It was a tough day for the Cincinnati Reds against the best team in the National League. The Mets got on the board early and late as they took a lead in the 5th inning and never looked back as the bullpen struggled to keep them in check. The loss was the Reds 5th in their last six games as they fell to a National League worst 27-52.
| Final | R | H | E |
|---|---|---|---|
| New York Mets (50-30) |
7 | 12 | 0 |
| Cincinnati Reds (27-52) |
4 | 7 | 1 |
| W: Walker (7-2) L: Greene (3-10) SV: Lugo (3) |
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| Statcast | Box Score | Game Thread | |||
The Offense
After just one hit in the first two innings the Reds trailed 3-0 heading into the bottom of the 3rd inning, but they got things going. Matt Reynolds was hit by a pitch to lead off the inning and Aramis Garcia singled to put two men on. Brandon Drury would bring them both in with an opposite field homer that tied the game up.
The offense went quiet from there as Reds only had one hit over the next three innings – a single by Nick Senzel. He would also get the next hit for the Reds, a solo home run in the 7th that made it a 7-4 game. That was the score when Cincinnati came up in the bottom of the 9th. Matt Reynolds would pick up a 2-out single on a grounder up the middle but that was that as Max Schrock grounded out to first to end the game.
The Pitching
The 1st inning was a struggle for Hunter Greene. Brandon Nimmo led off the game with a single, but he was caught stealing. Starling Marte struck out, but then Francisco Lindor was hit by a pitch, Pete Alonso walked, and Jeff McNeil singled to load the bases. Greene was able to get out of the jam on the next pitch, getting a pop up to end the inning.
In the 2nd inning things didn’t work out that way. Mark Canha was hit by a pitch to lead off the inning and Tomas Nido had a 1-out single. Brandon Nimmo followed up with a 3-run homer. Greene retired the next 10 batters, but a 2-out home run by Francisco Lindor in the 5th inning broke a 3-3 tie and gave the Mets a lead. He headed back out for the 6th inning and allowed a single and a double around a strikeout before being replaced. Reiver Sanmartin came on and gave up a 2-run double to give New York a 6-3 lead.
In what feels like a daily occurrence, the bullpen just continued to give up runs. Luis Cessa came out for 7th and allowed another run, making it 7-3. Ross Detwiler threw a shutout inning in the 8th after the Reds got a run back. Dauri Moreta entered for the 9th and gave up a double to Pete Alonso that came off the bat at 117 MPH and surprisingly didn’t go through the left field wall when it hit it. Moreta struck out the next two batters before getting Mark Canha to line out and end the inning to give the offense one final chance to come back from a 7-4 deficit.
Notes Worth Noting
Hunter Greene has allowed 22 home runs this season.
With the 2 he allowed tonight, Greene surpassed Johnny Cueto (20) for most HR given up by a rookie prior to the All-Star break since 1947, the inaugural year of the Rookie of The Year Award. pic.twitter.com/qxwJN43JPT
— ESPN Stats & Info (@ESPNStatsInfo) July 5, 2022
Up Next for the Cincinnati Reds
New York Mets vs Cincinnati Reds
Tuesday July 5th, 6:40pm ET
Max Scherzer (5-1, 2.54 ERA) vs Nick Lodolo (1-2, 5.52 ERA)
Scherzer tomorrow. Things could get ugly. Well I mean uglier.
I thought Scherzer was just coming off the injured list. If so there is a good possibility he may not be 100% and as sharp as he normally would be this time of the year.
Of course Lodolo is also just coming off the IL …
I think most of us here would be satisfied if he turned out as well as Cueto
Thats a high bar, I’d be extremely satisfied
Celebrated the 4th without the Reds this year. Forgot they even were playing to be honest.
Here’s a good question related to the holiday.. Will the Reds be competitive again by our nations quincentennial?
No. Ownership is more interested in “ fan experience “ than putting up a competitive team. And I think it is the experience of the visiting fans to be honest. As a die hard reds fan I find my experience at gabp pretty darn depressing of late
Watching the game you could not help but hear louder or almost as loud Mets fans when the Mets did something good. Same with the last series against the Dodgers. Never did I ever think that would happen here.
SELL THE TEAM BOB!
When is the last time Bob Castellini has been seen in public?
Will David Bell survive the season?
Will Luis Castillo be signed instead of traded?
Redhaze, I have the same question about Bob Castellini. I haven’t seen him in public for awhile. I wonder if he is in good health.
I hope he is OK, but he is older and you have to wonder if maybe there is a reason why he has not been seen lately. If he is in poor health, you have to wonder how that would impact the team.
The last I saw was in spring training in March at the season ticket holder event.
He, or someone writing in his name, provided the Enquirer with a comment about Paul Daugherty’s retirement the other day. It was probably a publicist, but maybe not?
– Has he not been at games? I havent watched enough to know.
– Yes, they signed him to an extension before the team collapsed last season, he’s staying. Obviously not a popular opinion around here, but he probably isnt even the biggest problem with the team so why bother.
– Doubtful, but the Reds wouldnt be wrong to do so.
Why is it that plenty of our bullpen arms started out very well and even got a lot of praise from the Cowboy like Cessa, Kuhnel, Guitterrez, Warren, Santillan, Sanmartin and perhaps a few others?Now, pretty much all of them are effectively in the dog house or on the IL like Antone, Sims, Overton and whomever the latest casualty was. This script and other aspects of the coaching is much the same the last 3 years and yet the only coaches relieved of their duties are the ones who voluntarily quit after Williams made his move. Seems like in the absence of any long term strategy or leadership from the FO and GM, it is being left to David Bell to run this organization in that vacuum and the record is reflective of that.
Why is minor leaguer Joe Boyle still pitching in A ball? His numbers are ridiculous and he is 22 years old not 18. He would already be in the Braves rotation.
Braves brought Strider all the way from single A ball to the major leagues in one year. It is interesting, like Hunter, he has also had to undergo tommy john surgery and was off one year before starting in the minor leagues.
This season has been hard to endure for Reds fans. I have been a diehard Reds fan since 1975. Remember being in the fourth grade at Latonia Elementary in 1976 during the WS and we had in school vacation that week and did nothing but talk Reds baseball. I was serving in Germany during the 90 WS and my leave that year began the day after the Series and I got back to Cincinnati in time to celebrate with all my fellow fans. I remember telling my wife that we would be home for the next Reds championship. This year reminds me of listening to the game with my grandpa in the early 80s while he chewed Mailpouch loose leaf and told me about Frank Robinson and big Klu. Those were all some of the best days of my life. Baseball isn’t really all about titles, it’s about enjoying the game.
Greene isn’t ready to win in the major leagues yet. 3-10 with 6+ ERA.
I saw him pitch once this year. It wasn’t that impressive. He’s fast but major league hitters can hit fast.
He has a lot to learn.
Looking forward to seeing Nick Lodolo pitch tomorrow. I don’t know how long they will let him go but want to see what he can do against the national leagues best. I still think the Reds will be a better team in the second half of the year. They need to get Stephenson back into the lineup with India and let the young pitchers throw.
I truly believe our young pitchers have the talent but they go into every game thinking they have to be perfect. A better offense would do wonders for their mindset.
When was the last time cessa didn’t give up a run.
Seems like it’s been a month since he didn’t give up a run. He’s thrown in the towel. But Bell keeps running him out there in more or less close games…the games ain’t close when he’s done chucking meatballs.
Reds are drawing about the same attendance as last year. Ownership can survive comfortably on what they make on visiting fans alone. No real incentive to invest in payroll. All profits likely will go towards “enhancing” the visiting fans experience for next year
I would like to see India and Senzel get bigger leads at first. The Mets pitcher,’s pick off move to first was awful yet India had a three step lead when he got thrown out at second. Maybe Larkin can work with these guys with the base running and stealing
Didn’t watch one pitch live, but just watched the offensive highlights. Looks like Hunter hung 2 sliders to Nimmo and Lindor. The kid is a mess, but he’s still not even 23 yet. The disappointing thing to me is that he’s so unrefined? Love his potential but who’s been working with this kid? Ashcraft hasn’t been hit nearly as hard, but only seems to have a fastball as well? Are you they trying to develop pitchers or one trick pony velocity throwers?
I’ll bring up this Korean kid An Won-Jin again. A few weeks younger then HG and throws 95-98. 95 innings and only 105 Ks (31 walks) which is unusual because the average heater in KBO is like 88-91 maybe. He’s just more advanced then our guys. Has good breaking stuff. Gets ahead in the count gets weak contact. What are our coaches doing wrong?
Positives: Senzel didn’t kill it, but it went out! He’s been impressive! Maybe he can be kind of a pesky righty version of Brandon Nimmo? Speaking of Nimmo and my other fav FA Benintendi…..they both homered on the 4th. We should really try to sign one of them if at all possible! Nimmo has a lifetime .386 obp
Different day, same story. Senzel looks to have turned the corner, I hope India can right the ship too. So, what’s the plan with Greene? Every outing is about the poor results.
If Bell keeps insisting on playing JV and Moose, he should construct the batting order to optimize the other players that are producing. Drury and Pham, who bat in front of JV and Moose, lead the team in runs scored with 49 and 47 respectively. That’s 20 more than any other Red. So, logically you’d think that JV and Moose, who hit behind them most of the time, would lead the team in RBIs. They have 25 and 16 respectively. The ones that are actually driving in the runs are Farmer, Stephenson, Naquin and recently Almora. They have 39, 31 and 26 RBIs respectively. Farmer usually hits 5th when in the lineup. Look at the big difference. Stephenson and Naquin have been out, but still have produced more with less ABs. Drury and Pham drive in their own runs with the HR. JV and Moose are making outs in very key RBI opportunities. Therefore, they should be split in the batting order not to kill rallies. Pham leads the team with 6 SBs and is a very aggressive runner that looks to take extra bases. He should leadoff. Votto still has a pretty good OBP and is LH, so it would be helpful when Pham tries to steal. And because Pham has a pretty good OBP, it can open up the right side if he’s on first, so JV has a better chance to get a hit to the right side. Farmer, Drury, Stephenson and Naquin follow as the run producers in the lineup. Moose, Solano or Almora (DH) hits 7th and India and Senzel complete the lineup. This optimizes the lineup throughout the order. India is currently in a little funk and could use the same medicine that has helped Senzel, batting down in the order. Nothing to lose in a season where the playoffs are out of reach and let the fans enjoy an efficient lineup before players leave before 8/2. Please Bell, put this lineup out the last few weeks before the deadline. Pham, JV, Farmer, Drury, Stephenson, Naquin, DH, India and Senzel
Forgot Naquin’s 22 RBIs
Bell has no clue how to structure a batting order. Drives me nuts. Senzel should be leading off. Pham 2nd, Votto 3rd and Drury 4th. Drop India down to take the pressure off for now.
The deck chairs on the Titanic metaphor is such a cliche that I hate to use it, but nothing else applies as well to the batting order of the Reds, circa 2022. And anyway, Joey batting 3rd?
Stop it SteveO! You’re thinking logically and making way too much sense!
Remember some in the analytics crowd claim lineup construction is irrelevant.
Won’t bore you guys with this KBO pitcher after this because the Reds are too cheap to sign him anyway, but it just bugs me that he’s so much more refined then HG.
3 ip today w/1 hit, no runs, 2 Ks, no walks. 98 on the heater, 92.8 on wipeout slider that doesn’t hang over the plate and say “Crush me” like HGs, and 88.3 on the splitter. Darvish was more electric coming in, but he’s good. Its a shame our guys are so far behind developmentally
Mychal Givens? Had a bad Sept with us, but he was good for 2 months or whatever. Era down to 3.34 and holding righties to .616 ops. He’s 10x better then anyone in the dumpster fire bullpen we have now. Bring him back for 2 years! If the manager can help him avoid lefties then he’s a weapon!
Both Votto and Moustakis should be limited to facing right handed hitters in a pinch hit role. Let McGarry try first base. Can’t do any worse and has more power at this point. Have nothing to lose by bringing Cerda up as well. Naquin can be the DH against right handed hitters and Farmer or Solana against lefties.
Also might consider bringing Greene out of the pen for one or two innings at a time instead of going with a six man rotation if Lodolo works out. Need to DFA Cessa
That’s a slippery slope….
Once Greene goes to the BP, I don’t see him coming back out.
Witness: Cingrani, Iglesias, Chapman, Stephenson.
All promising Reds starters who they just couldn’t manage to develop and wound up in the BP.
Maybe that is the future for Greene, but I’d hate to throw in the towel now.
How about at least a hint of positivity on a gloomy morning when a thunderstorm got me up and awake at an unearthly hour (0700) for a retired person like myself?
Tyler Stephenson jumped right in behind the plate Monday night in the first game of his rehab stint. He caught five innings, batted twice, and had 1hit.
Stephenson immediately catching versus taking a game or two as DH may be a sign they hope to fast track him back to the Reds. The Bats are off Tuesday which provides the typical off day for Stephenson to rest and be evaluated. The question could be will he be back in Cincy on Wednesday or instead complete another rehab game/ evaluation cycle targeting Friday for his return to the Reds.
25 games under at the halfway point. Is major organizational change needed? In my opinion, without a doubt. But, if influential members of the Red’s ownership group do not set in, I doubt it.
Who is in a position to challenge the Castellini ownership/ management? The Williams family? Or, did their money also leave along with favorite son Dick? One explanation of the extreme frugality of the Reds since DW’s departure could be that his family’s share of Reds was (or is being) bought back by the organization thus creating a financial bind.
Also, there have been reports that a significant number of the Reds ownership “shares” are limited equity shares with no voting rights.
I fear unless someone shows up and makes a proverbial offer “too good to refuse” or MLB steps in behind the scenes and forces change, Reds fans are stuck with what they have for ownership.
STUCK is the main word regarding current Red’s ownership. As long as there is no positive change, nothing more will come from this fan on the subject.
Major Organizational change? Why on earth would you do that?
Everything is going swimmingly!!! Couldn’t be better!!! 🙂
Okay, that was over the top. I frankly don’t know what I would do if I owned the team….but…..There are some players I would promote and move closer to the ML Team.
I did see that Brandon Williamson has been moved up from AA to AAA Louisville. That’s one! Ricky Karcher, also was moved up to AAA from Chattanooga.
That’s two!
Move Elly De La Cruz up to AA from High A.
Okay, well, Hunter Greene is at 10 losses for the season.
I know the current trend is to downplay W-L records, but I strongly doubt it doesn’t have some effect on a players psyche.
He really doesn’t appear to be ‘learning it a MLB level’.
While he shows some good sequences, he’s still getting hammered. A lot.
His overall pitching experience shows.
What to do?
Even on his regulated innings schedule he’s on track to lose 15 games in his rookie season.
Is that what the Reds want to see?
Baring injury or total pitch count, he and the team will stick it out. I get the ‘he’s learning’ thing, except, I’m not sure what it is he’s learning. Perhaps he’ll turn into a Cueto…but I’m not seeing the Cueto psyche at work.
I tend to think that losses on the record matter more than wins. Losses mean the team was behind when the starter was replaced. While true that relievers may turn a small deficit into an insurmountable one, a pitcher with an ERA north of 6 is not a frequent victim of that scenario. Wins, on the other hand, are becoming less significant. A starter can go 6 or 7 and be comfortably in the lead, but fail to get a win due to BP malfeasance in office. Starters control losses to a greater degree than they control wins; wins depend on someone else’s competence while losses are nearly always on the starter.
Maybe we need a W-ND-L record for starting pitchers to give a better idea. Wins plus No Decisions for a starter should exceed Losses.
I generally agree with this. When I see a starter with a high loss total, I look at his IP, game situations when he left, and the status of his bequeathed runners on base.
In 2021 the Reds lost 2/3 of the starts made by Castillo and he personally lost 2/3 of his decisions. I ran the numbers and the mean of his in game ERAs was >6 in the team’s losses and < 2 in the team's wins. He was often brilliant when the team eventually won the game and often not very good when the team lost the game.
We know Castillo and Cueto both struggled in near identical ways to Hunter Greene their rookie years—they kept grinding and eventually figured it out. I only need to see 2 things from Greene (and Ashcraft, and Lodolo) the rest of this season:
1. Stay healthy and make all your starts.
2. Keep tweaking your pitch usage and sequencing……develop the confidence to throw 3 pitches in any count.
Don’t disagree but it might be a lot easier and less stressful for Greene to develop the 3rd pitch and art of mixing pitches at AAA than absorbing the punishment at MLB.
This is not to mention that a month at AAA would keep him from making a full season of service time this year. I don’t see sending him back (partially) for that reason when he is struggling at MLB to be nearly as onerous as holding a guy back to gain the “extra” (nearly 7th full season) of control.
Jim Maloney struggled in the early 1960s even though he pitched for Reds from 1960 through 1970. He spent time in AAA in 1960 and 1962. He won 23 games in 1963.
Greg Maddux – 14 losses
Tom Glavine- 17 losses
Randy Johnson- 13 losses
All in their first full seasons. Everyone needs to breathe. Hunter has had some good games including a no hitter. When he learns to pitch and not throw and hit his spots he will turn the corner. Cowboy said he is a kid who likes to learn and get better. Don’t be surprised if he comes in next season with that 3rd pitch. He is only 22. Everybody comments that the Reds don’t bring their young guys up until they are or close to 25. Let him pitch and learn here. Greene won’t learn anything in AAA pitching against mostly journeymen. He is going to struggle at times. He is the least of the Reds worries.
JB, this site is no place for rational thought.
Again, agree 100% Old Big Ed! Illogical thinking only please!
Comparing Greene to Cueto thru their first 16 games as starting pitchers for the Reds is interesting. Both were 22 years old, so it’s an interesting rookie comparison.
Greene is giving up fewer hits (lower batting average) and has a lower WHIP. Green also has a much higher strikeout rate.
So it seems that on the whole, Green had a better first 16 games, which is impressive since he only had about 1/2 the innings before his MLB debut.
But where Green is struggling vs Cueto is giving up 0.7 more HR’s per 9 IP, leading to a higher ERA (6.01 vs 5.01). So his mistake pitches are leading to more damage.
Another thing dragging down Greene is a much, much worse bullpen giving up inherited runs. And a much, much worse offense making it difficult to get a good W vs L ratio. If Luis Castillo is only 3-4, there is no way a rookie Hunter Green is going to have a good Win-Loss record with this team.
Per MLB(.)com 8 of the 13 runners bequeathed by Greene have scored. It would take some digging to figure out how many of these 8 became earned runs versus unearned but for the sake of it, let’s presume all 8 were earned then assume half or them were earned.
If all 8 were earned Greene’s ERA drops to 5.11.
If half of the 8 were earned, his ERA drops to 5.56
So, this does make a difference.
Gameday shows that Greene throws a change up from time to time? Is this accurate or is he strictly a 2 pitch pitcher.
I agree with all the comments. I hope a 3rd pitch is soon developed and or trusted to throw more.
I don’t know what the weather is in Cincinnati right now but if it is anything like here in the NE Dayton area ~50 miles north of GABP, the Reds could be in line for a nightmare scenario if 2 double headers in 3 days.
I was awakened by a downpour around 7AM; and, we currently (~1230pm) have very dark skies horizon to horizon and a steady to hard rain falling to a symphony of lightning and thunder.
If it were still spring, I’d say a very low chance of clearing by evening but in summer these things can cook up regionally and be gone very quickly in these parts.
its been kinda crazy but looks great now.
Well, the good news is at 25 games under .500 we are probably at rock bottom. We will look back at laugh at this season some day.
Young players will emerge. They always do.
We should get a great return for Castillo and Mahle.
We have the makings of a solid rotation even without Hunter Greene.
The Reds will have a lot of money to spend over the next couple of years.
There is a lot of work to do, but over the several few years the next great Reds team will emerge.
1982 led to 1990.
It will get better. Go Reds!
i think it is going to get worse V4L. In the 1980s you had a meaningful draft that yielded good athletes like Paul O neil, Eric Davis, and Barry Larkin. now it is all about supply in demand. fewer talented position players out there and i just don’t see the reds spending the money to get the few good players that remain. Hope I am wrong but I am quite depressed about the future of our Reds
i wish Larkin would work with India and Senzel on their base stealing steals. the mets pitcher had an awful pick off move last night yet India just took a 3 step lead and got thrown out by 2 feet on the steal attempt. i remember Joe Morgan having both feet on the carpet when he took his lead offs at riverfront
If Greene would just work the top of the zone with his fastball like Strider did the other day? Keeping the ball down is a misconception when you center-cut as many balls as HG does. He’d be a killer in a dart game, but this isn’t darts. Work top of the zone at 98-101 though and not too many guys are getting on top of that. Plus a split or straight change? Or a slow curve/knuckle curve. Just show it to them if you can’t get it over. Atleast makes the heater look faster.
Who’s been instructing this kid?
Had to delete some comments and ban some users. Sorry for taking so long to get them wiped out – I had been writing all morning and not peaking in on the comments.
As a side note – if anyone ever sees a comment that tells another user to kill themselves, please use the contact form on the site and email me about it. I try to see all of the comments, but it doesn’t always happen, and I don’t want stuff like that slipping through because I was too busy on a given day and didn’t see it.
Thanks Doug. Good to know how to report something like that to you for the future.
its been kinda crazy but looks great now.
oops, that was meant for Jim and weather today.
Sun shining here too for now. Like I said, summer and stuff can cook up locally/ regionally and clear just as quickly as opposed to the front related storms of spring.
Reds claim Ian Gibault for MLB bullpen.
FB 97.1 and good spin on his curve per mlb traderumors
multiple roster moves coming
Yeah, I saw that – another game changing acquisition. His third team in a week tells you all you need to know. And with no options left, he has to have a 40 slot, not that there aren’t plenty of DFA candidates available. It’s just that wishful thinking always has me hoping for a serious trade/pickup or even promotion. I’ll be very surprised if this guy can have a more positive effect on the bullpen than any of the other “pitchers” they’ve “found”. Maybe Lodolo will look like Steve Carlton and Scherzer like a couple of other late 30’s players who shall remain unmentioned.
DB will name him closer in the pre game interview.
And I thought I was cynical. Schrock, Okey, and Santillian were the 40 man roster slots used. Santillian to the 60.
Haha
Sheldon is posting that Naquin is back in the lineup tonight. So that’s what 3 roster moves still pending today? One of the catchers seems likely to be DFA’d, probably Koz but we’ll see.
okey DFA, Schrock to AAA, Santillan to 60 day IL
If I am Schrock, I am begging please let me be the DFA, so I can get a chance somewhere.
Saw that. And after all the hype about “when Schrock gets back”, he played little and hit less. He just wasn’t old enough to make the lineup. And I guess we’re still going to pretend that Farmer is day-to-day for a few more days and run a guy down on the bench. And if Schrock has been sent down, who is Bell’s new mop up pitcher?
So Okey goes from someone who we like to designated for assignment. Baseball is a cold business. I do hope he gets claimed and has a great career.
Is Farmer going to DL, 3 catchers on active roster. Who’s on first. Lol
They cannot IL Farmer, that would leave the door open for Barrero to get a chance, Bell says never, never never as long as long as I am manager
Barrero simply can’t hit and shouldn’t get a chance