In you happened to miss it, the Cincinnati Reds traded outfielder Jesse Winker and Eugenio Suárez to the Seattle Mariners on Monday afternoon for pitcher Justin Dunn, outfielder Jake Fraley, prospect Brandon Williamson, and a player to be named later. If you want to read more about that deal then we’ve got you covered right here.

But if you want to hear from Jesse Winker, Eugenio Suárez, and Reds general manager Nick Krall…. well, we’ve also got you covered. They each spoke to the media in Goodyear after the deal was announced and each shared their thoughts.

164 Responses

  1. realist

    Is their a worse owner/GM combo in all of sports right now than big Bob and Nick Krall?

    • NELSON COBLE

      Just read Votto’s comments. He is pissed as well. India isn’t real happy either.

    • NELSON COBLE

      Keep posting Krall’s comment from today. He is an idiot and so is BS Bob.

      “The player to be named later is also a player we like” We just don’t know who it is yet
      Give me a Break

      • Michael E

        Per Dipoto PTBNL comes from an agreed upon list, but when has any PTBNL been anything more than a way-down-the-prospect-list type of player. It’s a low ceiling, low floor flyer on some 19 or 20 year old. We all know that. They might actually like the player they plan to request from that list, but that doesn’t mean their good prospects.

        He knows he’s not fooling us, but Krall is in a crappy position gutting the payroll and knowing other teams have leverage (they know Castellini just wants to dump money, so they’re driving a hard bargain).

        I really don’t blame Krall. Might a shrewd(er) GM get better deals in salary dumps? Probably, but some might get worse too. It is what it is and it’s all via Castellini and the ownership group’s direct coercion.

        I do wonder if most of the minority owners are requesting payroll dump too, or if its just Bob the controlling owner? Anyone have any inside scoop?

      • GARY

        There was a time not too long ago where baseball fans hated former GM Jim Bowden, and undoubtedly many still do.

        But Bowden has now passed on that “MOST HATED” title to Nick Krall.
        We’ll put him right up there with Dick Wagner from the late 70s-early 80s.

        I AM ASHAMED AND EMBARRASSED RIGHT NOW FOR THIS CITY.

      • Steven Ross

        Krall is like a Boss I had once: simply the messenger for Management. He’s repeating what’s been told to him from above. You can take your frustration out on Krall but honestly, you should aim higher.

  2. CP

    Just think of all those quality free agents that will be beating down the door to play for the 2022 Cincinnati Reds.

  3. LDS

    Again, why would we believe anything that Krall or Bell says. They been wrong within hours of their public statements, e.g., Winker is the starting LF’er, traded. Looking for a fifth starter prior to the Gray trade. These aren’t salary moves. Seriously, why bother listening to these guys. It’s a waste of air.

    • Alan Horn

      I have been around baseball a long time and I can tell you the Reds aren’t going anywhere with this leadership.

      • LDS

        I agree. Fans are playing Charlie Brown football with Lucy the owners.

      • MK

        Money makes a poor leader good and good great. Do you really believe Krall has been given the resources to be successful. And do you believe other teams don’t know this and know they all can lowball with their offers knowing Krall is under orders to make a deal? I can’t blame him.

        Bob gets a lot of the blame but by the same token I’m not sure he has the resources to play with the big boys. And, if he can make money being mediocre he will probably continue. The Brown’s played this game with the Bengals for years.

      • Alan Horn

        MK, that is no excuse for deceiving the Reds fans. He should just sell to someone who came afford the team and properly manage the team. Fans like me have a choice if we want to play his game.

      • LDS

        Sorry MK but as they say “that dog don’t hunt”. If Krall is simply a yes man, he shouldn’t stay in the job. It reflects a lack of integrity. Corporate America is full of toadies like Krall. In good companies, they are eventually fired.

      • Michael E

        LDS your argument is a worse hunting dog. There are just over 30 baseball GM positions in the entire U.S.A. The job is highly coveted by thousands. Once you get it, you’re going to do what you were hired to do. I am sure Krall is boxed in. Unless you want to be fired post-haste, you’re going to go out there and put a positive spin on things, you have no choice. We ALL do that more often then we even realize.

        I want to keep my job. I will tell a customer something I know isn’t true if it’s required of me to do by my employer.

        Integrity? A first class ticket to being homeless. I am not kidding. I have integrity, but NO ONE has 100% integrity. NO ONE. You cannot and exist in this world. Sorry.

      • JayTheRed

        Dick Williams got out cause he told Bob, yeah I’m not doing that.
        He said sell players off and lower salary or leave.

        Williams said ok then I leave.

      • Still a Red

        True…Williams left, good for him, his family is rich!!

    • LDS

      Disagree Michael. I’ve left jobs where I didn’t think the management was acting in the best interest of the company, employees, and customers. It’s not hard to do. And remarkably I’ve never been homeless. Some companies actually value integrity and too many people these days don’t. If Willliams actually left the Reds because he disagreed with Castellini’s direction then good for him.

      • Alan Horn

        Absolutely true LDS. I left a company because it fell into hands of junk bond folks. They wouldn’t listen to we Information Technology staff. They foolishly purchased Baan Software for 21 million dollars. They never got it to work and were not ever able to use the software. I left and went to work with my hometown University(best move I ever made as I have a great retirement and insurance.) My wife will need a liver transplant in the future and the great insurance is a blessing. The prior company went bankrupt (after being there around 50 years) and was bought out and the company moved to Texas. As for Michael, you need to take a serious look in the mirror because you are for sale. Nothing good ever comes out of that long term. I agree you have to do what the company says until you can find another job. What you don’t have to do is stay because then you are no better than they are.

      • LDS

        Alan, sorry to hear about your wife’s pending surgery. I wish her well.

      • Alan Horn

        Thanks LDS. The transplant depends on her MELD score getting to around 20. It goes back and forth between 10-14 right now. They won’t do a transplant until you are almost dead. If I had stayed with the company that went bad, I would have been destroyed financially(it went under). Thankfully, I went to work for Troy University for a total of 26 years with sick leave etc credited. There is a danger area between early retirement(age 62 or prior) where you have to pay insurance out of pocket until you are age 66(medicare). Even then you need a medicare supplement plan. Alabama state retirees are covered in that period on up to death at a greatly reduced out of pocket cost that supplements medicare. Imagine having to pay for a liver transplant out of pocket without even medicare. You guys working in the private sector need to be aware of that 4 year gap. If you have to pay health insurance out of pocket, it can be a thousand bucks or more per month. If something major hits during that time period, you could lose everything you worked for all your life.

      • Old-school

        Thanks for sharing Alan. Best to you and your wife. keep posting.

    • Melvin

      Krall strikes me as a liar, who really doesn’t want to be a liar, but doesn’t have enough guts not to be a liar. He looks scared to death talking about what’s going on. I guess we shouldn’t feel too sorry for him though considering he probably makes more money than any one of us and probably more than a lot of us put together. Poor guy. It’s obvious to me that Big Bob really doesn’t care if Krall is a good GM or Bell is a good manager. The only thing that really matters to him is that they both do and say what he tells them to. That’s why those two have their jobs with the Reds.

    • Votto4life

      Yeah, you can argue that Nick Krall is just carrying out Bob’s marching orders. You would be correct, but that doesn’t absolve Nick Krall completely. He stands at the podium and lies constantly to his employees, his customers and to the People of Cincinnati. He doesn’t get a pass from me.

  4. SOQ

    We were so close last year. Re-signing Nick C, and shoring up OF, and we could have possibly made a deep run in the playoffs this year. This would have gone a long way towards “Sustaining” fan interest.

    • Greenfield Red

      They weren’t anywhere near close last year. I said all along 67-95 would ha e been better. Several on here disagreed. I’d rather be picking 3rd or 4th that 18th or whatever.

      In the grand scheme of life, baseball isn’t all that important. However, for the sliver of me that can be devoted to a game, this is a disaster.

      • Votto4life

        Well, if you really think 67-95 is better than 83-79, I just don’t know what to say. But, if you really feel that way, you should definitely rush out and buy a 2022 season ticket, because you are going to be very happy with this team.

      • Greenfield Red

        I have no interest in buying season tickets I probably wouldn’t go if given season tickets. 83-79 or whatever it was is no way to build a sustained winner. Give me red hot or ice cold. Luke warm is for losers

  5. JoshG

    I call BS on Krall … this trade was definitely about money first, if not Suarez would not have been included or at least all of his salary and the prospects coming back would have been better

    • JoshG

      that said, I think he is just doing his job, and maybe a pretty good job even.. if he was told he had to get the payroll down to a certain number…

  6. RedsFanInFL

    Seems like we are in a new 5 year rebuild every year

  7. Kevin H

    While I respect your opinion, I disagree. In the past 6 months reds have lost 3 top rbi guys, gold glove catcher and two starters in the rotation. Not to mention no bullpen help. These moves r salary dumps or not resigning free agents. I for one will be rooting for Winker, Barnhart, Gray, and Miley this season. Suarez not as much but he like the others fan favorites. I won’t be rooting for this club this season. As the owner and gm has made it crystal clear.

  8. Oldtimer

    Nick Krall has ZERO experience as GM.

    And it shows.

    Back in the days of my youth, Gabe Paul, Bill DeWitt, and Bob Howsam all had experience before they became Reds GM.

    Paul was a master trader in the 1950s despite a couple poor trades (Temple for McLish, Hoak/Haddix/Burgess for Thomas). Howsam was an even better trader (Morgan and Seaver were his two best trades but Tony Perez trade his worst).

    DeWitt made some good trades (McMillan for Jay and McLish for Freese) but was better at drafting and/or developing young talent in the Reds minor leagues.

    • SOQ

      Dewitt did have one big “Oops” by the name of Frank Robinson 😉

    • Bob Purkey

      A couple of real bad ones Robby for canon fodder and Jerry Lynch for Bob Skinner.

  9. Doug

    Why should I pay to see this team and put money in Bob Castellini’s pocket?

    • TheCoastMan

      Because he’s only getting 110 mil from the national TV contract and revenue sharing and 50 mil or so on his Fox TV partnership. As BP once said, he found a new fruit. I guess he needs the cash for R & D.

      • MBS

        Where did you get the 110 figure? I’ve looked many times, but it’s never been disclosed. That being said, I am still a fan of the team, I didn’t expected 22 to be a good year. Making these moves will hopefully help the next version of the Reds.

      • Old Big Ed

        Coast, man, you need to read the article again.

        “The revenue [from national contracts] will be split to give each team $60.1 million annually; Combined with local TV deals that are worth at least $40 million each, every MLB club will make at least $100 million from TV deals alone …”

        The Reds might get $100 to $110 million total from TV deals, and certainly not $160 million. Their ticket revenue has been way off for two seasons, and it won’t be any better this year, in light of the circumstances.

      • TheCoastMan

        I stand corrected on that part Big Ed, but don’t forget about the equity stake in Fox Ohio.

        And, does “a nice bump” mean the local fox deal only went from 30 to 40 million? Either way you cut it, he is getting at the minimum more than 110 million before any attendance, merchandising or concessions.

        Again, I don’t profess to know all of the expenses of running a MLB team, but I’m having a hard time believing that Castellini is this broke.

  10. DaveCT

    I live an hour and half drive from Seattle. They have a beautiful stadium and an eager fan base. Their High A team is just a 45 minute drive, and their AAA team is twenty-thirty minutes past Seattle. They had seven top 100 guys in the BA list before the trade. Now they Wink and Geno, two of the most affable players you will find. Not to mention ex-Reds Trammell and other minor leaguers whose names elude me. See where I’m going with this?

    • Gonzo Reds

      Been a Reds fan since about ‘72 when I was 6. My sister lives in Seattle. I normally refuse to root or watch AL baseball because I hate the DH rule. Jump ship or give up on baseball all together? Just dropped out of 2 fantasy baseball leagues as well I’m so disgusted including one I’ve run for almost 20 years. Just sick.

      • DaveCT

        This is a regression into the dark ages.

  11. TheCoastMan

    Oh, I doubt Krall and Big Bob are finished either. I wouldn’t be shocked if he trades Mahle and Castillo for 2 boxes of crackers jacks and a used bag of balls in the next day or so.

    • Alan Horn

      They will be lucky to get that given their incompetence. They have no clue as to how to run a professional sports team. As with any business you have to be willing to spend some money to make money. Their actions have backed them deep into the corner of not making any money other than the guaranteed TV money. Good luck covering any expenses to speak of from ticket sales and concessions.

  12. SteveO

    Ok, 1 last trade of Castillo and Mahle to the Angels for Marsh, Adell, Detmers, Bachman and Paris. Angels will instantly have one of the best rotations in MLB and we fill some OF holes and pitching depth for 2022 and beyond. Detmers joins the group for starting rotation spot in 2022. Best 5 going forward starters for 2022. 2023, very possibly 2022 starting rotation of Greene, Lodolo, Williamson, Detmers and Ashcraft. Gutierrez, Sanmartin and Dunn to bolster the bullpen.
    Stephenson, JV, India, Barrero, Senzel, Adell, Marsh, Naquin starters with Moose as DH. Bench of Knapp, Farmer, Schrock, Friedl. Farmer right handed DH and spot starts in IF. Aquino traded for minor league depth piece and Shogo sold back to NPB with Cincinnati eating majority (6-6.5M)of salary. Salary in line with cheap owner needs and young, competitive lineup with the future in mind. Might have growing pains with starting rotation, but invaluable experience moving forward.

    • SteveO

      Forgot Fraley. Friedl or Fraley bench piece

    • west larry

      If I had to trade Castillo and Mahle, I would do your suggested trade with the angels in a heartbeat. But would the Angels pull the trigger on that deal?

      • MBS

        I’m guessing no, that deal could work with out Marsh, but teams don’t usually like to make such large trades.

      • SteveO

        It would have to include Detmers, Bachman and Marsh and Adell. We could add a Farley, Friedl or Richardson if they want a P or take out Paris. Mahle is a Cali kid going back home and Castillo is a warm weather P. Being in SoCal from April will definitely benefit Castillo

    • Alan Horn

      That trade would at least bring a decent return.

  13. Daytonnati

    Love the shots Winker gets in about going to a place that wants to win.

    Both he and Eugenio, though, seem heartbroken.

    • Melvin

      Winker: “I’m looking forward to going to Seattle. We want to win”. Hmm Is he implying that the Reds (Big Bob) aren’t trying to win? How can he say that?…..hahaha 🙂

    • D Ray White

      Winker handled that interview with class. Gonna miss him and Geno. Bob needs to sell the team; he’s an embarrassment to the team’s history and tradition. The team is farther from “championship baseball” than when he bought the team, and ownership has squandered two quality contenders while lining their pockets. The only fear is that some out-of-towner tries to move the Reds elsewhere.

      • Alan Horn

        Both he and Geno did. How could any young player or FA want to play for the tanking Reds.

  14. Bob Purkey

    That OF will strike fear into opposing pitchers: Naquin, Aquino and Shogo. Don’t forget Senzel too….right up until he gets hurt about May 15

    • Alan Horn

      History says he won’t last until May. It would be a pleasant surprise if he actually played all season unhurt and produced well.

      • Wallyum

        That would be great. Then they could trade him in the off season for t-ball futures.

  15. Cyrus

    Two big takeaways for me after listening to Winker/Suarez comments:
    1) In spite of everything most of us post on this site (which mostly revolves around ownership/management), here are 2 men who LOVED being on this team, representing this city and living in Cincy. Both are clearly upset about what has happened and most assuredly feel betrayed (but maybe that is too strong a word choice). A very sad day for all of us. Jesse Winker has intangibles that you need in a leader and he was the one guy I would never have traded.

    2) This may sound a bit far-fetched but, since we all know this is a financial decision, I think a big reason this was done was to get Votto to agree to a trade. He now knows he has no shot at anything for the remainder of his career if he stays in Cincy. I think they are banking on him agreeing to a trade now that the team has no real success possibility for the next 3-4 years.

    • MBS

      I don’t agree it was to make Votto accept a trade, but I do think it improves the odds that he’d take a trade. I’d kinda like to see him retire as a Red, like I watched Larkin. Both are special players. I wouldn’t let that sentimentality keep me from making a good deal, but it’d be nice.

      • Jimbo44cn

        I love Joey but I think he should ask to be traded. No chance of him getting a ring here, or even a playoff game. This ownership group headed by that pompous greedy imbecile Castellini should sell. Now.

      • JayTheRed

        Just read that Guerro has been taking reps at 3b. Could something be in the mind of the Blue Jays. I’d be happy for Votto to go the Blue Jays.
        Since I’ll be rooting for them this year and beyond, most likely.

    • MK

      Yankees and Toronto are supposedly in Freeman bidding. Maybe loser wants Joey. But getting them to takes Joey’s contract we would probably have to include Greene.

      • Alan Horn

        The ones running the Reds probably would be fool enough to include Greene.

    • Hanawi

      Votto’s contract isn’t near the albatross that people think anymore especially after his resurgence last year. In fact, there are at least two others on the team that are even more untradeable right now (Shogo and Moustakas). I could see a team taking on most of Votto’s contract, though the Reds would likely get little to no return.

      • TheCoastMan

        True, but the Reds owe it to Joey to eat whatever they have to so he can be on a contending team for a shot at a ring. He’s been the consummate “company man” and role model for the younger players.

        Considering how things have turned out, I would be fine just cutting him and letting him decide who he wants to play with. Unfortunately, Big Bob is way to greedy for that so I fear that Joey is doomed to end his career on a “cellar dweller.”

    • Jeremiah James Grissom

      Cyrus that is an interesting and maybe true thought. I think Votto’s contract has somewhat hampered the Reds over the years since they aren’t a big time market, especially when he was having down years.

      I don’t know much about Nick Krall, but he seems a bit overwhelmed and not being totally honest with his comments in recent days. I heard a clip from a news conference about the players received from the Mariners and he confused all of their names it seemed. I feel for Krall a bit…I’m not sure he is being forced to make these moves or is cracking a bit under the pressure, but doesn’t look good for the Reds organization.

      I’m concerned they wouldn’t even get a good return for Castillo or Votto now. Castillo they definitely have to get a good return on if they trade.

      On the flip side…Winker has flaws with his injury history, not hitting lefties well, and I kind of think Sonny Gray’s best years may be behind him. You can justify some of the Reds moves, but overall it’s concerning the direction of this club. I am hopeful to see more Alejo Lopez now!

    • Still a Red

      If you read the Votto interview on the Reds website, it sounds like if the Reds want to trade him, he’d consider!! He says he’s committed to his contract and doing the best he can, any trade would come from management…he doesn’t want clinching playoff spot in an empty stadium 92020) his last chance.

      I don’s see how you can call this anything other than a rebuild, given the players the Reds are getting in exchange. This has got to be discouraging to India and Stephenson.

      • greenmtred

        Exactly right. It is a rebuild. I’m not certain that India and Stephenson (and Greene, Lodolo, etc.) are discouraged. Adding a few vets to last year’s team would not likely take the Reds deep into the playoffs. Building with the talented young players they have has the potential to.

      • old-school

        India was quoted as saying he’s very frustrated.

  16. Harold Bowman

    I’m not sure the franchise will ever survive with Bob as owner. He must be planning to sell the team. When you run a professional team you are going to make good moves and bad moves. I honestly feel sorry for Nick because he is only doing what he has been directed to do. He is dumping player to save money. MLB should investigate the way the team is being run. The fans of the team do not deserve to be treated like this. MLB PLEASE force the ownership to sell our team to someone who wants to try to complete. We were a bullpen away from competing this year even without Nick. Now we will fight it out with the Pirates the next several years for last place. How many years can we accept this. I love baseball and the Cincinnati Reds but this ownership has to go!!!! This move is a game changer. I don’t see how we can trust this ownership ever again

    • Jimbo44cn

      If I Krall is being forced to make these idiotic moves and statements, he should RESIGN

    • Votto4life

      Bob planning on selling the team is the one gleam of hope I cling to with regards to baseball.

      I enjoy baseball history. So when the Reds are terrible, I just spend my time reading about the past. Looks like I’ll be doing a lot of reading this summer until Bob sells the team or leaves the earth.

  17. Frankie Tomatoes

    Those were painful to watch for different reasons. Today really sucks to be a Reds fan.

  18. Bob Purkey

    So now we are at $62 million saved off the budget between Castellanos, Miley, Barnhardt, Gray, Suarez and Winker, primarily filled by 6 players making new MLB minimum of $700K makes for a net savings of about $56/57M.
    Nice job Bob!

    • Votto4life

      Yikes! That payroll is even lower than I thought. Should make a lot of people on here happy. Seems like some fans only care about cutting payroll. Yes Sir, they should be quite happy.

  19. Oldtimer

    (Nick Krall said this; clipped from http://www.reds.com website article)

    … All three new players will compete for spots on the Opening Day roster …

    “This wasn’t just a payroll move,” Krall said. “This was a move that we looked at from a future standpoint and we also looked at it as a move to bring back some talent right now. We really think Brandon Williamson is going to be on this club. The player to be named later is also a player we like, so it’s not just a throw-in there. We have a couple of months to be able to scout a group of players before we choose one.”

    • SOQ

      “The player to be named later is also a player we like” We just don’t know who it is yet
      Give me a Break

      • Oldtimer

        Yeah, I also LOL-ed at that.

        Nick Krall is not very good at what he does.

      • greenmtred

        He didn’t say that, though. Maybe he does know who it will be, or maybe the Reds like all of the possibilities.

    • Hanawi

      I thought the Mariners were saying that it was either a player or cash, which made it sound like they hadn’t decided on anyone yet.

      • Votto4life

        Yeah a PTBNL or cash considerations. That’s why the Red’s FO likes it so much, it’s their favorite player Pile O. Cash.

    • Votto4life

      Technically Krall was telling the truth. Allow
      me to interpret for you.

      “It wasn’t just a payroll move”

      it was 99.9999% a payroll move, but not entirely.

      “It’s a move that we helps us now and in the future”

      It is slashing payroll this season and next.

      “Some of the players we are acquiring, will compete for major league jobs this season”

      They will have to because we have already traded all of our major league talent.

      “We have a couple of months to scout from among a group of players”

      Because we had never heard of them before today. But we like them!

  20. Jack

    He says they are done with trades and now are looking at Free agents? We need a 3b, LF, CF, RF, at least 1 starter. Get real, no way they can replace what they just traded the last year with free agents. He’s lying and at this point he may as well keep going and trade Mahle, Castillo, Votto, Farmer

    • Votto4life

      You have to hand it to Nick Krall. To stand in front of the cameras like that and lie right through his ever loving teeth. He has a pair. I will give him that. Lol

      • Jimbo44cn

        No. He does NOT have a pair. If he did he would refuse to say such crap. We like the ptbnl. Like someone said. Give me a break.

      • Bob Purkey

        Krall looked like he just swallowed his only set of car keys, trying to say that this wasn’t a money purge.

        What it does say is that we certainly know why Williams left “to spend more time with his family.”

        What it also says is that Castellini is gutless to send Krall out there by himself to face the press and try to spin that garbage. Bob has no balls at all.

      • Bob Purkey

        Krall looked like he just swallowed his only set of car keys, trying to say that this wasn’t a money purge.

        What it does say is that we certainly know why Williams left “to spend more time with his family.”

        What it also says is that Castellini is gutless to send Krall out there by himself to face the press and try to spin that garbage.

      • Votto4life

        Well, Nick Krall isn’t going to resign. There is no way he would get another position like this in baseball or probably any other industry.

        I knew we were in for a rough time, when the front office didn’t even try to acquire a shortstop last off season. I thought at least a little of the Bauer savings would have been spent on an upgrade at short. But, I had no
        Idea though that this mess awaited us.

    • Votto4life

      I know Krall says they are going to focus on free agents now. He has been making phone calls. I swear he always mentions that he makes phone calls. Like he should be judged by the process and not the results.

      Nick Krall can call whoever he wants, but no free agent, in his right mind, would sign with the Reds, unless they can not land another major league job or the Reds make a massive overpay.

      We know the Reds are not going to do the latter.

    • greenmtred

      They have a million 3rd basemen on the roster. They don’t need a FA for that position. They’ve got outstanding young pitching talent, too.

    • Tom Diesman

      I’m sure he means minor league free agents. 🙂

  21. Votto4life

    Look like the other owners would be up in arms with the Reds tanking like this.

    If I owned a major league team I would be upset having to share revenue with an owner like Bob Castellini. Seems to me other owners wouldn’t want to carry teams like the Pirates and the Reds.

    I guess as long as everyone is making why should they care. It’s killing the sport though at least it is here in Cincinnati.

    • TXREDLEG

      The reds learned by watching Mike Brown – it’s not about fielding a competitive team, it’s about having a seat at the buffet table. I don’t think Brown could articulate this, but going to the SB is about luck and circumstance, so you might as well stuff your face while you’re here.

  22. Matt WI

    Wasn’t Bob one of the owners cited as having a strong reaction to raising the CBT about a week before they finally agreed? Is he throwing a tantrum about all of this?

    • TheCoastMan

      Yea, he was one of the 4 teams that voted against 2nd to last version because of the cap.

  23. Matt WI

    Straight class from Winker and Suarez. Good luck to them both.

  24. Cyrus

    I still remember the open letter Castellini wrote to the fans years ago when Jay and Joey were earlier in their careers. Cannot remember the details but a commitment was put out there regarding the quality of a Reds team going forward. We had that uptick under Dusty that culminated in our not going anywhere in the postseason and not much since.

    • Votto4life

      The Fans need to write an open letter to Bob now.

    • doofus

      Dear Cincinnati Reds Fans,

      We are proud to be the new owners of America’s first professional baseball team, the Cincinnati Reds.

      We’re long-time baseball fans who have grown up with the Reds and have fond memories of going to the ballpark. In our lifetime, we faithfully cheered on the Reds through three World Series championships, six National League championships and eight division titles.

      We know this team truly belongs to you, and we understand what the Reds mean to our city and our region. We know what a winning team can do for a city’s pride. We also understand the unique legacy the Reds hold in baseball history and the potential to reignite an American love affair with the nation’s first professional baseball team.

      It is with a sense of both responsibility and respect that we pledge to Reds fans:
      • We will bring championship baseball to Cincinnati. The Reds have a long tradition of success. Only three cities have won more World Series than Cincinnati. We will work hard to be a championship team again.
      • We will build one of the most respected organizations in baseball. As partners in other successful baseball organizations we know how it’s done. We will build a winning management team by putting the right people in the right positions with the right resources to win. We will foster a winning attitude and culture.
      • We will have a greater community presence. We will continue to improve the lives of area children by building on already successful Reds Community Fund programs like the Rookie Success League. Whether it’s providing a way for inner-city children to play baseball or generating funds for charity, we’ll take this outreach to a new level.
      • We will rekindle the Reds Nation spirit. We’ll share our story and our strategy, communicating directly with fans everywhere who want to know what is going on. When you visit the ballpark, we’ll periodically be asking for your feedback so we can continuously improve the experience. Our goal is that you feel a part of the Reds Nation whether you’re at the game, listening on the radio or living in another major league city.
      • We will not rest until you are happy. The Reds are, after all, your team. You buy the tickets. You watch the games. You support us financially and emotionally. Without you, the Reds cannot be great. We know you won’t be happy until the team wins. We won’t be happy, either.
      Bringing championship baseball to Cincinnati is the ultimate goal. Like you we believe in the power, potential and magic of the Cincinnati Reds. We will work tirelessly to bring a winner home to you.

      We thank you for this opportunity and hope to earn your support.

      Robert H. Castellini
      Chief Executive Officer W. Joseph Williams, Jr.
      Chairman of the Board Thomas Williams
      Vice-Chairman of the Board

      • VegasRed

        It is almost impressively amazing how virtually every promise in that statement has now been made into a lie by bob. I mean go through that statement word by word and sentence by sentence and you will be hard pressed to ever see a statement more exhaustively repudiated by one individual in the history of the written word. Wow. Just wow, bob. So utterly shameless and mendacious. History will not be kind sir.

    • Melvin

      Yeah. I’d say you are correct. Votto is a consummate professional…but he ain’t happy.

  25. votto4life

    Think the Reds now have the flexibility to add payroll if the team is close at the trading deadline ? ?

  26. Rednat

    somebody needs to walk Bob C off the ledge here. either someone from the organization or maybe the league. the 2 trades have been made out of frustration. they are self sabotaging , pity party, woe is me trades and you don’t have to be a psychologist to figure that out.

    look, I really understand his frustration. it has been a hard luck tenure for mr. Castellini going back ten years. you had the collapse against the giants in 2012, the disaster of the Cueto trade, the Joey Votto 3 year slump, the weather doesn’t cooperate. then finally 2020 comes around and it looks like we are turning things around and you have covid. then last year looks like we are headed to the playoff then the cardinals go on a once in a century win streak.

    i do think the frustration really came to a tipping point with the lockout. first this is the 3rd opening day in a row that has been disrupted. and for what? the small market teams got nothing out of the new agreement. No shift ban, no oversized bases, no international draft. all these things would help a team like the reds greatly.

    the only thing that came out of it was the anti tanking clause. GIMME A BREAK! These small market teams are not “tanking” to get a better draft pick. the draft is a joke anyway without the international players. they just cannot compete with the likes of the dodgers yankees and redsox.

    So i understand the frustration. we have all done stupid things out of frustration. but somebody needs to pump the brakes on these reds trades for a while or we will wake up finding out that India, Mahle and Castillo have been traded to the Yankees for a bucket of those glow in the dark baseballs!

    • Alex

      The reds don’t compete cause big Bob is a moron. The Yankees and dodgers are so much better run, money is just one aspect and you can blame that if you want but it wouldn’t matter. And how much more free money is big Bob supposed to get? He inherited daddy’s company, inherits a great stadium deal, inherits tv deals that render gate receipts meaningless, inherits a constantly rising number of playoff teams so he can faux compete, he’ll inherit five times his investment when he sells.
      But hey, if you read redlegnation during the CBA, you’ll know that big bob has it super tough. Being a billionaire trust fund baby is hard and owning a team is difficult. Just ask BK and Stock. They’ll tell you about it.

  27. Votto4life

    The Reds have only three “bad” contracts remaining. They have no salary obligations after the 2024 season.

    If Bob Castellini wants to put up a “for sale” sign at GABP, the team would easily attract potential buyers.

    I am sure when Bob Castellini bought this team, he wanted to see the Reds win the World Series so he could become a hometown hero.

    I am sure The Reds owner had visions of a Bob Castellini statue at the ball park some day. After what has happened this week, he will only be remembered as an incompetent spend thrift.

    If the Reds exist 50 years from now, the name Bob Castellini will only be used in vain.

  28. SOQ

    $62 Million savings in salary goes a long way towards “Sustaining” Bob C’s lifestyle.

  29. Steve

    If the players could get on board with boycotting Bob C then maybe the fans could to. Would love to see the players sit out until Bob sells the team. Rams and businesses in cincy need to invest in signs on highways telling bob to sell the team and fans refusing to go to any game that is played. And even picketing out front of the stadium. The fans deserve better, the players deserve better and the city of Cincinnati deserves better. We need to come together and force this joke of an owner out.

  30. doofus

    “We know this team truly belongs to you, and we understand what the Reds mean to our city and our region. We know what a winning team can do for a city’s pride. We also understand the unique legacy the Reds hold in baseball history and the potential to reignite an American love affair with the nation’s first professional baseball team.

    It is with a sense of both responsibility and respect that we pledge to Reds fans:
    • We will bring championship baseball to Cincinnati. “

    • Redgoggles

      Put this on a billboard in the city with the dates and quotes from BC, maybe that would generate a bit of pressure for the bossman.

  31. DataDumpster

    “Gee, Krispy Kruller, I didn’t think you would go that far to disrupt my plans”, said Tinkerbell. “Well, you know how Banana Bob is and that you and Buddy are the only ones left to stop it”. “KK, I know BB has been talking to The Good Trees lately so I’m going right up to H.R. since this is not reasonable or fair”. “Balderdash”, said KK, “It’s already been done, can’t you see that?”

  32. Still a Red

    As bad as Bob may be, if selling the team leads to them leaving, that would be the ultimate tragedy. Are the fans and citizens of Cincinnati ready to pony up the $$ to buy the team, ala the Packers.

    • SOQ

      And there it is. The Lindners and Farmers have invested in the new kids in town, FCC. Where is the Cincinnati big money to bail us out of this mess?

      • Steve

        We don’t need Cincy big $ there are billionaires that would love to own a team. Look at Shad Khan. He had no connection to Jax before buying the jaguars. I would love to have an outside billionaire purchase the reds and actually try to win

    • Steve

      I’d be happy if they moved and then we would be first in line for a expansion team. I am willing to wait 10 years with no baseball in Cincy if it means getting a new owner. With Bob at the helm we have no hope of winning. Just continual losing baseball.

  33. Jack

    I can understand trading Suarez but why now? He is at his rock bottom value. Based on his 2nd half resurgence see if it continues this year. His contract is not bad at all if he is the old Suarez and would surely get interest at the trade deadline. Including him now just meant we got less compensation for Winker.

    • wkuchad

      Maybe his 2nd half resurgence is the only reason Seattle made the trade. It’s possible we did sell high.

      • Old Big Ed

        There wasn’t any “second half” to his resurgence. He hit .140 in August, with a .576 OPS. It was all September, which was largely fueled by a .432 BABIP.

        Granted, in September he quit overswinging, which all of us could have told him in mid-April to quit doing. The amazing thing about him last year is that he just wouldn’t correct his obvious flaws. I will concede that by all accounts he is a very nice man.

        The Reds are heavy favorites to get more production out of 3B in 2022 than they did in 2021.

  34. Old Big Ed

    I am no more capable of changing what team I root for than I am of changing who my mother is, so …

    I suppose that the trade opens the door for Nick Senzel to move back to third base, although a combo of Alejo Lopez and Max Schrock may play third, if Senzel stays in center. Moustakas is in theory a third baseman, but Pee Wee Herman was in theory young.

    An infield of (a healthy) Senzel, Barrero, India and Votto would actually be pretty good. Stephenson at catcher is very good offensively, too. The outfield, though, will likely be the worst in baseball. Naquin and … ???? Maybe Lopez/Schrock in left? Farmer? Akiyama appears to be useless, and although a bad hamstring might be a legit excuse, I think TJ Friedl is better at all aspects of baseball than is Akiyama. Fraley — yet another LH “hitter”? Lorenzo Cedrola??

    Without a trade or a free-agent signing, which seems dubious, it appears that they will have to play Aquino full-time, maybe even in centerfield. Aquino is ill-suited as a bench player, but may even be more ill-suited as a regular.

    I’ll still watch, but I will be watching Dayton and Chattanooga with more interest.

    • Alan Horn

      Agrees with my assessment of the team. If Naquin is injured or falls off production wise, the OF won’t even be a good rookie league OF.

    • wkuchad

      Agree, that outfield would be the worst in MLB. That’s why I would keep Senzel in CF and hope this is finally his injury free year.

      A combo of Schrock and Moose would be adequate at 3B, especially if Moose comes out of the offseason in shape and fully recovered.

    • Nathan

      Love this. And, yeah…I’ll never stop being a Reds fan, but I’m actively trying to figure out if there is another team I want to root for. You know…an actual Major League team, with Major League players at each position. A team who makes rational decisions and attempts to win. 😉

      The Reds are reminding me a lot of the Marlins for much of their history. Now we know how they feel.

      It’s between San Diego and Toronto. Almost rooting for Joey to be traded there to make the decision easier.

      • Old Big Ed

        I went to school in the Boston area, and became a Red Sox fan when I was there, but always as Team B. I will root a bit for the Mariners this year.

        You probably need to restrict your Team B to an American League team, to avoid conflict of interest issues, plus as a practical matter you would need to be a serious night owl to root for a west coast team or even a team in the West divisions. The White Sox might work, because doing so is back-handed way to dig the Cubs.

    • Melvin

      I hesitate to post this because I don’t want fruit and vegetables thrown at me, even figuratively, lol, but I actually hope and look forward to Aquino playing a full season. I think given regular ABs he will more than show his value. Okay….now I’m ducking. 🙂

    • Votto4life

      Ed, I feel the same. I may not follow this team a great deal this summer, but it won’t be because I am adopting a different favorite team.

      Since this team has been mostly miserable the past half century, I have learned to appreciate baseball for the sake of baseball. Still, I won’t be
      Investing much time or money in this crap show.

      • LWBlogger2

        I have often enjoyed games MUCH more when I don’t really have a rooting interest in the teams involved.

  35. old-school

    With Suarez traded, third base is wide open. As bad as Moose was last year defensively, why wouldn’t you slide Farmer to 3b and put Barrero as the everyday SS. Or at least platoon Farmer and Moose and give Moose 2-3 days at 3b and 2-3 days at DH and a day at 1b with Farmer 3 days at 3b a day 2b and a day at SS to rest India and Barrero once a week.

    Theres simply no credible argument to start Moose at 3b every day.

    • VaRedsFan

      I like the Farmer/Moose/Senzel 3B platoon option

  36. VaRedsFan

    I think I’m in the minority here. Yes, I wish they got more for our better players. What we did get was an opportunity to bring in young/hungry players to fill the voids. People last year were so down on India, but he got an opportunity when Moose went down to acclimate to the Majors….He would have rode the bench or be sent down otherwise. I don’t know who steps in, but I hope he is young and seizes the opportunity like India did last year.

    Losing Barnhardt – more opportunities for Stephenson – You know Bell would have kept playing TB if he was still here.
    Losing Gray – The Reds are flush with young arms ready to make the next step. Sonny was small in stature, but big on heart. He gave it everything he had on every pitch, and his body started to let him down. 32 years old. They got the Twins #1 pick from a year ago. It might be a lottery ticket, but there is a lot of potential.
    Losing Suarez – Loved the man, but not the player he turned into. He was a great all-field hitter his first few years in Cincy, but fell in love with the HR. So many empty AB’s in crucial situations, with the occasional long ball.
    Losing Winker – I feel like there was so much missed opportunity. He was a legit .300/400/.500 guy (vs. righties) but couldn’t figure out lefties (.188/305/295). Maybe he needed more opportunities to figure them out, but sooner or later you have to prove it. He never played more than 113 games in a season. Hope he finds success in SEA.

    The Reds would have won more games in 2022 with those guys. But we all know that .500 (and maybe a #8 seed in the playoffs) was about the ceiling for that group. Tear it down and try to build something that we can have better expectations than the 8th seed.

    I too, wish they had an owner with deep pockets, and could buy up some shiny free agents. They probably won’t ever be that. Until Mark Cuban, walks through that door they probably never will. But I won’t stop rooting for them.

    • Mark A Verticchio

      I am on your side on this. While true we might have got more, but the truth is these young guys could turn into something. While the team lost a lot of players, the truth is this group has under achieved with 83 wins being their max. Most people don’t like it but with all this young pitching not far off it was time for a re-build. The problem is I still don’t trust this front office to lead a successful re-build but at least it has begun. Now they need to make the right moves to continue a successful re-boot.

    • Steven Ross

      Jeff Bezos could also walk through that door and I’d approve.

      You’re 100% right about Gray and especially, Suarez. I gave Tucker some slack because he is one heck of a defensive catcher but yeah, replaceable and Bell would definitely run him out way too often.

      Not sure I would have given up on Da Wink though. Lots of talent. Only issue I have is the paltry Seattle return. I mean, come on. Is that the best we can do? The Twins #1 prospect in return for Gray is 18 years old. Good luck to us.

  37. Jim Delaney

    If Castellini isn’t planning to sell team he may get pressure d soon by league. Other NL owners are pissed Reds are throwing away 2022. With Cubs and Pirates already tanking this has setup Brewers and Cards for huge advantage in NL for playoffs and seeding vs other teams in other division. Reds would have made playoffs in 21 under the new format. They were highly unlikely to be a playoff team in 22 but they would have been competitive likely 72-76 win type team. Now that they are having fire sale and receiving well below market value on there talent other teams in NL are screaming. And the trading isn’t done, they will trade Mahle or Castillo for a bag of balls to accept Moustaskas contract. Expect this trade to happen in the next couple of days.. Sorry state of affairs in Mudville/Cincinnati…

  38. Old Big Ed

    I suspect that there was deep disagreement in the ownership group on which direction to take with this team.

    Having a money-losing 2020 (after going all-in for a 2020 run), a weak financial year in 2021, and the realization that the Moustakas, Akiyama and Suarez contracts were problems, I thought the thing to do after last season was to make a capital call on the partners. That would have allowed the team to weather the storm financially until 2024, when bad contracts were off the books and the much-improved development system would open a clear window.

    But they didn’t do that, and they instead decided to take a huge PR hit by cutting payroll the way that they have. It is pretty apparent that a good hunk of the owners (and maybe all of them) either did not want to cough up some capital for a couple of years, or else they simply didn’t have the money to do so.

    So, it may not be so much the Castellini family that doesn’t want to pay, as it is the ownership group in general, which would include the Castellinis.

    As somebody pointed out above, in 2024, when the Reds no longer have ANY long-term contracts on the books and a fertile farm system, the franchise will be at peak value. The cash flow will be huge, and the team should be opening a competitive window. Maybe the ownership group will sell out then.

    • Optimist

      Yes – there’s likely something going on amongst the partners. I’ve said before that it seems they let the managing partner have its way, so I doubt the capital call, but I expect the Dick Williams interlude as GM was a portent.

      I think he returns as managing partner when they buy up Castellini’s controlling share. I think this year is to clean house financially, and the following year or two is Bell and others last barring a surprise run.

      2024 is when Dick can point to the changes and production from the minors coming into MLB, and hopefully they “align resources” at a higher level.

      They’re not at Pirates/O’s/Marlins level but it’s a shame they are close to that.

      • TR

        If what is stated above turns out to be true, it is a positive.

    • Redsvol

      @old School – some form of this is very likely what has occurred the last 2 years. The team was set up to go for it and the pandemic ruined 2 years for an ownership group that simply couldn’t weather the storm. If they hand onto a few veterans, I think it will be a fun, competitive team to follow for a couple years. If they get rid of the remaining veterans, they will not be competitive until 2024.

  39. Old-school

    I hate losing Winker. The guys can hit Rh pitchers as good as anyon in baseball. Losing Gray and Suarez doesn’t bother me a bit. Gray is a great competitor but IMO….is regressing quickly. Suarez lost it after 2019.

    Bobby Nightengale has video of Graham Ashcraft throwing 98 mph.
    I’m a youth movement guy so I love to see that and I’m calling it now….Ashcraft will be in the rotation come Opening day- mostly because he dominated in 2021, Got innings mileage, and has been under the tutelage of Reds coaches for a month and will be more ready than anyone on OD. Mahle and Castillo made the jumbo from AA to mLB. Ashcraft is next.

    • Redsvol

      as Doug has told us, Ashcroft will go as far as his off-speed stuff will take him. If he can’t develop his slider and change-up more then he is destined for the bullpen. Which if fine, we need bullpen arms. But obviously we now need more help in the rotation so we hope he can do well there.

      I will miss Winker. It felt as though they could have extended him. On the flip side, he doesn’t hit left handers and can’t sty healthy for a full season. Gray is definitely replaceable and the risk of him being worth nothing in 6 months was real. The Suarez from 2021 and 2020 can obviously be replaced. The Suarez from 2019 would be nice to have. I’m looking forward to see what Shrock and Lopez and maybe even Senzel can do with more time at third base. They can all exceed Suarez recent offense, match or exceed his defense and far exceed his base running ability. I’m looking forward to seeing some more speed on the base paths in 2022. Winker, Suarez, Castellanos and Barnhardt were all below average base runners. Of course, we need to have their replacements get on base to see it!

  40. Jim Delaney

    Castellini, the Williams brothers and the rest of the silent owners need to go.. Seek the team. Castellini has been selling his other business assets. Need new owners, a
    corporation or young wealthy investor group that own sports teams as an ego stroke. They will put winner on field and not be looking at the team profit margin. Reds have been making money and will make a boatload this season.. each MLB team just got more TV money for the extra playoffs and for the APPLE streaming service deal. Anyone believing Reds lost money is Naive.. if they have them show us the books. Open them.. they won’t.. the entire group simply must GO… SELL!!!!

  41. Tom Reeves

    If the Reds also lost money in 2021 and their income statement is truly a mess, then Bob needs to open the books. Frankly, if it’s a mess after going all in prior to 2020, I think a lot of us would understand them needing a season back on track. We wouldn’t like it but most of us would understand.

    But if Bob C won’t open the books, we have to consider the worst / he’s pocketing the revenue sharing money.

  42. Votto4life

    I am not so sure why I keep seeing the Reds great farm system mentioned here.

    I could be wrong, but Reds farm system has been listed as, middle of the road, in all the reports I have seen. If that is truly the case, it means half the teams in baseball have a better farm system than the Reds. And oh by the way, those teams have major league talent as well.

    • Redsvol

      The system rankings are all over the place. Baseball America – who seems to follow the prospects very close – ranked the Reds system 7th. Others ranked us in the middle. Don’t forget the system graduated 4 guys to the majors last year – quite a hit but also quite a feat. 3 of those guys – India, Stephenson, and Gutierrez got rookie of the year votes. The 4th, Santillian, pitched well out of the bullpen. And then in September, SanMartin, Friedl, and Moreta held their own. That is quite an infusion of youth in 1 year. There is also hope that Senzel will start to show something too.

      • Votto4life

        Baseball America currently have the Reds at 19th. I appreciate your comments about the players who have graduated, but the system seems weaker after that wave of players.

        I’m not saying they don’t have some talented players in their system, but I’m not sure it’s the answer to their problems either.

      • Doug Gray

        Votto4life, you are incorrect. Baseball America has the Reds farm system rated 7th and that was before they acquired Chase Petty and Brandon Williamson (who they rated as the #83 prospect in baseball).

        The discrepancy in the farm rankings you’ll see compared to where Baseball America ranks them is mostly because they consider Jose Barrero eligible as a prospect for their lists and some other places don’t. Given that some places rate him as the Reds top prospect, or would if he were eligible, it’s a big blow to not count him versus counting him.

      • Optimist

        I’d add to Doug’s comment that we should also look forward to the mid-season updates – notably, consider how Petty and Williamson will affect the rankings, and if any of the A/AA talent begins to shine – even beyond DeLaCruz, consider that Hinds/Confidan/Hendrick/Allen/McClain could and should emerge. All of that while the past two seasons have not been at the top of the draft.

        Of course it’s doubtful any of this helps this year’s offense, but it’s also not a full teardown/rebuild.

      • Votto4life

        Thanks Doug and RedsVol you are both correct. I was looking at the rankings from Keith Law who has them at 19.

        I hope the draft lottery doesn’t impact the Red’s too much. Under the old rules, the Reds would look to have a shot at the first pick overall in 2023.

  43. Old-school

    MArk Sheldon notes Moose is the every day 3b.

    This would be my lineup Opening Day against a righty assuming health and emphasizing a youth movement and transitioning to a new era and roster construction for Reds baseball.

    Senzel CF
    India 2b
    Votto 1b
    Stephenson C
    Naquin RF
    Moose 3b
    Barrero SS
    Fraley LF
    Shrock DH

    Now’s the time to play Barrero every day at SS and hit the reset button on Senzel. Put him in CF every day and use his speed at the top of the line up. Injuries and Turner Ward and Covid ruined his 2019-21. ITs 2022 and a new year and new era. The roster has been blown up. Go with Senzel . India is your emerging best hitter at 2 with Votto at 3.

  44. Jeffery

    I remember the 1983 season like it was yesterday. I can’t imagine this being worse. Plus what are the Reds rebuilding from? In 83 we were still hung over from the BRM

  45. Gregteb

    Nick Krall, Not a salary situation??? So you think we are all stupid! That is insulting. Be honest.

  46. Johnny Sofa

    This has been the problem for 10 years, through three GMS and one owner. Zero direction. The Padres, White Sox, and Rays built ripe farm systems with top prospects. The Dodgers, Cardinals, Braves, etc., maintain MLB talent through trades, free agency, and player dev. The Reds claim they can do both to keep fans interested, but they can’t and haven’t. And so we continually have a so-so farm system and a mediocre (at best) MLB team. They decimated the franchise with this approach in 2015-16 and never learned — or they think we’ve all forgotten.

  47. Michael B. Green

    CIN Rotation:

    Castillo
    Mahle
    Gutierrez
    Sanmartin
    Greene (Dunn DL)

    If Hoffman is in the rotation, CIN is tanking. Period.

    AAA Rotation:

    Lodolo
    Ashcraft
    O’Brien
    Williamson
    Lively

    Call-ups would be O’Brien or Lively as CIN will manipulate time/earnings on Lodolo, Ashcraft and Williamson.

    Hoffman and Santillan would move to rotation if CIN further tanks by trading Castillo and/or Mahle.

    • Johnny Sofa

      Tanking is what a team does on purpose. Perpetually stinking is just having no clue (or reason) to improve.