The Chicago White Sox got two big home runs in the 5th and 6th inning to turn a Reds 3-0 lead into a 5-4 deficit for the home team. Chicago held onto that score the rest of the way as they took game one of the series over Cincinnati.
| Final | R | H | E |
|---|---|---|---|
| Chicago White Sox (11-22) | 5 | 7 | 1 |
| Cincinnati Reds (13-19) | 4 | 8 | 0 |
| W: Lynn (1-4) L: Greene (0-2) SV: Lopez (4) | |||
| Statcast | Box Score | Game Thread | |||
Hunter Greene was absolutely cruising through the first three innings of the game. He had allowed just one hit and one walk while striking out six batters and throwing just 45 pitches. The Reds offense, though, hadn’t done much of anything either. But that changed in the bottom of the 3rd when Kevin Newman legged out an infield single, stole second base, and then scored on a 2-out double by TJ Friedl – who was thrown out at third base when he overslid the bag trying to make it a triple.
The Reds offense went back to work in the bottom of the 4th inning when Spencer Steer, Tyler Stephenson, and Jake Fraley all singled to start the inning with Fraley’s bloop single into left field driving in Steer to make it 2-0. After a strikeout, Nick Senzel came through with another single and Tyler Stephenson came around from second to score and make it 3-0.
Chicago started to get things going in the top of the 5th inning. Luis Robert and Yasmani Grandal had back-to-back singles to lead off the inning. Hanser Alberto laid down a bunt, but Greene fielded it and fired to third base for a force out. Elvis Andrus did the opposite of laying down a bunt, hitting a 3-run homer to tie the game up.
The game didn’t remain tied very long. Jonathan India led off the bottom of the inning with a solo home run to dead center. The White Sox tried to tie things up in the top of the 6th when Andrew Vaughn hit a long drive into right center, but TJ Friedl leapt at the wall and either robbed a home run, or robbed an extra-base hit that was going to hit the top of the wall – recording the first out of the inning in the process.
OHHHHHHHH MYYYYYYY, @TjFriedl1. pic.twitter.com/sI1gHQaefC
— Cincinnati Reds (@Reds) May 6, 2023
Eloy Jimenez followed up with a single and then Luis Robert hit a ball that not even Friedl could catch to give Chicago a 5-4 lead. Yasmani Grandal would follow up with a single and that was the end of the day for Greene as David Bell walked out to the mound to call on Lucas Sims out of the bullpen and Sims did his job, getting a lineout that deflected off of his glove and right to Jonathan India who tossed over to first to end the inning.
Sims returned for the top of the 7th inning. He walked Elvis Andrus to start the inning, but he picked him off and then struck out Tim Anderson and got a ground out to end the inning. Buck Farmer took over for Cincinnati in the 8th with the Reds still trailing 5-4. He made quick work of the White Sox, retiring them in order on just 10 pitches. Farmer returned for the 9th and needed 11 pitches to do the same thing.
Cincinnati needed a run to keep the game going or more than a run to end it in a favorable manner for the home crowd. Things started out right as Jake Fraley walked to begin the inning. Then things went south as Henry Ramos hit a fly ball to center and somehow Fraley got doubled off at first base on a ball that never had a chance of falling in for a hit. Nick Senzel made it interesting, crushing a ball home run distance but just foul before he struck out to end the game.
Key Moment of the Game
Luis Robert’s 2-run home run in the 6th inning that put the White Sox ahead for good.
Notes Worth Noting
TJ Friedl raised his average to .318 on the season thanks to his two hits.
Jonathan India hit his first home run in over a month. It was just his second home run of the season.
Since allowing three runs without recording an out on April 4th, Buck Farmer has allowed just two runs in 10.2 innings and his ERA on the season is down to 3.31.
Up Next for the Cincinnati Reds
Chicago White Sox vs Cincinnati Reds
Saturday May 6th, 6:40pm ET
Mike Clevinger (1-2, 5.56 ERA) vs Nick Lodolo (2-1, 6.16 ERA)
First it was the bullpen – now it’s the starters…
Williamson had a decent line for the Bats
6ip, 3 H 3 ER 1 BB 7 Ks
2 homers allowed tonight (kinda like Greene)
EDLC…2-4
CES …0-4
Mclain…1-3
so far thru 8
Strickland….1 ip, 3ER
Only 3 runs? Wow
This team just has to generate more offense. Young pitchers are going to give up some runs until they mature. The offense needs to be built with that understanding.
Bell and the players have to get more involved with the hit and run and in stealing bases. And the strikeouts – good grief! Stephenson needs to be moved down the order. He is a shadow of himself.
Bottom of the ninth buffoonery is always entertaining . A base running gaffe resulting in an untimely double play? I’m there for it! The Reds were held scoreless against a reliever who came into the game with an 8.16 ERA. They lost to a team that has an even worse record than they do!
They’re bad, folks. Very, very bad. But they gave me a laugh tonight. That’s the entertainment value to be had here.
So glad you enjoyed it.
Maile catching and Ramos in Of and Newman at SS and Stephenson all over. This team has no positional identity.
Who is the franchise Catcher?
Who is the franchise SS?
Who is the franchise 1b?
Who is the franchise CF?
Who is the franchise anything?
This team has no identity or continuity from one day to the next. India at 2b hitting leadoff is about it.
There is no one in the line up that an opposing pitcher should even be concerned about facing. Basically, a bunch of 7th and 8th place hitters. This team desperately needs offense. I hope it’s in Louisville, because it’s not in Cincinnati at the moment.
Old-school: Isn’t that what sorting looks like? The guys who will provide more positional identity are probably at AAA right now.
I feel too that this is a major problem with how this team is run. Nobody knows until the same day when the lineup comes out where they are playing or if they are playing. If Bell uses the same lineup 3 times in a row I think I might pass out with shock.
He also seems to be really using Newman a lot lately too.
The players know the lineup the night before.
It’s not really that the Reds are bad. They aren’t great by any stretch of the imagination. But, they often execute poorly. The aggressiveness of ST appears to be gone. Only 20 SB thus far. Pittsburgh has 44. Reds have fewer XBH than Pittsburgh has 2B. And fewer 2B than Pittsburgh has HRs. Only Oakland & the White Sox had worse pitching than the Reds. Thus far only Ashcraft is holding it together consistently. Base running errors continue to plague the team. They are 21st in SO/game. Pitching 27th in BB issued. Some of these deficiencies can be blamed on talent. However, many are u equivocally the responsibility of Bell and the coaching staff. I’m still waiting for the DJ success story. Even Gray has done better elsewhere. Spend some money. Hire some coaches that’ll kick A and take names. Or continue to wallow in mediocrity and further alienate the fan base.
Bell definitely went too long with Greene this even it was clear he was losing it three or four batters ahead of Roberts home run. He always closes the barn door after the horses are gone. I have no idea why he waited for Maile to reach second base before lifting him for a pinch runner. Why do you carry three catchers if you are not going to pinch run for them when they represent the tying run late in the game?
Bell definitely went too long with Greene this even it was clear he was losing it three or four batters ahead of Roberts home run. He always closes the barn door after the horses are gone. I have no idea why he waited for Maile to reach second base before lifting him for a pinch runner. Why do you carry three catchers if you are not going to pinch run for them when they represent the tying run late in the game?
And curiously, he seems to go to a PR for Stephenson more quickly than the others. I haven’t looked up their individual speeds, but we know the best hitter of the three. The frustrating thing about the Reds these last few seasons is how often they make mistakes that a high school wouldn’t tolerate.
Thanks for the comparison to Pittsburgh, @LDS. It clarifies what they have done, as opposed to what the Reds have not done, as two teams that tied for last in 2022 and seemed to have another battle for the same this year have widely diverged. The Bucs payroll is also $13 mil less than the Reds with the Rays and Orioles even below that. Execution and in game decisions matter and I also think the “positional identity” aspect (@old-school) is a big factor in all of this mediocrity. Yes, I often hear David Bell isn’t going anywhere but neither is this team. Cohesion, I guess.
Hey Data. To be fair in regards to salary $50.5M of that is dead money, Votto/Moustakas/Griffey Jr.
Does anyone know how much longer we are paying Griffey?
I have heard Griffey’s contract is up this season. No obligations next season to Griffey, Votto, or Moose.
Jay, I believe this is the last year of Griffey salary.
Not really fair to compare 3 2nd year pitchers 9and DJ’s competence) with Gray (Castillo or Mahle). Ashcraft appears to be the ‘ace’ in the group. Greene still learning, fast ball in fast ball out, though he’s only allowed one HR before yesterday. What scares me is Lodolo seems to be regressing.
Sure wish we had sluggers somewhere in the system that we could plug into this anemic lineup.
Oh wait….
(I’m getting so tired of this)
This is a team and a pitcher (for the White Sox) that the Reds should have beat, especially at home.
Execution, as LDS indicated, is lacking.
I think they are trying, but they make too many mental mistakes; pitching, hitting, etc.
Elvis Andrus is batting .204 and Greene gives up a 3-run dinger to him? That’s a mental mistake in pitching and location of the pitch.
This was definitely a game the Reds should have won. This is indicative of managing, player in-game playing and just not good baseball.
Next week, the Reds play three games against a pretty good Mets team. Will they win a single game against them….at home?
When you consider the pitching match ups they may not win a game in the Met’s series.
So 13-19 is going to turn into 14-24. This just in – this team is not good. I like Fairchild but don’t need both him and Ramos on the roster with Myers back. Might as well DFA one of them to make room for CES.
Fairchild and Ramos can both be optioned. DFA Reynolds for both a 40 man and 26 man spot. Come to a decision on the catching to open a second spot.
It is probably going to surprise some (a lot?) of folks; but, I think Fairchild could benefit from a spell at AAAm playing every day. He is in basically the same situation right now that Friedl was in this time or shortly later in 2022. Recall that Friedl went down and did his work to improve offensively and was ready when the recall came last year. Then this year he picked back up from the get go.
I’m trying to find where someone said it was a good tea. Snow is white for those that don’t know.
Hey Mario. I would be surprised if they DFA Myers. Can’t see them eating more money, another $7.5M. Most likely a trade at the deadline for for a some AA pitching project. Ramos the most likely to be optioned IMO.
No way they are going to eat Newman or Myers contract so early in the season. I was talking about the other two. They can DFA either Fairchild or Ramos to make roster spot for CES or McClain. It seems they both have minor league options but it’s not going to help the 40 man roster unless they are DFA’d.
Right on David – THAT is exactly the point. Reds cannot, by a long shot, afford to lose winnable games against this type of team!
That pitch was out of the strike zone…can’t really blame it on Greene. The HR next inning, Greene got behind 3-0, got a strike with 99 MPH fastball, came back with another 100 MPH fastball, but same place (perhaps that was a mistake…don’t know if that was Greene’s intention.
I hate to beat a dead horse but starting pitchers with only 2 reliable pitches struggle when hitters get to their 3rd at bat. I am a Hunter Greene fan, but he must develop a consistent offspeed pitch or he is going to struggle as a starter. If he can’t, turn him into a dominant setup man. What is the Reds record this year in games that Greene has started? The object is to win games. What’s the point of having a starter that throws 102 if you don’t win the game.
Also, I love Friedl’s energy but my Dad taught me when I was 9 years old that you never make the first or third out of an inning at 3rd base. Don’t end innings when you are already in scoring position. Little things matter in baseball. They are often the difference in winning or losing one run games.
Friedl had the triple but overslid the bag. Can’t teach the team to be aggressive and then scold them for being aggressive. I like Friedl a lot but believe he is a platoon player. Too many folks on RLN in love with mediocre players.
Not really playing like a mediocre player at the moment.
I was at the game so I didn’t get to listen to any post game comments.
Did Jake Fraley say anything about getting doubled up on a shallow fly ball to CF?
Greene has a change up that he was using lastnight. Why is it on here after a loss the world is coming to a end and after a win “this team is coming together ” it gets tiresome. Greene is still developing into a string starter. Wish I could watch him pitch as gameday also showed he was using changeup. Oh and Brantley said when Lance Lynn was in his prime he would just blow fastball by you, however with movement.
Almost every hitter in lineup had 1 or more hits. Let’s remember the homerun given up of the two was a fly ball out in alot of parks. So, again Reds have three solid young starters. What happens when CES or McLain or Cruz start 0-10. Are some gonna say send them down. This is a young team. They are not a bad team.
He threw just 6 changeups in 106 pitches. And it’s probably the most he’s thrown all year. But at that minuscule rate, and the fact that it is not very effective, batters don’t really have to think about defending it. He’s mostly a 2 pitch pitcher, which is why he has to nibble and gets into pitch count issues and 3 time thru lineup issues.
He’ll hopefully come up with something more viable as a third pitch. He needs it.
Not according to Jeff Brantley and gameday.
Wait, Kevin: You’re saying that the sky isn’t really falling? I agree.
The team is fun to watch, but they are bad.
Kevin H, I totally agree with you! The Reds are not that bad and they are actually fun to watch. The team is “coming together” and they are rarely ever out of the game when the later innings arrive. I like how they never give up. TJ could be an all star this year? A year ago he was an after thought for the most part. We have some very good young talent beating on the door in our minor leagues. We were never going to contend this year anyway. A few “tweaks” are in order though. Reynolds has to go and so does Ramos. Bring some youngsters up to see what they can do. Allot of pressure on Steer right now. Any word on Votto?
Disappointing loss, but only because all losses are disappointing. I’ve railed about this in the past so I’ll tip my hat for last night. David Bell let Buck Farmer pitch the 9th after a quick and efficient 8th. Good! That’s how it’s supposed to work. Remember that one Mr. Bell. Relievers can pitch more than one inning.
Otherwise, free Jose Barrero. And I’m excited for the return of Joey Votto (when at full strength) and the arrival of Matt McLain, CES, the new improved Chucky Robinson and eventually EDLC.
This Chicago WS team had a ugly 10-22 record before starting the series vs Reds but they have a bunch of good players and a very dangerous lineup so it seems they are just underperforming so far this year. This is not a easy series despite the WS poor losing record. I think all depends on the Reds pitching staff get the job done and could stop this strong lineup in order to win the next two games and consequently the series.
Reds need a lefty bat for this next iteration of a winning window and I found one. Vinny Pasquantino KC royals. Big lefty bat with power, patience, and plate discipline. 2nd year player and age 25 and plays first base. Royals are no where near their winning window and Reds could trade some lower minors prospects.
Reds get Pasquantino and bullpen/5th starter lefty Zerpa.
Royals get Cam Collier, Lyon Richardson, Sal Stewart and the Reds CB pick
Trade simulator approves.
Reds then have CES and Pasquantino as lefty/righty 1b/DH power plants. Stephenson can DH some and the 1b/DH spot is set and Krall can then focus on improving positional defense.
They can sort through McLain and EDLC landing spots, find a 2nd catcher to pair with Stephenson and one of India or EDLC or Steer moves to the OF. This lineup needs a lefty thumper.
I don’t really like the idea of having three guys who should all be in the lineup most days, but all just having one field position and DH. Stephenson can catch some but he probably won’t be catching long term that much.
But your trade value matches up for both sides. I think we need to find a Pasquantino type player that can play the OF corners, or other positions, just more flexibility than Pasquantino himself.
I am coning around to the point of Stephenson needs to catch and DH only. He is not and maybe will not display the power that 1B needs in the majors. He can catch 100 to 120 and another C can do the rest. Not sue where the third C comes into play. That should give him plenty of rest and allow for another bench piece. He can and will continue to be an important offensive piece. If he can hit 275 with 15 or so HR and 75 or so RBIs, that would probably be fringe all star material at C, but not play nearly as well at 1b.
I wonder if Stephenson’s lack of power this year is due to not being fully recovered. He seemed likely to become a 15 or 20 homer a year guy–kind of like Sean Casey. He’s young, and he might still.
Not a fan of this trade. I’m not saying it’s not an equal deal, but this isn’t trading from surplus, so I feel it makes the organization weaker. We have Arroyo and Marte who are highly rated, and they are currently sitting behind JB, MM, EDLC. If we deal a high end prospect it should be one of those 2.
Obviously just spitballin’ on how the Reds can get another good lefty bat in the order. Winker and votto 2 year ago were 2 of the top hitters in all of MLB against righties and Reds done have that. Friedl is good and fraley will be ok, but they need more. Some of these Power righties are tough on Steer/India/Stephenson/Barrero/Senzel, etc with McLain and CES coming soon.
I get it, we have a lack of LHB’s and there is not much help likely in the next 2 years.
Reds Fraley, Friedl, Ramos
AAA EDLC, Siani, Benson
AA McGarry, Hurtubise
Except for EDLC and McGarry they’re all outfielders, it’s one of the reasons I am now wanting EDLC to stay on the dirt.
After that though we do have Collier and maybe Jorge could be big LHB’s.
@green. I wonder the same, but am skeptical that that is MLB 1B power worthy. At C, with that and his average, that is fringe. All star.
Chris: I’m not as concerned by power positions as some, partly because it seems to reflect some assumptions that aren’t always valid, mostly concerning “defense first” middle infield positions that often aren’t manned by power hitters. The Reds need more power, no doubt about it, but with EDLC or McClain at shortstop, they might get it from the middle infield. Stephenson gets on base well and with homers coming from other positions, maybe that’s enough. On the other hand, if he’s blocking a guy with big power who has little positional flexibility, then maybe that’s a bad trade-off, as you say.
Giving up Collier strikes me as short sighted. I wouldn’t be surprised to see climb the system quickly. As for Pasquantino, a good candidate with reverse batting splits and hence a lousy addition to the Bell system. He’s a lefty that has hit LH’ers better in his career. As we have seen with the Reds, that dog don’t hunt.
Front office needs to send down Ramos. He is needs to find the stroke he had in ST. They might as well send down Fairchild and Barrero. They need every day playing time and Bell will not give it to them. The three catcher deal isnt even worth mentioning anymore. Bring up the guys who hopefully will play. Bell has started Newman 6 days in a row so Bell will probably play McLain at least once in awhile. The Reds are the only team in the central to have a winning record in the last 10. This division is poor . But let’s keep our best in AAA.
I think Ramos is hitless in his last 3 games, so I’d probably not send him down based on that. Sending Fairchild down works. Bring up Hopkins to play RF.
Before spring started I did say we should start Barrero in AAA to see if he could find his stroke down there, so I wouldn’t mind seeing that now. Truth is Barrero probably isn’t ever going to be a good major league hitter. His defense is ok to good, but not exceptional. That would also give McLain an everyday spot. win win
History shows Newman is not a good hitter. There is not enough history on Barrero to know. Is playing Newman over Barrero going to show anything new to people? #FreeJose
FreeJose to Louisville!
@Chris Who said anything about Newman playing more? Did you ever think that if Barrero hit like India hit, Barrero would play everyday? He just isn’t cutting it, a move to AAA might be his best chance to play everyday, and hopefully find his stroke.
McLain has embarrassed AAA pitching long enough, bring him up play him everyday at SS, and Bring up CES to play 1B/DH.
How can Bell give Barrera everyday playing time? There are 25 other players on that team that deserve a chance to compete. They are all playing for their livelihood.
The point again is, Newman is a known below average commodity. Stats and eye test tells anyone that. How do the Reds know, what sort of player Barrero is with limited time? So, if EDLC, McClain and CES come up should Newman play in front of them as well, for his livelihood?
No @JimT, they don’t deserve anything. They get paid regardless. It’s well known that Newman isn’t anything special, generally ranked as the #30 starting SS in baseball. The 1st place Pirates dumped him for a reason. They had a young, better candidate. So do the Reds. The difference is the Pirates went with him despite the fact that he only hit .233 in his first full season. Barrero for the 4 years that he’s had MLB ABs has about half as many for his career as Cruz had last year. That’s the difference between the Pirates and the Reds. The Pirates give their young guys time to develop. The Reds, and their fans for that matter, want immediate results and when they don’t get them, call up the next hot prospect so Bell and play them part time while guys like Newman start. Remember Barrero, in 2021 before the injury, hit .303 with a .919 OPS in Louisville. Giving up on him now is an overreaction. But, it’s the Reds way – trade 26 yo Encarnación and a couple of other guys for a 4 years of an aging Scott Rolen, how did that turn out?
@MBS Barrero is hitting like Newman… Why not give him the chance. They know what they have a Newman.
LDS – totally agree. Newman has played six freaking days in a row. Why? Everybody knows he is a 230 hitter. No way in how should he get starting time over Barrero, Mclain,Steer,India or whoever at DH. Whether it’s The Front Office or Bell who is demanding Newman plays , needs to be let go. At this point are we just rebuilding forever like the Pirates and are out of it by day one? I’m to old for this stupidity of playing Newman and Ramos who is 31. They have no place here. The organization has a lot of talent through out the minors. Flipping Newman and Ramos are getting you nothing. Meanwhile the talent that should be playing is slowly getting older. Playing for their livelihood? Bell is this you? Everybody plays and gets a trophy?
Someone pointed out Barrerro must be in Bell’s doghouse ,seems to be true.Send him to LA where they will fix him and he will become an all-star.
I was at the game tonight. Fredo looks really good, and to call it third was questionable, with his foot. He’s catching the Outfield was definitely over the wall, and brought back. Senzel is easily the best third baseman that they have. He looks very natural and very smooth. The Fraley TOOTBLAN definitely took the Steam out, and the play was right in front of him. That is really unacceptable. DB left Green in about 4 or 5 hitters too long, they were seeing him very well at that point, and getting good swings. India and Elvis’s home runs were blasts, they were no doubt gone. Evidently, Mark reynolds, was on the bench, using his “veteran presence” mentoring Jose barrero, free jose. On the positive side, farmer and Sims both looked good. On another positive note, at least they were fireworks, and the bobblehead line, was incredibly long, so the concession lines, and the restroom line was very manageable.
Autocorrect is terrible,Freidl.
good report Chris. I’m a play Barrero every day guy but do you think the Reds are moving on from him as the franchise SS with McLain blowing up in AAA. Thats the only way I can explain Nweman sharing time with Barrero is if a McLain call up is imminent and Newman goes back to his back up utility role and Barrero goes to AAA.
Mark Reynolds was a strike out king and power guy for the Dbacks and Nats a few years back. Matt is the Reds 26 man at the moment.
I agree OS, and I think that is where Reynolds should be, but they will never know about Barrero, or any of the young guys without playing them on a consistent basis. I am not saying all the hoopla about the guys in AAA is not warranted, just when they arrive will they get the Barrero treatment or PH for every time the other handed pitcher comes in. How is that showing confidence or letting them prove themselves at the MLB level? Not sure DB is on the boat about developing the future and see what they have. My eye test questions that.
Barrera needs to be back in AAA working on pitch recognition. He gets himself out way to often.
If the Reds really want to develop the future, it’s up to managing ownership; they’re the ones with the power. The rest of us just have an opinion.
Chris, I was at the game as well and totally agree with everything you said. It was very clear, Hunter Greene had lost it several batters before Roberts hit the game winning home run. I had no idea what Fraley was doing and I am still waiting for an explanation.
It also baffles me why David Bell was reluctant to pinch run for Maile, who represented the tying run in the 7th inning. He eventually did so when Maile was awarded 2nd base, but before that Bell was sleeping on the job IMO.
I am shocked Bell stuck with a pitcher longer than he should have. That almost never happens. Oh, you’re at around 80 pitches usually your gone with Mr. Bell.
I went to the game with a buddy from South Carolina who is a lifelong White Sox fan.
Bought Scout Club tickets in handicapped row (he is recovering from Achilles tendon surgery) for $102 each right behind home plate. Great seats, great view of the ballpark, fabulous weather all evening.
Flying Pig crowds made traffic worse than normal. Fireworks show after the game was worth the wait.
Greene was not impressive. MLB hitters will adjust to 100 mph pitches if they are straight down the middle.
Senzel plays a good 3B. Leave him there. Friedl plays good CF. Leave him there. Play both both almost every day.
Fraley made a boneheaded base running play in 9th inning. 1B coach bears some responsibility.
Bullpen looked good. Not a bad game by Reds. Sox P Lynn threw a nice game.
PS one boneheaded play by Reds off the the field. None of the gates to the west in the parking garage would open after the game. Almost 30 minute delay getting out of the garage,
Where you gonna go? ?
I’m going to bet in the derby
Why not the Derby?
The staff this year is only used to having less than 10,000 people per game so you know.
Leading 3-0 and HG dealing, it looked like a game the Reds would win.
We were late to get in because go the Flying Pig traffic. HG was not dealing when I saw him pitching.
The lineup starting next week (in my dreams):
2B India
3B De La Cruz
RF Fraley
1B E-Strand
DH Ramos/Steer
C Stephenson
CF Friedl
LF Senzel
SS McLain
1 Ashcraft
2 Lodolo
3 Greene
4 Abbott
5 Weaver
Hard to argue right now that’s the top 10 players in the organization, but you could shuffle chairs on deck of titanic when it comes to positioning though
Senzel 3B, Fraley LF. EDLC RF?
Other than too early for EDLC, I agree with all.
I would be excited to go to the ballpark and watch that team.
Would love to see that. Also, would love to see the same lineup that actually makes sense several days in a row.
Chad Pinder is available to come and save the day.
I think that appears on David Bell’s magic 8-Ball when he asks the 8-Ball what to do.
The answer with the Reds is always some guy that is past his prime, or is a back up infielder or outfielder with some other team.
The Reds’ got lucky with Brandon Drury last year, but usually these guys (like Newman, Matt Reynolds, Maile, Ramos, etc.) turn out to me exactly what the rest of “the league” (meaning their statistics of their lifetime) thinks they are.
it seems to me the Reds are risk averse at to with to do with the young players. They are obviously not sure what to do with Barrero, or at least one person isn’t. yet they continue to play older below average guys instead of him, but they hold on to him. I assume just in case. What if McClain. or EDLC or any of the young SSs never develop into quality MLB players. Now what? Everyone say be like Tampa Bay. A couple years ago they had Adames starting and Franco wunderkind waiting in the wings. The said okay we believe in ourselves and out development capabilities, and they traded Adames, to the Brewers and went with Franco. They are all just prospects until they get the chance to sink or swim. That does not seem to be the Reds way despite “rebuilding”. What is the issue. lack of faith in scouting, development (not a great track record there recently) on field ability to instill confidence, or just bad players? A team only has prospects until they are not, take a chance, change it up and see what happens, because the status quo continues to not yield positive results.
Or as those of us of a certain age recall “You have to know when to hold’em, know when to fold’em. Know when to walk away and know when to run”.
And right now the Reds may be too proud of last year’s trade returns and counting all their money at the table. 😉
Don’t forget that India only got a chance because Moustakas got injured. The Reds signed him to a multi-year deal even though they had India in the minors already. They clearly seem to be unable to scout their own players. Having said that, the returns from the trade deadline have looked good, so maybe Krall has a better feel than previous GMs. Biggest issue seems to be able to get the manager to give the young guys a regular role.
Sick of service time manipulation.Get them up now because nobody is going to stay with this sorry organization so what does one year difference make.
There is no service time manipulation, Joe. That day came and went more than three weeks ago.
@Joe, we’re past the point of the season where the Reds have already secured another year of service time on any minor league prospects. Service time manipulation is not in play here.
I’ve been looking at various Tyler Stephenson numbers trying to get a feel for what is going on with him at the plate.
He is striking out about 6% more and walking 3% less than prior to 2023. His BABIP is +.025 than prior to 2023 but his batting average is -.032 (witness to the increase in his K rate and decrease in BB rate).
Nevertheless, overall OBP while -.017 compared to prior years is still strong at .352.
However, the bottom line is that his slugging has just fallen off the end of the world. It is -.136 to his slugging % prior to 2023.
Let the speculation begin.
My take he may not feel comfortable with his new roles.
My guess is that he has lost strength in his left arm, his power arm, and his not driving the ball as well as he did in 2021 and 2022.
He is still making contact. His Babip does seem to be not greatly changed. Just strength has fallen off.
The injury and surgery last season were on the right collarbone area though? This said I do believe a current lack of strength in the shoulder area is at least a contributing factor in TS’s current situation.
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/mlb/reds/2022/07/22/tyler-stephenson-leaves-reds-game-injury-vs-cardinals/10132371002/
The new “roles” have kept him in the lineup almost daily. Why would an MLB player be uncomfortable with more playing time?
I think it will be next season before Stephenson is back to normal. Hopefully, the Reds will be patience and not ship him off the way they did Suarez. Of course, Geno was making more money, so I suspect they will give Tyler time to get healthy.
Having said that, I don’t think he will ever be the middle of line up bay the Reds desperately need.
I would hold on to Tyler Stephenson for now in hopes he rebounds next season. At that point, trade him when he has more value.
I would not consider extending Tyler Stephenson. He is not a very skilled catcher, he seems injured prone at that position and does not hit well enough to be even an average DH or First Basemen.
Give him time to recover, re-establish some value and then deal him next season.
But why are they burning the DH spot on him and batting him 4th right now?
Like so many things, we don’t know whether this is a Bell decision, a Krall directive, or some combination of the two.
Jim, good point. I don’t think Stephenson hits well enough, even in the best of times, to DH. Unless, it is just for an occasional break from catching. He is just not a middle of the
Line up bat that the Reds are making him out to be. He has some value as an offensive catcher, but his defense even makes that questionable.
As I mentioned in a different post, the Reds line up does not exactly instill fear into opposing pitchers. I can’t think of one player who should be pitched around.
Hopefully, offensive help is on the way in Louisville. Because it is not in Cincinnati at the moment.
Jim you are right. If you watch Stephenson’s swing it is all upper body…no lower body at all, sapping his power. Broken collarbones take a long time to heal (with or without surgery). I’m hoping that as the season progresses his swing will get better and his power will return to normal.
And BK hit the nail on the head with “why would an MLB player be uncomfortable with more playing time.” Exactly!
There is no way I would trade Cam Collier at this point. Maybe when they are on the brink of contending, which they are not right now. Heck before they are that close they need to get rid of Bell
1. The Reds personal dead ball era isn’t going to work in Gabp! Its great that they’ve got some athletes that can run and give them a chance in bigger ballparks, but our outfield is too small for that. Maybe tear out some OF seats and make it bigger. No coincidence that the O’s did that and suddenly started winning. Call us CES and McClain and see what happens?
2. Hunter Greene? 2.25 pitch selection ain’t gonna cut it. Not unless you have a heavy sinker w/movement like Kevin Brown or something. A good big league starter needs 3-3.5 pitches. 3 he can count on and another to atleast show them occasionally if not close the deal. This is disappointing and Bell/staff needs to be held accountable! Atleast a cutter or a back-up fb like Sonny Gray or Sam LeCure. Something?
3. Stephenson? I was never on board with many others that he was this big potential masher with 25+ hr/40 double potential. Not with his approach of going the other way so often. Maybe clean-up is too much pressure? Fairchild doubled to leadoff an inning in that 1 run loss to Oakland and TS took an outside pitch and rolled over for a weak 5-3. Thats not him? What if he’s Joe Mauer lite? Thats not so bad. I’d bat him 2nd and let him push hits to RF in that hole when they’re holding on Friedl. Let India bat 3rd. As currently constructed he’s pretty much their only guy with 20+ hr power….or let Senzel bat 2nd and push Stephenson down the line.
4. Agree with everyone else on Newman>Barrero. Just trade the kid for whatever you can get and move on. Make a hole for McClain and co. Barrero has a long swing and I’d say his average , if he makes it at all, is something like .235, 15 HRs, and 150 Ks
Indy, great points. Everyone keeps pointing out how young Greene is, and that he is still developing, but as you point out, becoming a true ace in the starting rotation means developing at the very least an effective 3rd pitch. I have seen no sign of this happening. It does appear that he is trying to use his changeup more, but it is not effective and he obviously has no confidence in it. I put his lack of development on management and coaching. Hoping that somehow he is magically going to turn into a dominant starter with 2.25 pitches is a pipe dream.
This division is not good. This organization has enough talent to compete if they give the young guys a shot. At the bare minimum CES must be called up. Anyone with eyes can see he is the best power hit in the organization. McClain looks like he is ready for the bigs. It’s May, these kids are going to have to come up sometime this year. Might as well be now.
Jeff Brantley has said Hunter Greene is developing his pitches. I am not sure what more people want from Hunter Greene. Not sure also who declared him the “ace” if the staff.
Lodolo is struggling so all of sudden reds have 2 starters, what happens when Ashcraft struggles. Friedl goes in a slump,CES comes up and goes 5-30?
Just trust the process and have faith
I feel like Lodolo has a better chance at being a number 1 than Greene. I know he has struggled a bit lately, but the guy normally does a nice job pitching with a fair number of options to throw.
Im going to push back a bit on Stephenson. The guy had little reps last year due to multiple injuries and then surgery and no baseball shape in the off-season and upper body was interrupted for 6 months. Give the guy another 200 at bats. I looked around the league this morning and there’s some big time players off to slow starts. Geno Suarez , George Springer OPS .576, Nolan Arenado .640 , Schwarber .183 BA , Ke’bryan Hayes .632 OPS, Triston Casas top prospect .580 OPS Red Sox, Carlos Correa .649, Benintendi .635 OPS.
I’ll worry about Stephenson in June. He just needs reps, continuity and confidence. Like every other young player.
Well said