Winter Meetings start tomorrow in Nashville. Lots of leaks about Chapman-to-Dodgers tonight. Not finished. May be a negotiating ploy to drive up haul from Houston Astros and other suitors. Sounds like it could break tonight.

Ken Rosenthal (FOX) one hour ago:

Ken Rosenthal 15 minutes ago:

Buster Olney (ESPN):

Bob Nightengale (USA Today):

Jon Heyman (CBS):

65 Responses

  1. rhayex

    I’ve been going on other sites seeing what we might get back for him, and it’s amazing how delusional fans (of all kinds) are. On one hand, you have Reds fans who want no less than Seager and Urias back, but on the other hand, you have Dodgers fans not willing to give up any of their top 10 prospects for him, and expecting it’ll still happen. Really interesting on both sides.

    • Steve Mancuso

      If the Reds get Seager or Urias back on this deal, it would be breathtaking and cause for an enormous celebration.

      • rhayex

        I 100% agree, but its exceedingly unlikely given that they reportedly weren’t willing to give either up in their pursuit of a controllable ace.

      • Steve Mancuso

        Yeah, there’s zero chance of either. Dodgers have plenty of other highly ranked prospects.

      • rhayex

        The interesting rumor I’ve seen thrown around is that they’re going after Chapman AND Frazier. It’d be intriguing to see what would come back from a trade involving both.

      • Michael E

        I agree. I wouldn’t trade Seager or Urias for him, but if we got one of them, I’d be thrilled. I would even kick in a top 8 ish pitching prospect with Chapman to get Seager.

        I’d be happy with Pederson too. While he faded badly, his talent is pretty good.

        I keep hearing Puig, with Dodger fans saying Puig is worth 3 Chapmans and a top prospect, but I am leery of such a player that has all the talent, but injury-prone and never quite fitting in with teammates. Puig would be a huge risk, but lots of upside as well…and he’d play every day IF healthy.

        The Dodgers have a few other prospects that I like alot too, but it would take two or three of them I should think if none of those mentioned earlier are involved.

        Maybe the Stros’ will make a very strong offer. I like Preston Tucker and several of their top prospects too.

        I just hope we don’t end up with a Van Slyke at 30 years old and so A ball player years away just so the Reds can say “we got an MLB ready player in Van Slyke”. I’d rather high super high upside low A ball players than an MLB ready player that is nothing special.

  2. doctor

    the first domino of potentially many reds dominoes to fall in winter meetings. I just hope it does not drag out all week.

    • Dan

      Agree. So far since 2014 we have only seen changes to our pitching staff… which was our strength. I’m eager to see changes to our offense. At this point I don’t care who or even how many just so much as we change the face of our daily 8. They haven’t been able to get it done in the first half of the decade they shouldn’t be given a chance in the second half.

    • Michael E

      I just hope “man reds dominoes” comes true. I would like to see deals shedding payroll, adding to an impressive list of prospects and hopefully, a very promising bat or two that isn’t 5 years away.

  3. Dan

    If Chapman is traded to any team other than the Dodgers then it is time for Rosenthal to be permanently removed from the credible sources arena.

    • Ryan Lykins (@ryan_lykins)

      Where did he say it was a done deal?

      • Dan

        He said “They are making progress’ which would imply to me that a deal is on the way. But since it is Rosenthal I always assume half truths.

      • Bryan E

        It’s all rumor and Rosenthal is generally pretty good. I don’t understand the hate. He’s no Nightengale but he generally has a good read on the trade rumblings.

  4. rhayex

    Heyman is now reporting that the Reds have made everyone available. Should be a fun winter meetings.

    • Michael E

      We only really need to sign Skip Schumaker and we should be legit contenders.

  5. wdwrolen2713

    According to Heyman, the Astros and Reds had trouble making a deal work. It sounds like the Dodgers are the most likely suitor now – what kind of prospects do they have besides the obvious Seager and Urias?

    • Dan

      Could be as Steve mentioned that this is ploy to perhaps get the Astros to work. That wouldn’t surprise me either. Baiting Rosenthal with a leak of making progress would probably do it, especially if the Astros were thinking that the Dodgers were not involved.

      • Michael E

        I hope so, they didn’t appear to work leverage right a month ago when they said they wanted Chapman traded quickly.

        If they’re smart, they’ll find a way to get a couple of teams coming back with a slightly better offer and then take the best of them.

        I just hopes it quality over quantity. The four fringe top 10 org prospects are not as good as one top 3 and one top 15.

      • Dan

        Yup, I agree. The one thing the Dodgers could do that the Astros probably couldn’t is to resign Chapman for more than one year. That is often forgotten in the trade discussions that claim they won’t get as much as a Kimbrel deal. if the Dodgers sign Chapman before arbitration and then give him say a 3 or 4 year contract everyone wins.

      • Earmbrister

        Dan —

        An hour earlier you were saying:

        If Chapman is traded to any team other than the Dodgers then it is time for Rosenthal to be permanently removed from the credible sources arena.

        Now you’re saying it wouldn’t surprise you if the Reds baited him with a rumor.

        I guess he should clairvoyant.

      • Dan

        I don’t trust Rosenthal’s tweets. Relax.

      • earmbrister

        The point is, Rosenthal is in the rumor business. And I’ll try.

  6. jdx19

    My guess is Alex Verdugo is the headliner, if the deal goes through.

    • wdwrolen2713

      He looks like he has a pretty good bat, especially in terms of AVG and OBP. But are Reds still hoping for that major league ready prospect they’ve been asking for so much?

      • jdx19

        They are hoping, yes. But Chapman isn’t worth a major league ready prospect. I hope the FO will finally learn that and get a few guys in high-A or AA that could be part of a winner in 2018. Don’t get me wrong, i’d love to compete in 2017, but I think it’ll be a big stretch since other than Winker we have no one in the minors who can hit.

      • jdx19

        I think I meant 2017/2016…. not 2018/2017. Whooops!

    • CP

      I’d be happy with that…it’d be interesting how general audience would take acquiring a 19 year old in High A who won’t be contributing for a while.

    • Joe McManus

      I think you may be right. You’d have to think Seager, Urias and Pederson are not available. Other top prospects for the Dodgers include Jose De Leon and Grant Holmes. Both are starters with De Leon much closer to contributing. Who knows though; maybe we keep stockpiling our pitching. It seems that with the way starters salaries are skyrocketing, everyone is looking to deal for young controllable pitching.

    • Rusty

      Verdugo is several years away from being mlb ready. I know the Reds have stockpiled a lot of young arms but I’d still try to get DeLeon and 2b Peraza. I know Peraza is a speed, defense & gap hitter…future lead-off hitter?

  7. wdwrolen2713

    Heyman also said that Reds people claim there is another team: I wonder if this is just a lie or if the Astros are still in it. I’m assuming that the Dodgers have the better prospects and therefore is who we should hope Cincy deals with.

    • Michael E

      I heard 34 teams were heavily interested in Chapman…including the Reds, who have made a ludicrous offer for Chapman of R. Stephenson, Winker and Lamb.

      • wdwrolen2713

        Heard the Cleveland Browns want Chapman as their next QB. Maybe they offer Manziel? 🙂

  8. kmartin

    Given that the Dodgers have Kenley Jansen (only 28) and they just lost Greinke, could they possibly be thinking of Chapman as starter?

    • wdwrolen2713

      The agony Reds fans will endure the day Chapman starts against them. We still have to trade Chappy, but the script seems to already be written. Oh Reds, when will you learn?

      • earmbrister

        It will be a tough day indeed. With hell freezing over and all …

      • wdwrolen2713

        I guess any hope/fear that Chapman starts is unlikely, but the Dodgers will have to do something about Jansen and Chapman clashing – if they end up w/ AC.

      • earmbrister

        I’m thinking with the Dodgers missing out on Greinke, they are very motivated to establish a killer BP.

        Not to mention the PR they suddenly need.

      • greenmtred

        Wouldn’t the agony be dependent upon how he did against the Reds?

  9. WVRedlegs

    Lets get this party started!!
    I think what we might see is Chapman and BHam to LAD for OF Joc Pederson, SP Grant Holmes, and another player. BHam will help the Dodgers offset the loss of Pederson. Plus the Dodgers have Maury Wills as an instructor in their minor league system. He would be a perfect tutor for BHam at the plate.

    • jessecuster44

      … And where was such a tutor for BHam when he was in the minors for Cincy?

    • Chuck Schick

      You can’t tutor someone to hit a major league breaking ball.

  10. jessecuster44

    Enough with the pitching. Chappy needs to be traded for a bat.

  11. ohiojimw

    At some point the Reds are just going to have to suck it up and take the best deal(s) they can get for position players/ position player prospects. Otherwise they are going to be converting pitchers into position players to fill out rosters what with the (much needed) house cleaning that’s taken place since the end of the season.

    • CP

      Possibly, but people should probably remember that it is December 7th,/i>.

      • ohiojimw

        The issue as I see it is that many (most) other teams are dealing now and not necessarily acting like it is the end of the first week of December.

        If other teams see themselves as essentially “finished” before Christmas, do the Reds have the head turners cause teams to wait or to draw them back into the market in a meaningful way? Except for Chapman, I doubt it. This could leave the Reds just dumping salaries for lower less desirable prospects than they could get now.

      • CP

        All I’m saying is that there are people pulling their hair out over lack of action, when the free agent and trade markets for position players have been almost completely dormant, basically waiting on the big free agents to set the market price. and the vast majority of teams have yet to make significant moves.

        Not a single one of the big boys have signed yet: once guys like Heyward, Davis, Cespedes, Upton, Gordon, and Zobrist are signed, I’d expect the trade market to get more interesting for the Reds.

        The best free agent 3B is David Freese, the best 2B is Ben Zobrist…Frazier put up almost twice the WAR Freese did, and Phillips will likely be much cheaper than Zobrist (as well as less risky over the course of the contract if you are an organization who wants an upgrade at 2B, but are concerned about giving 4-5 contracts out to a guy that turns 35 in May.

        Be patient y’all.

  12. ohiojimw

    I saw a comment above that lots of teams want young controllable starting pitching. This is the opposite side of the coin from the Reds but that doesn’t necessarily mean a trading match.

    These other teams are probably looking for pitching on a similar place in the development curve as the position types the Reds are trying to shake free. In other words, the pitchers these teams want would likely be Disco and Iglesias from the Reds projected 25 man roster or the likes of Stephenson and Reed (also possibly Travieso) who figure to be MLB ready NLT the 2017 season. The pitchers the Reds might be (more) willing to part with are the likes of Moscot or Lamb. Also, Finnegan or Lorenzen who have higher value as probably MLB bullpen ready now but less as starting prospects.

    • Joe McManus

      Sure, I just meant that adding guys like Holmes and De Leon would add to our young tradeable pitching assets to deal from if we can’t add the MLB bats right now. We can keep who we want and deal the excess arms. The Indians are in a nice position to add a bat if they choose this week with the likes of Bauer, Carrasco, Salazaar and even Kluber. I want good, young position players as much as anyone, but I think the Reds may be ahead of the game in compiling young arms. I also agree that Lorenzen and Finnegan could be fantastic bullpen guys. Good young cheap power arms are definitely the way to build a bullpen these days. Exhibit A: The world champion Royals

      • ohiojimw

        As they say, a team can never too much pitching (but it has to have enough position players to fill its roster and provide organizational and developmental depth). Somewhere along the line the Reds have become so fixated with pitching, they seem to have almost made drafting and developing position guys an afterthought.

  13. Dan

    Here’s a novel concept. Since we apparently have an abundance of young arms in the minors why not trying to trade 2 of our top pitching prospects for 1 top batting prospect? Or… Include a Stephenson in a package to bring us at least one major league batting prospect. Stephenson and Chapman packaged together could probably get the Reds anything that they wanted, or I should say need. Let’s face reality check Stephenson’s control and endurance are not anywhere near MLB ready so why not trade him while he is still considered our #1 prospect and he is not immediately needed?

    • CP

      Yes, trading an elite closer, a probable top 25 pitching prospect, and a likely compensatory first round draft pick for a hitting prospect is pretty novel.

    • RedsFaninPitt

      Great idea if you could get Urias, Seager, Bergman or Reed back in the deal. I would love to see the Reds land Barnes (the Reds could use him as a Phillips/Frazier replacement at the top of the batting order), Verdugo (CF/RF), and Bellinger (1B/OF). But, I think a Verdugo/Schebler trade is the more likely outcome – some combination of current MLB-ready low-ceiling, high floor young player with a high-ceiling young prospect still a ways a way from MLB.

      From the Stros, I would love to see all of Cameron/Moran/Kemp, but more likely to be P. Tucker/Kemp or maybe J.D. Davis.

    • Chris Esberger

      If you have a high level hitting prospect….which is the most desired commodity in baseball….why would you trade him for a rental closer and a pitching prospect? Conversely, if you’re the Reds and you’re 2-3 years away from competing, why would you trade your best pitching prospect who has accumulated zero service time?

  14. sezwhom

    If every pundit is saying the Dodgers, then it’ll probably be the Giants.

    • ohiojimw

      Jon Heyman just played the “Dusty” card in the Chapman talk as in watch out for the Nats because of the “Dusty-Aroldis link”. Must be a lot of people sleeping in at the meetings today.

  15. ohiojimw

    But now this from Rosenthal on Twitter:
    “BREAKING: #Dodgers agree to acquire Chapman from #Reds for two prospects. Deal is pending review of medical records, sources say”.