Jonathan India led off the game with a home run and fellow rookie Tyler Stephenson clubbed a 2-run pinch-hit homer in the 8th to help lead the Cincinnati Reds to a 7-4 win on Sunday that also gave them a series win over the Philadelphia Phillies.
| Final | R | H | E |
|---|---|---|---|
| Cincinnati Reds (64-55) |
7 | 10 | 0 |
| Philadelphia Phillies (61-57) |
4 | 7 | 2 |
| W: Sims (5-2) L: Nola (7-7) SV: Givens (3) |
|||
| Statcast | Box Score | Game Thread | |||
The Offense
Jonathan India started off the game with a bang, blasting a solo home run into the first row of seats in left field to put the Reds ahead. One out later, Nick Castellanos and David Bell were both ejected for arguing balls and strikes after the outfielder objected to a called third strike.
Cincinnati’s offense got going again in the 3rd when Sonny Gray and Jonathan India had back-to-back singles. After Jesse Winker flew out, and looked uncomfortable as he headed back to the dugout, Shogo Akiyama came to the plate and doubled to left to bring in both runners and make it a 3-0 game. When the bottom of the inning began, Aristides Aquino took over for Winker in left field.
The 4th inning started out well as a walk to Mike Moustakas, a single by Tyler Naquin, and Kyle Farmer being hit by a pitch loaded the bases with no outs. Things started well but didn’t end well. A fly out was followed by Sonny Gray grounding into a double play to end the inning with no runs scored.
Jonathan India led off the 5th inning with a single – his third hit of the day – but on a pickoff attempt he dove back to the bag and was examined by the trainer. They determined that his shoulder was good enough to remain in the game. Walks to Aristides Aquino and Joey Votto loaded the bases with one out and led to a pitching change to bring in Bailey Falter to face back-to-back lefties. Falter struck out Mike Moustakas, but couldn’t put Tyler Naquin away and walked in a run. Kyle Farmer ended the inning two pitches later on a shallow fly ball into center.
The 8th inning had two outs before you knew it, but then the Reds put things together. Kyle Farmer singled and advanced to second on an error by shortstop Didi Gregorius on replay review. Tucker Barnhart followed up with an RBI double to extend the lead to 5-3. The Phillies went to the bullpen with Michael Lorenzen due up, but the Reds sent Tyler Stephenson to the plate and he unloaded on a 2-0 fastball and sent it into the 5th row of the seats in left field to make it a 7-3 game.
The Pitching
Sonny Gray had held the Phillies to one hit through the first three innings of the day. But J.T. Realmuto tripled to lead off the 4th inning and scored on a Bryce Harper sacrifice fly to cut the Reds lead to 3-1. In the bottom of the 5th inning Philadelphia started threatening again. Two singles and a hit batter loaded the bases for Harper with one out. Gray walked him and the Reds lead shrunk to 4-2. Didi Gregorius followed with a sacrifice fly to make it 4-3 and that was it for Gray as the team called Lucas Sims out of the bullpen. Sims was able to stop the rally with a strikeout of Andrew McCutchen.
Lucas Sims returned for the bottom of the 6th inning and made easy work in retiring the Phillies in order to hold onto a 1-run lead and send the game to the 7th. Michael Lorenzen took over for Sims to begin the 7th inning. He walked pinch hitter Alec Bohm to begin the inning, but followed up by getting a line out and a strikeout. Lorenzen walked Bryce Harper on five pitches to put two on for Didi Gregorius, but the Phillies shortstop flew out to shallow center to end the threat and the inning.
After a 3-run top of the 8th inning to give Cincinnati a 7-3 lead, Luis Cessa came on to pitch the bottom of the frame. After needing just four pitches to record the first two outs of the inning Ronald Torreyes singled in a 6-pitch at-bat and Odúbel Herrera singled on the 4th pitch he saw to put runners on the corners with two outs. Alec Bohm followed up with an RBI double to make it 7-4. Mychal Givens emerged from the bullpen to take over and try to put out the fire. He did just that by getting Jean Segura to fly out to right field and keep Cincinnati up by three.
Still holding a 7-4 lead, Mychal Givens returned to the mound for the 9th to face the heart of the Phillies order. The poor strikezone continued to play in the inning as a called 3rd strike that was easily out of the zone sent J.T. Realmuto back to the dugout. Bryce Harper walked on four pitches to follow. But Didi Gregorius struck out swinging and then Andrew McCutchen grounded out to second base to end the game and give the Reds a win for the day and for the series.
Up Next for the Cincinnati Reds
Chicago Cubs vs Cincinnati Reds
Monday August 16, 7:10pm ET
Justin Steele (2-1, 2.95 ERA) vs Wade Miley (9-4, 3.00 ERA)
Good win by the Reds, I don’t know why the National League doesn’t have the DL Rule, like the AL does. That way it saves the pitcher having to bat, and especially cuts down the risk of the pitcher injuring himself by running the bases or batting.
2022 season. It’s pretty much a lock to happen.
Good point, hey, you know what? We should just have a full offensive team that bats and runs the bases, that way no defensive players would ever get hurt. And maybe designated runners that always run for batters, so they don’t get hurt running the bases? And maybe the pitcher could have a designated fielder so he never has to move off the mound. Gotta protect that investment!
sarcasm….I love it.
After all, these are professional players aren’t they????
*100^2
I hear ya. But, darn if I’m not ready for the robot zone. No disrespect to the umpires, thankless job, but it would be nice to have a uniform zone. Seems it would negate a lot of trouble since it’s so subjective as is. Just my opinion.
Could we have a rover and maybe runner on 2nd in extra innings so games don’t go to long
Sims with a good comeback on the mound and the rookies get it done on offense.
Great win. I’m glad it worked out, but what this game illustrates perfectly is why it’s silly to keep Senzel in the minors while holding onto pitchers you really don’t ever want to use in close games unless you absolutely have to. For the sake of having a relatively useless lefty in the pen who rarely makes any significant contributions to any wins, they’ll leave a guy in the minors who can play good defense in the infield and outfield, hit well (and hit against lefties), and run fast. They could utilize Senzel’s abilities literally every single game, but instead they’re holding onto Doolittle for that one time every 5 or 6 games when he can come in and (maybe) get a lefty out.
At the risk of offending those who can’t stand negativity on a sports blog, especially after wins, let me repeat: This was a great win and I think the managing was just fine today.
Agree 100%.
Now make that “Senzel and Barrero” and you are right on the money.
I totally agree because getting steady work for 9 guys in the pen is almost impossible. Then you run a guy out there that hasn’t pitched in 5-6 days and he’s most likely going to be a little rusty. They play a ton of close games and they need extra help on the bench!
Conversely, the Reds’ bullpen is shaky enough, even now, that they could find themselves needing more bullpen guys in a game because nobody is getting the job done. Sort of like throwing dirty socks at the wall to see which one sticks. I’m glad that Bell brings his best guys in at high-leverage points instead of waiting for the ninth, but it can leave them vulnerable to comebacks by the other team. They do need more position players on the bench, and improving the bullpen personnel would make that easier to do.
Agreed, it’s just silly to waste three BP spots with pitchers will be hardly used while the bench is limited to four players everyday. Last night they ended up with only one player available in the bench, it just doesn’t make sense!
And make Doolittle “Garrett, Hembree and Doolittle.”
Not one of them should ever be used in a game that matters. And I believe the next 43 will matter – each and every one.
are we talking about the same Garrett who’s thrown a 2.35 ERA in the last 2 months? The one with a 15.3 K/9 over that same span? He had a rough start to the year, and he’s been a bit walk-prone lately, but I don’t think you want to throw Garrett onto the list of guys that “shouldn’t ever be used in a game that matters”
unfortunately, ir appears the padres are also going to win-barring some late inning heroics by the diamondbacks. It doesn’t look like we can pass the dodgers or the brewers. I guess it’s possible to catch the brewers, but that looks like a big hill to climb.
First, I really enjoy everyone’s posts. Now that it’s getting close to crunch time, I think some bold moves(for the Reds) need to be made. I think we need 3 moves now. Farmer to 3rd, Barrero to short and sit our million dollar mistakes. Senzel to center and keep Akiyama and Naquin. Have to move 2 players. When Antone comes back 3. Pick between Hembrie, AG, Doolittle, and Aquino. If he’s ready Blandino and move all 4. It’s like the FO refuses to admit their mistakes. Bench is Suarez, Moose, Akiyama, Naquin, Blandino and either Stephenson or Barnhart. Not bad. I’ll take my flogging now? Thx
Starting with 3 Tuesday in St Louis, the Cards and Brewers do face off 13 more times …
Cardinals have been playing a little better lately too. So here is hoping the sweep the Brewers.
When the Reds are playing in Philly without their two all-stars and the Padres are playing the Diamondbacks, remaining 2.5 back is a victory.
The late add-on gave us the cushion we needed. Hats off to TySteve for coming off the bench and continuing to do the kind of damage he does. Makes for another interesting decision this off season.
Home to beat up on the Stupid Cubs!!
Maybe. I think we pick up Tucker’s option and continue the process. I suspect when Barnhart declines, we’ll know and (hopefully) gave him on shorter term deals.
I really want them to keep Barnhardt for a year or two more. Guy is a quality player and gives ya a decent at bat every time up. Plus his defense has been so good the past few years.
Agree. Maybe a 50/50 split on catching duties and Stephenson gets a lot of other time between 1B and DH depending on where Votto plays that day. Please don’t anyone suggest Suarez or Moose for DH/1B. I think Barnhart would welcome more rest. It has to be tough on the knees and body as long and often as he has caught.
So let’s see here. Bell is ejected in the first inning. Winker leaves for an injury. Two relief pitchers go more than an inning. Stephenson pinch hits before Suarez. None of Doolittle, Hembree, Brach, or Garrett pitch (although a couple did yesterday). The Reds win. Looks like Benavides has a better feel touch for the game than his boss.
Good grief. 95% of your posts are extremely negative. Look at the season and where the Reds are right now. It’s been so much fun to watch the Reds this year for a change. Enjoy the ride and lighten up a bit.
And yes, I’m admittedly pro-Bell and think he’s actually been an asset this year, though I also have criticisms as well.
There should be an “analytic” metric for Manager Wins above Replacement. But yes, you and I tend to see things differently. I skipped the most of the misery of the Castellini era. I worked too much to pay attention. Now that I am retired, I’ve paid a bit of attention these last couple of years. So for you and those who have endured Castellini over the last 15 years, this is a big improvement. For those of us that remember when the Reds were really good, it less encouraging.
Lol. Rue the day when a fan is negative…..
@wku
If you don’t want to let the argument that “Bell isn’t responsible for losses because the players have to execute” stand up, then don’t make an argument that their successes this year are because of him either.
What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander
Rojo, I’m in no way making either argument.
Bell’s not perfect, but I’ll take the good with the bad and think he’s done a net positive job.
It’s not just that they’re negative. They’re repetitive, essentially the same post every day.
Well, Brach is on the DL, so it was unlikely he was going to pitch. 🙂
I think Doolittle has reached the end of the line. But, he does have kind of a big contract, and I don’t know if Castellini will let the Reds eat that. Ditto for Garrett.
I think Hembree is young and could still become a good reliever, but STOP relying on him this year. I think he has lost a lot of confidence.
Cut down on the bullpen numbers, activate Senzel, and hope to get Antone back healthy ….soon. And maybe bring up Santillan as a reliever…again.
And yes, all the last 43 games count for a lot to get into the playoffs. None of them are throw away games now. This was a costly road trip, going 3 wins, 4 losses. The Reds could have won all three in Atlanta (not saying they should) but all the games were winnable.
Hembree is 32 so not young. However Garrett and Doolittle are less reliable and have worse ERA’s. There are likely four or five options in the minors who may represent a significant improvement. Moreta (who has a zero ERA ) , Lodolo,Greene, and SanMartin plus TJ.
Those are easily three roster moves that should be made right away: DFA Hembree, Doolittle and Garrett, bring up Senzel, Santillan and Antone (when healthy).
you guys are nuts for thinking there are 4 or 5 guys in the minors who represent significant improvements over Garrett. Stop fixating on the season ERA.
Remove his horrendous April, and his season ERA drops nearly 2 entire points. Focus on a more reasonable window, like the last two months, and he’s been a 2.35 ERA pitcher with a 15.3 K/9. He may still be throwing a scary number of BBs, but that doesn’t drop him to the bottom of the bullpen pecking order. The argument could easily be made that he’s been our best arm in the bullpen over the last 2 months.
The bench coach, Freddy Benevidas is an experienced baseball guy.
I totally forgot Bell got tossed so I think it’s a valid discussion on how he might’ve played it.
Like would he have left Cessa in?
I say yes he would have.
I like benavidas
I really like Benavides as a potential future manager of this team. The guy has always played smart when he had control of the ship and I believe I remember players giving him a lot of props too when he was a minor league manager.
Do you really believe that Bell had no input because he was ejected? They didn’t send him to jail, or even make him leave the stadium. It’s very easy to find fault with the specific decisions of any manager, particularly with the benefit of hindsight (and without the handicap of making those decisions when the game is actually on the line). The big picture, though, is worth considering: The Reds are playing substantially better than anyone expected. The team has spirit and leads the world in comeback wins. You will likely say that this is in spite of Bell, and I will say that you are free to your opinion, but it really is just an opinion based upon no inside knowledge of the subject.
IMO, for the Reds to have any shot at the NLC, they will need to go 6-1 vs the Cubs and Marlins this week, and then sweep the Brewers next week. I know it’s unlikely, but 8 games back in mid August is a pretty big hole. Otherwise, I’m all in on the wildcard.
Check your baseball history! A lot of teams have overcome an 8+ game deficit with 6 weeks to go in a 162 game season! The Brewers built their lead on the backs of the Pirates a team the Reds play 9 more times. Plus the Reds have 3 games with Detroit and 7 against the Marlins. The Brewers face a hot Cards team this week! It’s hard for me to root for the Dirty Birds but I’m hoping they ferment the Brewers!
Rooting for the Dirty Birds … I think I just threw up a little in the back of my mouth.
But if that’s what it takes to win the NLC and not just try for Game 163, I’m in.
The Phillies collapse in ‘64 is a case in point. Too bad Jim Maloney (my all time favorite Reds’ pitcher) didn’t have it that last day.
I remember well the Phillies Collapse of 1964, and the Reds 1st place tie going into the last game of the season. Sisler chose Tstouris over Maloney–and the rest is history.
No.
Root for 12 inning games that gas both pitching staffs
Cubs have separate 11 game and 10 game losing streaks. What a joke
Memories can get fuzzy, but I remember that Dick Sisler took a lot of flack for saving Maloney for the 1st game of the WS–that never came
Do not count Detroit as a team that’s easy to beat they have been very hot for the past month and a half. I’m pretty sure I saw them in 2nd place the other day in the standings in the AL Cnetral. I know they are way back behind my AL team I’m rooting for this season but They have been playing some really good baseball for a decent chunk of time now.
Eight games back in August is not that insurmountable. In fact, pressure is squarely on the Brewers going forward with tougher schedule. They can be caught.
69 Mets were about 10 back in middle of August to win division. 95 Mariners made a comeback as well. Let’s not forget the Yankees were 14 back in late July in 78. Bucky freakin Dent.
And the 1914 Boston Braves were in last place on the 4th. of July and went on to beat the NY Giants by 10 and a half games and then took the WS over the Philadelphia A’s.
I hope you all are right and I am wrong.
From everything I saw that ball was off the plate to Castellanos. That was also a super quick trigger by the ump. You hate to lose one of your stars that early to an ump’s ego. Can’t wait for automated strike zones to get here.
Like that both Sims and Givens were used the next inning after finishing off innings. That hasn’t always been the case this season, but both were up to the task today.
Big win. Keep trying to string em’ together.
Agree. It is hard to argue with a computer or whatever they use for the automated strike zone. I watch most every game and the umps miss a lot of balls and strikes.
The ball was off the plate but was also pretty close at least according to the box on TV. Understand that is a 2 dimensional box and the strike zone is three dimensional. The overhead view had the pitch pretty close. The strike zone called is the strike zone, what I don’t like is the quick trigger. Don’t know what Castelanos said but sometimes the umpire has just got to take it and move on.
Agree it wasn’t a horrendous call as it was close, but I also think it was a call that Nick had a right to question (as it was off the plate). The big thing is the quick trigger. Unless we believe that Castellanos crossed a line (racist/bigoted remark or a comment about the umpire’s personal life or family) there’s nothing he could have said that should have warranted that quick of a trigger. And I simply don’t believe Castellanos said anything that egregious. Anything else should have been taken in stride and the ump should have let Castellanos air out his grievance for a bit, and then play on. When an ump feels like he can’t be questioned, his ego gets in the way of the game and can change the outcome, and that’s not the role the umpire should have.
I agree with that.
Good win for Reds.
Rookies and bullpen came through big.
Hope Winker is not seriously hurt, I worry as this is the time of a full season he has broken down in 2018 and 19. He is almost at career high for games played and almost 100 PAs above career high.
More on the injury if you haven’t seen or heard yet:
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/08/injury-notes-winker-lindor-phillies-brewers.html
Could be an IL trip forthcoming….We’ll see.
Need all hands on deck.
Seeing how Position player starters starting to break Down.
Winker missing action Now with back.
India Farmer both quite beat up.
Need Nick to go on a Hott Streak now.
So glad got series vs Philly.
Now need to not play down to, who they play this week.
Padres 67-53
Reds 64-55
Braves 62-56
Cardinals 61-56
Phillies 61-57
Mets 59-57
Cardinals have snuck up here beating up on the bad teams, time now for the Reds to take care of business. Mets are fading fast …….Dodgers, Giants, Dodgers Giants series should finish them off.
I hope Greene gets a few starts and then finishes the season in the bullpen.
As much as I want to see Greene come join the pen this year, because I think he could seriously help, it would be a darn shame if he didn’t make his major league debut as a starter. Maybe a spot start into a reliever role? The spot start should definitely come before Sept if it’s going to happen.
Looks to me like Reds fans should hope the Brewers and Cards split those 13 almost down the middle with just a slight advantage of 7 or 8 wins by the Cards in them. With the Red having 9 with Pirates and 3 with the Tigers, they should be able to make ground against both over those respective blocks with such a split between the Cards and Brewers. The Reds also have 7 with Marlins and 6 with the Cubs; so, lots of opportunities for them to hold or gain position on the Cards while also gaining on the Brewers.
Hunter Greene’s most recent scheduled start last Wednesday was scratched because he was experiencing some discomfort in the AC joint area of his pitching shoulder.
The good news is he is expected back on schedule this week. However, I doubt they would consider him taking that start at the MLB level.
Nick Lodolo was also scratched this week with “shoulder fatigue”. So, I wouldn’t expect to see him at MLB any time soon.
Need to call up Senzel and Barrero. I think my ideal world would look like the following.
Tomorrow:
Senzel up. DFA Doolittle.
Barrero up. DFA Aquino. (Sorry Aquino, gotta be done)
Friday Aug 20:
Hold back Greene for a spot start to make his Major League debut as a Starter against the Marlins at home on a Friday. Would be a sold out stadium.
DFA Hembree
Saturday Aug 21:
Send Greene back to AAA
Recall Antone (should be back around this time)
September 1st:
Recall Greene
Recall either Schrock or Lopez
If they release Aquino and Senzel were to get hurt again, you have Inciarte for a back up. You also have Schrock and Lopez who could be backup outfielders on top of that.
Idk, just my opinion on what I’d like to see.
I forgot Inciarte also bats right, so DFAing Akiyama probably makes more sense than Aquino, but Akiyama is due more money, so Aquino would be likely.
Bats LEFT. FFFF.
Aquino has a better career OPS and OPS+ than either Senzel or Inciarte. He also has the best OF arm of the 3 and has shown he can cover ground and make plays when gets to balls.
The move that needs to be made instead of Aquino is to get Moose back onto the IL. He is in nowhere approaching game condition. It is showing at the plate and in the field both.
Senzel has the most speed on the team, by a good margin I’d imagine and that’s something the team desperately needs. Aquino wouldn’t be the one I’d like see go, but I don’t think they’re going to cut Akiyama, I think Aquino would be more likely. If you take out that first month Aqunio came up, I’d assume both of the OPS would be relatively the same. You also get a more consistent AB with Senzel and he’s better vs. leftys.
This season versus LH pitcher’s:
Aquino OPB: .362 SLG: 543 OPS: .905 OPS+:145
Senzel OPB: .350 SLG: .389 OPS: .739 OPS+:104
Not even close. Career vs LH is a little closer but still clearly to Aquino: OPS:860; Senzel OPS:.773
Eh. Because Senzel has barely played this year, I’d take the Slugging and OBP stats as a grain of salt. I’d still take a Senzel AB vs. lefty vs. a Aquino one. This is one of the times I think BA actually makes up more than OPS.
It really just comes down to the type of player the Reds need right now. A more consistent hitter in Senzel or a more of a homer threat in Aquino. I think the Reds have plenty of homer threats. They need someone to hit behind Votto to drive India/Winker/Castellanos/Votto in when they’re on base and I think Senzel would do that better than Aquino. I also think he gets the job more often with what the Reds struggle to do the most. SCORE WITH THE BASES LOADED OR SECOND AND THIRD WITH LESS THAN 2 OUT. It mainly occurs at the end of the lineup with Suarez/Aquino/Naquin/Tucker. Senzel gets the ball in play more times than not and has the fastest footspeed to not hit into as many DP’s.
Plus 100
@JW. I was agreeing with you they need to keep Aquino, not DFA him.
Agree Jim, you keep Aquino around. If they’re going to cut an OF it should be Akiyama. Ideally, they’d just drop down to 8 relievers and add Senzel, but that may make too much sense.
You DFA Aquino and he’s gone. Gone for what? History says about 10 days of Senzel before he’s back on the IL. He loves the IL like a fat kid loves McDonalds.
Its not an exact science though. I’ve been pounding Shogo for most of the season, but he’s been doing well lately. 9 for last 29 (.310/.444 obp) with 3 doubles. He’s getting $8 mil so he’s safe and he’s been outplaying AA anyway.
I hope they don’t IL Wink, but that might be the easy solution. I do like Greene on Friday. Why not? He could try 3-4 innings and it would make for a fun night!
Maybe see if the Yankees have any interest in Aquino as the PTBNL. Winker to the IL would suck but would solve some of the problems. (sorta but not really)
Aquino > Senzel
If you’re going to call up Barrero and Senzel now, DFA Hembree, and IL Farmer. Farmer needs to heal, and he can come up Sept 1st.
Greene and Lodolo need to stay in AAA to get their arms built up for 22.
Here’s something to chew on. Want an LH hitter to play at 3B? IL Moose and give the job to Mx Schrock or Alejo Lopez (added advantage is Lopez a switch hitter).
Really starting to fear what I thought when they signed Moose. Guy had a nice career but the Reds signed him a little too late in that career. He really has not done a whole lot for the Reds other than being injured a lot. I will agree he has had some good games but the contract feels like a bust to me.
Really hoping I’m wrong and he turns it around for the last month + of the season.
I respect him going through the pain and effort of the rehab and for being on the field trying but he simply isn’t in game condition. He started with a bang vs Pirates when he first got back then sat out 2 days and has done almost literally nothing since on this road trip.
A couple of moves by Benavides that went under the radar last night: replacing Gray with two outs in the 5th with Sims, so he’d come as a hitter the next inning without using a PH, and the call review on Farmer’s single in the 8th that allowed him to reach 2nd base. Good BP calls too.
With his last night’s performance, India just took a big step towards ROY award. He’s about doing everything better everyday.
I was looking some schedules and took a view of the Cards’ one and they have a really really easy agenda in the remain of August, in fact , have won 5 games in a row until yesterday so they are very dangerous team moving forward when face the Reds by last days of this month. Furthermore, Cards will have 10 games against Brewers that could be very huge for them (if win the most) to take advantadge for movin up but helping the Reds at the same time and Cards have 7 games vs Pirates too but should face Dodgers (4 times) and Padres (3 times) in a homestand… Inside all of this , Reds are gonna have 6 very important games against the Cards to resolve this hard divisional fighting
If we truly are a contender we must make up significant ground on the Padres this week. We have 3 with the Cubs who have lost 11 straight and 4 against the Marlins who are also below .500. Hope neither team has all lefty SP though and hope Winker isn’t going to the IL (although IL is better than sitting on the bench and not being available – rather have the option to bring Senzel back up in that case).
Cardinals don’t really match up with the Reds or Brewers very well. They get out pitched badly by the Brewers and outhit by the Reds. Then they still have a 4 game Dodgers series and 3 game Padres series. Have to go to New York still to play a Mets team that should be in win or die mode as well. With all schedules considered, I definitely think it favors the Reds and it’s up to them to lose it.
I am speculating, but Senzel still had a week or so of rehab time left, and the Reds did not need to option him until then. The move was unnecessary, regardless of what Senzel’s physical condition is or what Nick Krall said to the media. Further, the move prevents the Reds from recalling him (outside a DL issue, which may well happen) for 10 more days.
That leads me to believe that there may be something else going on between Senzel and the Reds. I am sure that Senzel is fully frustrated by being injured and unable to help the big team, but it sure seems like the Reds are not happy with his conduct in some regard. Again, it is speculation, but it is otherwise very difficult to understand this move, except that the Reds seem to think that Senzel needed a kick in the rear.
If management thought that Senzel needed more ABs, or was still not as explosive as they wanted, then they could have just kept him on rehab for another week, not make the statement that Krall made, and then decide what to do next week. But instead, they pretty much stuck their finger in Senzel’s eye.
It isn’t money. Senzel’s salary isn’t much more than whatever reliever that they decided to jettison. The numbers would all pretty much be the same, regardless of what they did.
Interesting? I know one thing. A 14 man staff might work for an AL team with horrible starting pitching like the Orioles, but not for the Reds. Garrett has 2.1 total innings in August? Wilson has 1 inning in their last 6 games. How are you supposed to stay sharp with 1 inning a week?
Maybe they’re planning to call up Barrero instead of Senzel, but either way they should be able to decipher that a 14 man staff is not helping. We play a ton of close games and Bell needs more options off the bench and not the bullpen.
And who was the GM that maneuvered them into the situation where they have an immobile bullpen comprised of all guys who cannot be optioned thus requiring the extra pitcher over this 20 game in 20 days stretch? Asking for Nick Krall.
Ed> About the money… Senzel is a pre-arbitration guy. Most pre-arb guys on year-to-year contracts have a standard “2-way contract” which pays them the full face amount when they are at the MLB level (or MLB IL) but pays them a very reduced amount when they are on option (or minor league IL).
Looking around I don’t see any indications at sites like Cot’s Contracts that Senzel is on anything other than a standard deal. Cot’s lists him as on a 1 year deal worth ~$580. If this is correct, being activated and optioned cut his pay rate by probably 75% until such time as he is back on the MLB roster.
Senzel was in the original Louisville lineup for Sunday but then was scratched and did not play in the game. Most reaction was a presumption he was pulled as a precaution because of the turn in Winker’s situation. Let’s see what happens today and if we hear anything from Senzel’s agent Mr. Boras.
Duh…..Senzel’s deal is worth $580K. Not $580.
Right on Senzel’s contract, but let’s assume that the choice was between Doolittle or Senzel. They kept Senzel, but still have to pay Doolittle. If they instead had DFA’d Doolittle, somebody would likely have been picked him up (because almost every team needs relievers), and that team would have paid the minimum salary to Doolittle, with the Reds stuck with the rest of Doolittle’s salary.
The amount saved by DFAing Doolittle would be roughly the same as that saved by optioning Senzel. And relative chump-change, either way.
I don’t know what Boras can do or say. What seems to get lost in the shuffle with Senzel is that he just hasn’t performed. He has a career OPS of .704 and an OPS+ of 77; his career bWAR is -0.7. (Drew Stubbs also had a career OPS of .704, by comparison.) Mancuso will tell you Senzel’s “expected” stats show that he was hitting the ball well this year but was unlucky; on balance, though, Senzel has underwhelmed.
Senzel is also considered “fast” because his top sprint speeds register highly on Statcast. But he doesn’t really use that speed much, because he is 2-for-7 in stealing bases. I think Senzel is fast but not quick; he can run fast but needs an extra couple of steps to get up to speed. He is therefore fast but doesn’t really play fast, kind of the opposite of Jerry Rice on the 49ers.
I therefore get a hint that the Reds feel that Senzel may have a sense of entitlement, although I certainly could be wrong. I also feel that the much-esteemed Pat Kelly at Louisville is one of the drivers on this decision.
@ED> If you have access to The Athletic get over there and read C.Trent’s latest. He was on site in Louisville yesterday.
Trent seems to imply that Senzel pulled himself out of the game Sunday because per the CBA, he has 72 hours to “report” after being optioned.
Also, a quote from manager Pat Kelly that in his opinion from watching Senzel play, he is not 100% and has a “slight favor” of his left knee. Which of course as you said begs the question of why make the move when they did instead of waiting until the final 4 or 5 days of the rehab period had been used.
https://theathletic.com/2772174/2021/08/16/c-notes-nick-senzel-is-ready-to-play-but-he-isnt-coming-to-the-majors-to-help/
When I saw they weren’t bringing up Senzel my jaw dropped. Bell is basically playing with a 22 man roster. Senzrel, Barrero and Santillan should be brought up now and cut bait with Hembree. AG and Doolittle. When Antone is ready, so long Aquino. And if they really want to win, Barrero at short and Farmer at 3rd. That leaves a bench of Moose, Suarez, Akiyama and Naquin. I guess I can dream.
I agree 100% with this.
I suggest that another name that can/should be called up is Dauri Moreta, a reliever who started at Chattanooga and moved up to Louisville. He has an ERA and. WHIP below 1.00. Perhaps not as obvious a call-up as Barrero, but I suspect we can all agree that the bullpen is a position of need for this club.
Imagine a bullpen with 5 or 6 guys who can actually get hitters out?
Big win/series! Bullpen good today. Refreshing! India should be ROY. Stephenson should be in serious consideration, as well. He has what it takes to carry this team in September. His power just scratching the surface. Go Reds!
Wasn’t the game indeed quite a turnaround for India.
I also agree about Stephenson. To give the Reds the best chance to make the playoffs in 2021, it is time for him to be the primary catcher.
In 2006-07, Scott Hatteberg posted 2 outstanding seasons at 1B for the Reds (OPS/OPS+ of .844/114) but come 2008 it was Votto time. This is where the Reds are with the catching situation. Make the best move for the team now.
While I love the development of Stephenson sitting Barnhart right now is not and should not happen.the production we are getting from our catching tandem has been very good. Falls under the saying if it ain’t broke don’t fix it
“ Make the best move for the team now.”
How often has this franchise made the BEST move in timely manner in the last 8 years?
We can hope!
@jim t> Since the AllStar break Stephenson’s OPS is .896. Barnhart’s is .638. Most alarming to me is that Barnhart’s OBP for the same period has fallen off to .273 (versus .356 for TS). Stephenson’s performance is essentially neutral between LH and RH pitching.
The Reds need more of Stephenson’s bat in the lineup. 1B is spoken for. There is no DH. That leaves catcher as the spot to use him.
Jim walker I love the way Tyler is stepping up but Barnhart is a much better defender and has really deliver some timely hits. Having the confidence in your catcher to break off a curve ball with a man on third in a tight game is crucial. Don’t know if Tyler is there yet. I think next year would be a good time to start playing Tyler S a bit more but right now the catching position is not a problem.
Is there a reason why every comment I make is under review. I have been posting for quite awhile and never had a issue.
Are you using a different email address or name? That will do it until your 1st comment with an address is cleared. Happed to me just last week when either my screen jumped or I flat out clicked on the wrong address from a drop-down list.
Yes, he was. Different user name multiple times (jimt instead of Jim t) and spelled his email address wrong in another one.
Doug are you sure? Been posting here and at your site for a few years and never had this issue.
Yes I’m 100% positive. You used jimt instead of Jim t, and once you also spelled your email address incorrectly (you had .cim instead of .com) and thus it flagged you as a new user who needed a comment approved before any of the subsequent ones with that username or email address would go forward without being moderated.
At Doug and Jim T, it could be the space versus using the -> key. It looks one way until you press submit and then it appears to do funny things unless you actually used the space bar versus the tab key. To the user it looks right when he presses submit but when the software validates it it looks another way. I will test that and see if it is true.
Thanks Doug
That wasn’t the case . Jim, the software drops down multiple userid names from memory when you key the first letter. If you inadvertently key a bad one the delete key won’t let you delete it. It is possible you keyed JimT accidently and it is pulling that from the drop down list when you key the letter J. You can test that by keying only J and see what options pop up.
IMO, this is not the first time the reds have mishandled Senzel. Drafted as the best hitter in the draft class, and at 3B. In the minors 3B, 2B, CF, which position? Hurt a decent amount in the minors as well. Not sure I would have played a guy with an injury history as a professional in CF. Now he obviously is better than some current roster players, but seems to be the odd man out for has been relievers. Boras may be thinking him the heck out of Cincinnati, go someplace where FO and management know what they are doing.
Trying to place him in a position of need which gets him on the field is not mishandling him. He has had a unfortunate run of injuries that have left his career in limbo. He has been injured playing CF, 3rd and 2nd in his career.
They missed the boat when he came up by choosing to build around Suárez at 3B instead of Senzel. Suárez in trade would have gotten them a good CF
It seems to bae a position in need of quality. If they thought he is/was the answer then, he should be on the roster and given the opportunity again. None of the three options currently being utilized, Naquin, Akiyama, or Aquino, is for sure not the long term answer.
Rojo would you have made that assertion after Geno hit 49 bombs for you in 2019?
“ IMO, this is not the first time the reds have mishandled Senzel.”
An opinion we share with Mr. Richard Fitch as well
I get wanting to blame the Reds for Senzel’s lack of production / health. Some people are just injury prone. Winker had a lot of injury issues, but he’s still improved year over year. Call it bad luck, bad management, injury prone, but Senzel just hasn’t done what he needs to do to be an everyday starter on this team. I hope for a better year next year.
Mark of mlb chat when asked who would win nl roy said Tatis. I didn’t think Tatis was eligible. I love India and Stevenson, but if Tatis is eligible, he certainly wins roy. Thoughts?
Not sure how Tatis would be eligible this year. Tatis entered the season with more than 600 at bats. If you exclude last season, he still had almost 400 at bats. Tatis finished third in ROY in 2019.
To be eligible for the Rookie of the Year award a player can have no more than 130 at bats. Fernando Tatis Jr is not eligible. Perhaps he was talking about the MVP award?
Definitely had to be talking MVP.
yes, I went back and read it again. It was Poy and not roy. sorry about that. thanks for the correction.
Sad to see Winker hit the IL. BUT BARRERO UP IS SOMETHING.
I think I am correct in that the Reds are waiting until Sept. 1 to bring anyone up because it allows them to keep everyone they have plus the call ups on the roster until the end of the season. If they make the playoffs then they can cut (for the playoffs) whomever they wish(i. e. existing roster players or call ups). Attached is a link explaining it.
https://www.mlb.com/news/september-callups-and-roster-rules-explained-c198674756
I mean they just called up Barrero, so that kinda throws that out the window.
Must be some sort of deep Doo Doo going on around the Senzel situation. Does this make Farmer the LF until Winker is back?
I mean there’s still Naquin, Aqunio and Akiyama. It’s not like we exactly needed a outfielder indefinitely. Farmer could also play some outfield if needed.
I agree. The whole thing is weird. Seems–at least to me–to be some animosity swirling underneath the surface of things. Probably from both parties at this point. Just speculation, obviously, but this might signal that the Reds have “moved on” from Senzel and may be looking to part ways with him after the season. I would hate for that to happen because I think he’s been a victim of some really bad luck injury-wise, and maltreatment by the constant maneuverings of a clueless front office. But it would not surprise me at this point. If I were him, I would want out. I am not him, though, and would love to see him with the big club in the starting lineup everyday to finally see what he has. We’ll see..
It wouldn’t shock me if there are some hurt feelings on Senzel’s part with the demotion. Plus, Boras is his agent and I’m guessing they are talking about his options. Someone posted that since he was optioned, he has 72 hours to “report” even though he’s physically already with Louisville. Senzel and Boras may have decided to do this “72 hour wait” to send the message to the Reds that they are unhappy, possibly with the idea of trying to get the Reds to trade him this offseason.
So we replace an outfielder with a shortstop when we have a outfielder ready to call up. I’m thrilled Barrero is being called up. Really bring Barrero and Senzel both up and cut 4 of our worthless relievers. Not only are they bad , but will never be used. Barrero SS , Farmer 3b and Senzel CF. It’s insane!
I’m glad Barrero is up – and, for goodness sakes, I hope they play him – but having him replace Winker on the roster seems to simultaneously create a logjam in the infield and a hole in the outfield.
The options of having Lorenzen and Farmer being able to hold down an outfield spot in an emergency must be playing into this move.
The article on Senzel sounds like he’s not 100% yet, and he’s not tearing up AAA. I don’t follow the activation decision, but if Senzel reacted to it by pouting and refusing to play Sunday, that would be troubling. If it was a “take the day to shake this off and come back Tuesday ready to go”, then ok.
I have always believed that giving Senzel every chance to develop should be a priority for the Reds. Him realizing his potential would really matter. He does have to earn it, though, particularly when they are in the hunt for a playoff berth.