plan is all available dollars are going to extend core young players and find multi year contract pitchers.
5. Probably 1 more. Maybe 2. Others will ride through Arb. There are a couple players I still have some doubts over. McClain strikes out a ton and doesn’t walk. Hard to sustain being a .300 hitter with a high whiff rate. The plus side is he is a good defender. While Elly is electric, he also is striking out a lot and not walking. It might not matter because he’s so toolsy but it’s something to watch with his development. He’s also only an ok defender, which again makes it a little tough to slot where he plays. Benson has been heavily protected against lefties, but at worst is a good platoon option. He’s also only a so so defender who should really be left field only. I like Steers patience-power approach and he has gotten a lot more comfortable at first. Even guys like the cowboy are saying he looks like the next first basemen for the reds. My point though is all these guys are playing well now. But they are gonna have a year of film on them for next year. They will have to make adjustments. No guarantee there aren’t some major struggles in that group. I wouldn’t be in a huge rush to extend everyone, but a couple of them I’d consider.
6. In the offseason sure. He needs to be able to go hit leadoff somewhere. If he’s doing that he’s a top 10 leadoff hitter. He’s at his best hitting line drives in the gap, working counts, getting on base and running. There are plenty of teams who could overlook any defensive shortcomings for his top of the lineup production. He’d be a great chip for a proven pitcher. Right now though you gotta let the locker room ride it.
Hey Sparky,
I love your analysis on #5. Great job. I agree 100% on #6
If Votto finishes the year with a slash line over .300/.400/.500, I think the Reds need to spend the money on his option. Two reasons – one, the chance he stays hot one more year and two, for the positive influence he has on this team. I know that doesn’t exactly align talent to resources but this winning window is too important.
Good point Tom.
Can’t believe how far Winker has fallen.
He’s a Lost Boy now. Hope he sacked away a bunch of money.
It seems like that knee and neck surgery really messed with him, physiologically.
Maybe he can still come back. Apparently the surgery on his neck was quite serious.
It has been almost sad watching him this year with the Brewers. I really was hoping he could come back since he used to hit so well in Miller Park.
Other teams anywhere near or around us in any sort of race. . .
Phillies lost, which means Marlins won.
AZ won.
Giants won.
So, for division leaders (who has the top seeds)
AZ is upon us by 2. (I won’t even mention Atlanta).
If it ends up being necessary:
Behind Miami by 1.5
Behind by the Dodgers by 1
Ahead of Phillies by 1
Ahead of Giants by 1.5
I’m going to focus on the positives, which are Elly, and really the offense as a whole, as well as the lockdown bullpen we got today. Really encouraging to see Diaz looking a bit more like his dominant self.
Random question on Diaz, what is the deal with his pant leg? Do his pants not fit correctly, or is it a superstitious thing? It honestly makes me laugh, he adjusts it constantly.
Wade Miley pitching tomorrow. Casali is batting 400, and Senzel 333 against Miley. I would like to Votto play and Benson as well tomorrow. Friedl as well
We need to put our absolute BEST lineup out there tomorrow taking into consideration “who is hot” when thinking about platoons. You want my opinion? Same as today with maybe a different batting order. Reading about the BRM Sparky didn’t always have a set lineup with the “Great Eight”.
1000% agree
My prediction:
Newman (dh)
McLain (ss)
India (2nd)
Elly (3rd)
Steer (lf)
Votto (1st)
Stephenson (c)
Senzel (rf)
Frieldl (cf)
Votto at first base and hitting 6th is the surprise twist.
J – You may very well be right. Hope not. I’d like to see Fraley and Benson back in there too. Keep the momentum going for players and the team. If you think those two are weak against the pitcher then put them down in the lineup. Senzel did have a big game recently so who knows? At least Benson.
J if we’re going for our “best” lineup in a “must win,” and they roll out Newman at DH hitting lead off, I’ll lay down exactly where I’m at and just die
And now I’m sad…
DHud – haha Well don’t die. I doubt there are many who would rather have Newman leadoff today at DH rather than Benson…except David Bell. 🙂 Need to win this game.
Have a bad feeling it’s going to be the getaway day lineup. Everyone gets a turn to play montra from Bell.
The Reds need some pitching. Usually I’m not a fan of any trade that includes the phrase “and hopefully we can get him to sign an extension beyond this year,” because my assumption is there’s roughly a zero percent chance it will happen. But this might actually be the year when it makes sense. First, the Reds should have some money to spend on pitching for the next few years, and second, who *wouldn’t* want to come pitch for this team right now? It’s almost impossible to lose no matter how badly you pitch, and you get to watch Elly every day. GO GET A RENTAL PITCHER.
I agree. I bet Votto is having the most fun he’s ever had in his career.
The Cheeseburger belly Griffey/Dunn era had no pitching and little fire. Way back in the standings and an effort to match. The Cueto/Homer/Latos period was solid, but pitcher oriented and not particularly exciting. This is a whole new era and who wouldn’t want to be involved if the money was competitive.
I totally agree. Something like a #2 starter with minimum injury history, high innings load, and 1-2 years left on his contract. There no guarantee this Greene and Lodolo injury situation won’t carry over into 2024. Age and salary less important than the above. Get the guy you need to compete in the playoffs. Sooner rather than later.
Again, I’m old enough to remember when Willie Mays used to steal home! EDLC is definitely NOT human!
But he is sure fun to watch. I just love his instincts and baseball intelligence.
Reds did what they needed to do.
Beat the Brewers and stay in first place
Outstanding
Go reds
Krall has some work to do the next few weeks
Yes.
Now, that’s more like it! I’m very glad to be wrong in my sweep prediction, and I couldn’t have asked for a better game. The Reds played like themselves, with the EDLC highlights acting as a perfect illustration of this team’s relentless grit.
Votto still bangs, and I say leave him where he is. It’s India who needs to move somewhere else in the line-up, and maybe (just maybe) the All-Star Break will strike Bell as a good time to shake things up. I couldn’t help but feel bad for Winker after that strike-out (he’s below the Mendoza line!), but I was thrilled with how sharp Diaz looked.
Reds really should take the game tomorrow, but hey, now the pressure’s off. Now you cruise into the break with a lead on the rest of the division, and you know you can beat this “Brew Crew” nonsense. Just don’t let Wade Miley throw a no-hitter or something. GO REDS.
Can’t rest though. Miley got smacked around pretty good by the Cubs. Reds should use Ashcraft for 2 innings atleast somewhere in the game. Go all out to go up 3 at the break. If the Reds win tomorrow then say they split the remaining 6 with Milw in July. That leaves them 3 up with Milw playing at Philly for 3 and 6 with Atlanta in July.
The Reds could start to put the division away and start managing Abbott’s innings and preparing for October
Sounds like a plan. I also would go all out, and pitch Ashcraft some and anyone else that could toss an inning or two. It would be a big deal to win tomorrow,…but Miley is a man. I wish we still had him. It was a mistake to let him get away. Cutter in,..then change up away. That’s his game. When he gets on a roll with that, he can surely hang a string of zeros up on the board. He’s mentally tough. But you just never know. I also didn’t think we had a prayer today with Weaver going for us. And we would not have, had we not got him out of there in the 4th inning. He pitched 4 innings too long, if you ask me. Go Reds!!!
Yep… but can’t be happy to just win one today. If you win tomorrow you go into the break up three games with huge Mo on your side…and with the Brewers coming to your house feeling down where you can put your foot on their throat right out of the gate and totally take control of the division. Have to field your best lineup tomorrow and all hands on deck with the pitching staff. No reason to let any pitcher get into trouble…first sign of trouble should mean captain Hook. It also means Friedl, Votto, Benson and Senzel all start vs Miley.
I am worried about Wade Miley’s Revenge against the Reds. I have a feeling the guy is going to pitch his heart out against us tomorrow. Hope I’m wrong.
The first time the Reds played the Brewers it was pre-Elly and pre-Votto. Not the same team this time around. The first game they went against an ace. Tough to score 8 vs. Burnes and that bullpen.
This team just doesn’t quit. It applies pressure the entire game. Fun to watch but so difficult to play against.
My greatly appreciate informed baseball analysis in 2 words….Holy smokes
Luke Weaver DFA’d.
Not really, but one can dream.
If that’s going to happen, it will only be after a trade or when Greene and/or Lodolo are back. The Reds simply don’t have enough starting pitchers, especially with Lively out injured too.
Abbott
Ashcraft
Williamson
Kennedy
Weaver
That’s the best they can do in the short term
Don’t agree, not even with Stoudt stinking up the joint too. I’d go with Kennedy and Lively and then give Connor Phillips a shot. Nobody had to live with a 7 era except for maybe Oakland. What about this Mariot guy? Weaver couldn’t put up a 2.59 era in Lville. Not in their new Pacific Coast league era
Do you think Santillan could do better than Weaver? He came in as a starter. Then, they could bring Kennedy back up for long relief? A starter with a 7.00 ERA is just such a liability. I know they won today but knowing a team is getting a 4 or 5 spot every fifth game stinks.
First place at the break. GO REDS!
I wonder if they ever consider stretching Sims out. He came up through the Braves org as a starter. They seem to know what they’re doing.
@GMan88
The Reds are not going to turn Santillan back into a starter, especially when he’s just coming back from a serious back injury.
The best hope is Lively comes back from his injury soon and he takes Weaver’s spot. I heard a few days ago he was supposed to pitch tomorrow against the Brewers, but haven’t heard any updates since then. He could be ready at the start of the 2nd half.
Once Greene and Lodolo are back, I would personally go with a rotation of:
Greene
Abbott
Ashcraft
Lodolo
Lively
With Williamson and Kennedy moved to the bullpen to replace Cruz and Duarte. I prefer Williamson in the ‘pen instead of Lively because Young is currently the only lefty reliever. Having two of them would be huge.
Of course, this all assumes the Reds don’t make a trade for more pitching. I’d personally focus on getting a reliver or two and then look at getting another starter in the offseason. A reliever should come cheap, but a starter will come at a steep prospect cost in the middle of a season, since everyone is looking for pitching.
I think its worth trying Weaver in long relief before we DFA him. I’d try that for a couple weeks at least. His stuff might be sharper if he knew he only had to go 2 innings. And lord knows the bullpen is about burnt up.
Really hoping Antone can make it back in August and Krall can get a couple fresher arms for the pen. The Tigers and White Sox young bullpen guys intrigue me.
Not counting much on Antone. He will be lucky as sin if he pitches well again after how many major surgeries.
There are a couple guys I like too from the White Sox pitching wise.
Nope! Not while he’s on this roaring “winning” streak. Lol
Alright. Time to go and get Sears from the A’s (and couple of their relievers). Make it happen, Krall. 🙂
Elly could still be perfect in SBs … he overran 2b, but easily beat the throw on one .. the other was the attempt at home again where he clearly should’ve stopped.
The angels are probably going to sell Ohtani. The reds should go for it imo.
Was Krall in the front office when they put together the original package for Ohtani when he first came over?
I’d offer something like Fraley, their pick between Marte/CES, and their pick between Phillips/petty. I think that could get it done.
This clubhouse chemistry would give the reds a huge advantage in extension talk too. I think he would love playing here with this team.
Not to mention having him might make cinci a possible attractive destination for future Japanese players making the jump
I prefer to know who we are and stay in that lane. I think Krall understands this.
I’m not emptying my farm system for a rental, which is what Ohtani would be. There is no way Ohtani would ever sign an extension with the Reds and miss free agency.
Completely agree not the right move at all. Otani is going to probably break the record for highest player paid per season ever.
Reds could use their money much better in my opinion.
Agree and furthermore, does this team need to pay of Ohtani’s bat?
I don’t think Anaheim even returns that phone call….
The good thing of Weaver’s outings is that the Reds give him a lot of run support, they consistently are in the scoreboard to be in the line while Weaver is throwing and after he is hooked, Reds finish it scoring some more runs to get the lead and the BP holds it.
Incredibly what EDLC can do, he is a great game changer… The most outstanding is he is 21 and just about 30 games in the big leagues….
Trade-wise, I think the Reds might have a few guys that could pry a solid reliever: Hopkins, Barrero, maybe a Reynolds or Alejo Lopez could be filler. If they want to go big, then to me the guy to trade is Arroyo. I would not have said that prior to the season, because I wasn’t completely sold on McLain. But he and Elly are now blocking the path to SS and Cabrera is coming fast behind Arroyo. So, he would be the centerpiece. Just not sure how much his stock has dropped this year with his fairly pedestrian numbers. Another guy that might hold some good value with upside as a secondary piece is Hinds.
I would also consider Newman as a piece to bring back someone that could start in AAA and be available as a spot starter or long reliever at some point. No one with a high ceiling, but maybe a guy with a contract a team wants to get off of.
I mentioned before something like. . .for example, we have 4 players/prospects slated for SS. One due to arrive in 2023 (Elly), one due to arrive in 2024 (Marte), one in 2025, and one in 2026. Now, why do we need 4 SS’s in 2026?
We have the players we can move. We need to either move them to other teams, getting something back we need, or we need to move their positions, getting them into positions we will need.
Electric Ell.
CES with his 19th HR tonight. Barrero is getting hot somewhat and has another HR too.
Make that 20 for CES. He just hit another one. 🙂
What in the h got into AAA this year? The Pacific Coast League went east and now everybody plays 10-8 games every other day. The Bats have 4 Hrs and they just now tied the game.
Looking at the box score and noticed Matt Wisler pitching for Toledo (3.03 era). He’s another of about 80 guys I’d take over Weaver that wouldn’t cost anything
They’s give Mariot a shot soon I think.
They’ll *
Yikes on CES.
The problem with trading for Ohtani is even if he would sign an extension with the Reds it would be for an astronomical amount which handicaps you too much in the future. Injuries happen all the time, not likely he’ll avoid them, especially as a pitcher and we don’t really need his bat. It’s also probably not great for the locker room when one guy is making 40 or 50 million dollars a year…pass. if you can get a #2 or #3 P that you can re-sign to a reasonable contract extension I’m okay giving up a couple of good prospects because we do have a serious log jam in the infield and I don’t know how some of these kids are ever going to play for the Reds the way McClain, Steer, Elly are playing…not to mention CES ready to come up etc.
For Ted
I have to agree. I mean, if we can get one young locked up, then possibly. Like Votto, when signed, $20 million might have been considered a lot. But, as each year came and past, $20 million was lunch money compared to what the stars, like Ohtani, are getting now.
What do I mean? Like Ohtani, he’s been in the league in his 6th season now. His next contract is going to be huge. But, Elly, if we can get him to sign now, it might seem expensive now, but it would be lunch money compared to what many of the players would be asking for later.
Like Votto said that shoulder has been hurting him for years. I just wish we had him at his strength all of these years. Geez, it would have been much more fun.
Oh, I definitely understand the “No” angle, also. There’s just something with this stuff where I just think all teams should have “that one player”. But, if we get him, we have to get him early. Like we did Votto.
Drury is having shoulder problems in LA. They may need more infield help.
I was at last night’s game as well as today’s game. Elly De La Cruz stealing home was worth the drive up here not to mention the price of admission.
There was a nice contingent of Reds fans along the third baseline. We got a few Elly chants in. I hope they made it on the broadcast.
This kid plays the game like it’s Little League: he has the joy of a Little Leaguer AND he makes other players look like they’re only in Little League. Case in point, Brian Anderson not covering third base when De La Cruz stole third or even standing near the bag afterwards allowing Elly to start sneaking down the line without worrying about being picked off.
I liked the stadium and the Brewers fans I talked to were nice. It’s called American Family Field now but they still just call it Miller Park. It’s a nice stadium but it’s better with the roof open.
Enjoy this team while you’ve got them folks!
I bet that was fun being there today. This team is something else.
Another thing I really appreciate about Elly is that he goes the other way so easily. He literally hits the ball all over the place. The power will come when he lays off the garbage and gets himself into better counts more frequently.
Yep, and you can already see he’s definitely starting to be a little more selective. I think his pitch recognition is ever so slowly improving, especially the breaking balls in the dirt, and when he starts making them throw more strikes because they’re terrified of walking him his HR numbers are going to Skyrocket
Benson
Yes!!!
.293 BA .388 OBP speaks for it self, no more caveats needed.
Almost lost in today’s circus is Joey now holding 2nd place for total bases by a Red. Passed the great Johnny Bench.
Cool
Votto has got 6 RBI’s this series out of 11 runs scored. 2023 Slugging .685…OPS 1050. He has spent almost all of his major league career hitting 3…so I think it’s time to just move him back home, start him there in the second half and see what he has left. Let’s not forget it’s likely he hasn’t been healthy with his shoulder for at least a couple of years. He looks to have more energy than I have seen from him in a long time. And It would be hard for anyone to perform worse than India has at 3 considering how many really good scoring chances he has just flat out destroyed hitting into double plays or striking out Etc. I think the potential upside ( which I think is huge) far outweighs the potential downside, which I think is negligible due to the fact Joey has already blended in well with the team hitting at 6 while sitting out more than he’s used to…so him going back to 6 if he isn’t hitting at 3 or sitting more etc would be no biggie to him or the team.
I can’t disagree.
Only part of the lineup I want to change is India going back to leading off and setting the table. then move everyone down one slot, Maybe move Stephanson up one slot in the lineup.
Obviously great game and I am thrilled win and EDLC was a huge part of that. I don’t know if anyone has mentioned in a post yet or not about Votto not touching home plate after his bomb while he was partying at home with the guys that scored ahead of him. If Elly was not heads up and pointed it out to Votto, most probably the pitcher throws to the catcher and Votto is out. If that were the case I would think only two runs score? If so that keeps us behind a run and could have easily cost us the game. I kind of feel like Votto owes the team and fans an apology. What do you all think?
This can’t be a serious comment
It’s serious until the apology. I’d rather hear the explanation – did Elly really point it out, or was Joey just fooling around with the ump. It’s worth a question.
Very serious…
Watch the replay… Votto had to return to step on home
People seriously think Votto should apologize to the fanbase. Yikes
I just looked at it. Votto did miss it. Geez, come on, Guy. We don’t need something miniscule like that to come back and bite our behinds.
No
I don’t think apology is the right word. What you witnessed was a veteran player who’s done this so many times for so many years that the repetition of it made him miss this routine step. The new rookie player is still fresh and alert to all the little matters of the game and alerted him. The umpire saw it. The catcher did not seem to notice as he was not looking down, but out. If it is not challenged by the catcher because he didn’t notice it, the umpire just moves on and the run is counted if the next pitch is thrown. Too late to challenge it after that. Instead of an apology I’d want acknowledgment that I won’t do that again.
Hey Steve,
What I saw was Votto excited and all too ready to celebrate with the guys in front of him and did not pay attention to touching the plate. You may be right but I am not sure that Brewers catcher did not notice. I would think that would be a basic routine for all catchers to watch to make sure a runner touched home plate when scoring. Guess we would have to ask him. IMO acknowledgement that he would not do it again is basically an apology. I am a huge JV fan but I thought it was an important enough of a play to mention. Thanks for your response. Have a good one. 🙂
Isn’t baseball a funny game? We all thought Benson was a total bum the first month of the season. Now he’s just another potential all star waiting. I hope Bell allows him to venture from being a platoon player. I think he should start every day.
I give credit to Bell as he has been starting him a lot more against lefties lately and Benson has been producing. I think Benson has the best eye of any player we have at the plate… he rarely strikes out or swings at bad balls and he gets a lot of walks that are really good walks. When you watch him swing against left-handers he is never bailing out or swinging at big breaking balls 2 ft outside etc. and he is usually right on the ball driving it hard somewhere.
I think McClain has the best eye. He Reminds me of Votto batting right-handed. Gives you great at-bats every time out. Not as much punch power wise as Votto though.
I think this is the next step isn’t it? Trying to see if Benson and Fraley are strict platoon players or capable of being all-around good hitters. It would certainly cement their position in the outfield for next few years if they could be average against lefties.
Guys that aren’t strict platoon players become much more valuable – to the Reds and to others during trade talks if needed down the road in 2-3 years.
One of the announcers said it during the telecast, so I thought I would just look.
Checked on MLB.com, for the last 30 days in the NL, Benson is 7th in the league in BA (and the highest Red), 5th in OBP (and the highest Red), 12th in SLB (Votto beats him there), and 5th in OPS (and the highest Red). And, remember, all of this includes players who really don’t even qualify for the “official stats” (Benson was one of them; I had to choose “all players”. But, there were players with just like 2 AB’s.).
And, he’s our #9 hitter? Am I missing something? Benson definitely deserves some discussion for ROY, I believe definitely deserves some play against left handers (just make sure to take some BP against a left hander. Do we have a LH BP pitcher?).
I think Bell has been keeping the pressure low on Benson. But I’m guessing he’ll move up the lineup in the second half.
In fact, I’m guessing there will be a line up shuffle post ASG. I’m actually only one Red made the ASG so everyone else can get some rest and treatment. It’s gonna be a fight to the finish.
It’s a bit surprising the Tribe gave up on Benson, but he just turned 25 so they must have been thinking it’s gotten too late. His stats have been all over the place as he came thru MiLB, but last year was very, very good. His BB/K ratio has been very consistent, while the other stats have swung around wildly, and that is a very useful skill.Would have thought that should have been enough for Cleveland to keep him.
Even if he’s not this good, if the Reds handle him well he could be valuable for a long time – if he is truly a late developer, already having the pitch recognition skill, he will be extremely valuable.
EDLC is the most electric player there is in the game today. I’m a reds fan but not a homer. I’m realistic and I’ve been waiting on him to heat up and maybe this will make him get the confidence he’s been missing. He always puts on like he’s confident but maybe now he really is. He always struggles for a little bit after he advances a level. Maybe he’s learned from getting thrown out a couple of times. He absolutely has an advanced baseball iq. He lulled them to sleep mentally and took complete advantage of them. He made them look inept. The rest of the league seen what happened and from now on they’ll be walking him back to the base like we’re watching babe Ruth baseball.
I believe, for trades, Krall and his boys may be planning to (hopefully) talk to some other execs during the AS break. I remember hearing some years ago that many trades will start that way.
That might be interesting.
Nickname for EDLC: Elly “Relampago” de La Cruz. Relampago, spanish for lighting!
I like Código de Trucos – Spanish for Cheat Code.
It’s weird that I can so vividly recall when we were all rooting for the Pirates to lose because they seemed to matter. Wasn’t that just a couple weeks ago?
Feels like just yesterday. I’m sure Pirates fans feel the complete inverse of what we’re feeling right now — the feeling of being hit by a bus, and not realizing they got hit until they’re halfway down the block.
Any idea yet who will be our starter tomorrow? I just looked on mlb.com, and every team has their starter up but us.
Mariot
Lively
It still just amazes me, as well as everybody else here.
I mean, I remember even saying that, if we can get something like 500 innings from our big 3 (Greene, Lodolo, and Ashcraft), I believe we might end up being decent this year. No division winner, mind you, but maybe a good 500 team. And, look now. Ashcraft just got off the IL. The other two are still on it. Our FO has been holding this pitching staff together with scotch tape and Elmer’s glue.
But, I can’t imagine anyone thinking the offense would be this good. No way. Top 6 in the NL in the 4 main statistical categories? If you try to say you thought this could happen, you would be lying through your teeth, lying right out the other end of your behind.
Not to mention a relieving crew that is 5th in the NL (at least in ERA), after last year, where they were 14th and no notable additions during the off season?
Part of me wants to say, “When are you going to get back to playing to your baseball card?” The other part of me is saying, “Never get back to playing to your baseball card.”
I’ll admit all Winter and Spring I have been trying to say that I didn’t think the Reds would be contenders until 2025. I will freely admit I was wrong about this team and it’s magical to watch each and every game now. Even in the losses I have fun watching the game. The energy and effort every player give is just outstanding.
I was a member of the chorus that kept singing, ‘play the young guys’, and here we are. Yesterday’s play by Elly to come through with the needed rbi and then steal three bases to put the Reds up 7-5 was the most incredible baseball performance I’ve ever seen, and I’ve been a Reds fan since the late 1940’s.
Interesting even after his “slump” CES is still hitting .320/.392/.624 with 20 HR and 58 RBI. Make him a part of this team. Make it stonger….VERY STRONG. 🙂
Well, I missed the sixth through ninth innings on TV, in the car on my way to a party which has been planned for weeks. We did hear De La Cruz’s triple-steal on the radio before we arrived at the party. Unbelievable.
I said it in the game thread and will say it again. This team has a legit chance to win it all if Votto is able to hit anywhere close to what he has been hitting in the last couple of weeks. I hope that today’s win made that evident to Nick Krall. It’s time to use the surplus of minor league shortstops in the system as part of a package to get a legit, established starting pitcher with a track record of success.
Well on one hand you have Greene and Lodolo coming back hopefully right at the trade deadline and that should do it. On the other hand what if one of those two or Abbott, Ashcraft, or even Williamson get injured after the deadline? It may put us in a world of hurt. Probably would be a good idea to get at least one good starting pitcher and reliever if we indeed want to have a chance at “winning it all”. We have surplus minor league talent. Maybe we even surplus major league talent. Krall has shown wisdom and made some good trades recently. Let’s hope he pulls off some good SMART/WISE ones again. If he is going to do it the sooner the better in my view.
Greene and Lodolo MAY come back near the trade deadline. I sure hope so, but nothing is for sure. I do trust that Krall will make the right choices.
It’s great to look forward to the next several years with this young core of players together, but there is no guarantee that they will all remain healthy. I would never have endorsed a “go-for-it all” approach even a month ago, but we’ve seen over the past few weeks (23-7 record) what is possible.
” I would never have endorsed a “go-for-it all” approach even a month ago, but we’ve seen over the past few weeks (23-7 record) what is possible.”
It seems like it’s becoming more possible all the time.
Give this team a top three starting rotation of Abbott, a veteran rental with a history of effectiveness and winning, and an effective either Greene or Lodolo, and I will give this team a coin-flip chance against Atlanta in the playoffs, and then at least the same chance in the World Series.
Here’s a wild thought for adding a quality pitcher – Rhett Lowder. It happened 9 years ago with Brandon Finnegan.
I would not at all be surprised to see Atalanta go get 1 of the best pitchers available at the deadline. They know how to plan ahead for the playoffs. They won’t stand pat with their pitching. Max sherzer or Lucas giolito as a brave?
Yes but a 3-4 month rental isn’t going to cost you the farm. Someone like Scherzer. And that maybe a better fit than similar quality who also has 2-3 years worth of salary to take on. I am definitely OK with either approach. But the key points are that we have an excess of high end prospects, including 2-3 who may have actually lost value in Hendricks and Barerro, and a strong need for at least 1 starting pitcher for the next 3-4 months. This team has really sparkled over the last month and can be expected to continue to some degree over the next month hat the playoffs now seem like a 60-70% probability barring the unforeseen. But to be competitive in the playoffs, we need another solid starter. Greene and Lodolo may or may not come back just fine but at this point in their careers have not shown to be any better than middle of the road starters. (This seems certain to improve.). They are better than Weaver, Lively, Williamson, etc. but not exactly who you want in a 5 game series. I see no reason at all that we should not be looking to improve this team for a playoff run. My bigger concern is Nick not willing to make the necessary trade or not taking on additional salary to get the pitcher we need. What many players are calling “signs of ownership commitment.”
Watched the game archived on MLBTV and I am glad I didn’t skip it. I have never seen a player like EDLC. Just electric and always doing something to help the team win.
Nice to see Votto turning it around and the power surge sure is nice.
Weaver was just normal like he always is barely working 4 or 5 innings and giving up several runs. If the Reds get rid of anyone, I feel like he would be the guy to remove from the rotation if we get trade reinforcements.
As they said in the broadcast Diaz looked stronger tonight. If the NL is winning the All Star game, I’m pretty sure he will close the game. Sims looked good overall tonight too.
Pitching is the name of the game, so any pitching help Via trade will be big help. It might sound funny but just as important I believe this team needs an experienced hitter for the playoffs. The last 2 games were playoff like atmosphere and if we take out Votto offense the rest of the offense sputtered. Don’t mean to offend a lot of Votto supporters in this board but I don’t think we can count on Votto to perform in the playoff. He’s quite streaky (a long cold spell before the current hot streak and he’s never been performing well in playoffs anyway). As for regular season, we’re fine as is.
Remember when Phil said we were eliminated before the season started.Wonder what Bob and Phil think now?
Concentrate on selling produce and let Nick Krall handle baseball operations.
I wonder if the Reds play that on occasion in the clubhouse? Kinda their version of the movie Major League.
If the Reds don’t trade anyone, and pick up Votto’s Option we’d have these 12 in 24.
Votto, India, EDLC, McLain, CES, Fraley, Friedl, Benson, Steer, Marte, Stephenson, Robinson
Here’s a long, short list of the options for #13
Senzel, Fairchild, Hopkins, Dunn, Siani, Hurtubise, Hinds, Newman, Barrero, Reynolds, Lopez, Urbaez, Johnson, McGarry Northcut, Pereda, Free, Trautwein
I’d say we’re going to have to trade some people, even still the Reds, and Bats will be pretty stacked.
It will be interesting to see Votto’s usage after the AS break but it certainly appears that he is capable of putting together another 2nd half run like he did in 2021 as a power lefty bat ( this time tho’ who doesnt play much against lefties.) He has 18 RBI in 16 games mostly hitting 6th with the on base machines of Friedl/McLain/Fraley/EDLC and India ahead of him( Steer is hitting 7th with OBP over .380). I can see Votto hitting 15+ more home runs the second half and driving in a ton of runs in the 6 hole. Steer, Stephenson, and Benson hitting 7/8/9 is quite the deep lineup against righties.
It would be very easy to make (2) internal roster swaps positionally post AS break that would make this offense purr even more regardless of handedness.
1.) trade and/or DFA Casali and bring up CES to play first base against lefties and DH and share 1b with Votto against righties.
2.) trade and/or DFA Newman and bring up Fairchild.
OF- Benson/Friedl/Fraley/Fairchild- good defensive OF
IF- McLain/EDLC/India/Votto/CES-good left side of infield
C-Stephenson/Maile
Every day flex player at CI/CO/DH-Steer
Part time bench/utility player 3b/OF against lefties-Senzel.
Now….as for the pitching…….thats a tougher proposition.
As Elly likes to say “it’s crazy” how deep this team is. I would do exactly your 2 moves. As good as Reynolds is for the Reds, he becomes obsolete once CES arrives. So you do step 1, step 2 is almost a necessity.
Like your term “flex player” for Steer versus the “super sub” moniker. I would add that he could be the “emergency sub” at SS or 2B until Barrero (or whoever) could arrive from AAA if McLain, India, or EDLC went to IL. His flexibility really undercuts the need for both Newman and Senzel.
This said, unless forced by injury or the Reds blessed by a trade offer too good to refuse, I don’t think more than one, if any, of the trio of Casali, Newman, and Senzel are going off the 26 man active roster.
Come post season if the Reds qualify, there are ways to use the roster rules to get Fairchild, CES et al onto the post season roster (assuming they are still in the Reds organization). It will come down to how few pitchers the team is willing to take into a series and whether they are comfortable going with 2 catchers at that point.
Not sure if you guys have already seen this from Jim Day after yesterdays game. Will Benson is such a likeable dude. It’s clear that he is an integral part of the team now.
I think David Bell deserves credit for how he has used him. He has put him in situations where he feels he can be successful and kept the pressure off. Remember that Benson himself said that he thought it might be over for him after the trade. It sounds like they are building his confidence and I would be willing to bet he turns into an every day player.
https://twitter.com/BallySportsCIN/status/1677830082042163200?s=20
That interview was great! Thanks for posting.
Very likeable person, fun to root for someone like that. If he can keep this up and become at least a MLB average OF then what a huge plus for the Reds this trade was. Thanks for the post.
I don’t happen to get to watch many Reds games live on TV (thanks cable companies). I happened to be at the new Hi-Wire brewery with friends yesterday and the game was on. When the play happened live there was a ripple of disbelief that went through the place as Elly stole home, it happened so fast, people were like “did he just steal home?”. Everyone in the place seemed to wait for the replay to occur so we could all pay full attention. When the replay came on actual applause erupted in the barroom after he crossed the plate. It was very cool to see the room come together and appreciate what we were all witnessing.
Good lord Weaver needs to be DFA’d. No reason to keep him on a playoff team. Kennedy, Lively, a fresh body could pitch better than him.
a brief word in defense for luke weaver – not the best starting pitcher in the league – statistically maybe the worst – but – he’s got courage, and character. he goes out there every fifth day and tries his best, never whines, doesnt argue with umpires, keeps his head up. nobody wants him out there beginning games any more – but maybe you’d like him as a brother, or a son, so there’s that. and… no matter what… they seem to win all his games, no matter what he does. maybe he’s a good luck charm, who knows? whatever, i’m rooting for him.
Well said Tim. I was reminding myself yesterday of the same thing. It isn’t like he isn’t trying. He just isn’t getting the job done. Thanks for the perspective.
First rather painless move Bell could try to get India going would be to have Elly bat 3rd & India 4th. He’s going to see more heaters with Elly on base and Elly can run to stay out of double-plays. Freidl and McLain can run, but can’t just steal easily on a early pitch like Elly.
Stop making sense!! 😀
Seriously, this is an excellent idea that should provide more coverage. But it also might work against EDLC because the opposing pitchers know India is battling and then they can try to get Elly to go for the soft stuff off the plate.
No one can “defy reality.” This phrase does not make sense. One can defy expectations, norms, standards, beliefs, etc, but not reality. Why? Because while someone is defying something that IS reality. More poor logic used in the American media? Of course, the media pander to the expectations of their customers, rather than defy them.
Relax.