Tonight was how it should have gone when the season started. Tonight, the offense got it done early and Cueto was on his game and the Reds cruised to a 5-0 victory over the Rockies.

Tonight, Joey Votto continued to remind us why he got that big ol’ contract in the first place. Since 2009, the only player with a higher OPS is Miguel Cabrera. If you prefer your stats fancy (I do), he’s 3rd in wRC+ over that time, behind Cabrera and Mike Trout. This year, he’s been the third best hitter in the NL. Be glad we get to watch him.

Tonight, Frazier and Bruce and Hamilton also had good nights. Hamilton got on base like he was supposed to and baserunning wonderment ensued like it was supposed to.

Tonight, if you paused for just a moment, you could pretend the Reds were in the thick of it. Easily winning a game they were supposed to win.

But really, tonight was the end of something. It was the end of watching Johnny Cueto pitch for the Reds. Johnny Cueto is one of the very best pitchers the Reds have ever had and I will be shocked if his next start doesn’t come for another team. I will be shocked if we’re ever lucky enough to seem him put on a Cincinnati uniform again.

Tonight was good night, but it was a sad night. Bye, bye, Johnny. We’ll miss you.

Box Score  |   Win Probability Graph

82 Responses

  1. Wm. Elliott

    There was a trade with the Royals today involving Cueto, however, one of the left handed pitchers they were getting back, didnt pass the physical! This came from a very reliable source, and hopefully, we get some great prospects, and dont settle.

    • jdx19

      I just heard Sam Ryan say this on Quick Pitch. Interesting stuff.

  2. rhayex

    Per the broadcasters, Cueto was almost traded earlier today. Lorenzen was actually warming up in the outfield. Hopefully (it’s the right word, even if it’s painful), we see a trade tomorrow.

  3. Tom Reed

    Cueto was at his best and the Reds won one for Johnny.

  4. Victor Vollhardt

    If the Reds are SMART they will let him play out the season and take the compensation pick—-If they are WISE they will use the time and re-sign him—he will get better and make everyone else better and that includes all the young pitchers.

    • rhayex

      Everything you just said is the opposite of true. Cueto likely peaked last year. He is probably going to have two or three more great years, then a couple average ones, then a bunch of meh ones (if he sticks around that long). He wants a 200 million dollar contract. The Reds can’t afford that. The Reds, instead of getting a lottery pick draft pick, can get multiple guys close to the majors that can help for multiple years.

      • charlottencredsfan

        Agree with you but it is a very bitter pill to swallow. Just hope he is wearing a WS ring, come October.

      • rhayex

        I entirely agree. I started following and watching the Reds in the mid-late 2000s, and Johnny Cueto has been around for almost that entire time. Before him, it was Arroyo, Harang, Clausen, etc. I’m gonna miss him.

        Like I said before, I truly believe that he should have been the Reds first Cy Young Award winner last year. Unfortunately, it didn’t happen. Hope he gets a ring with whatever team he’s traded to.

        Just saw on Twitter that it was the Royals who were about to trade for him today, but one of their players failed their physical.

      • Victor Vollhardt

        To rhayex: Opinions (yours or mine) are just that–no one knows what will play out —we are all just guessing as to how long he can pitch and at what level and how much he is asking money wise–year wise —or what a top notch pitcher will be worth in two, three or four years—However if he could truly pitch at a high level for the next three years and then add two average years on top of that (your figures) all the while setting the bar for the young pitchers and putting customers in their seats and in front of their TV’s—-he would be worth it. I have been watching the Reds (on cloud 9 and dying back and forth) since 1949 and while for very short periods of time there have been some good pitchers—-there has never been one like Cueto—-he is a once in lifetime guy——– to let him go sends a message to the whole organization–a message with far reaching effects.

      • charlottencredsfan

        I’m thinking, if he stays healthy, he could be worth a long, high dollar contract but the Reds realistically can’t afford it. Just an opinion but I believe the Reds already have gotten ahead of themselves on a couple of long-term, high dollar deals that have limited roster flexibility to the teams’ detriment. If we have the Yanks, Dodgers, Angels money, I would be right with you 100%. Sad day when the number ’47’ jersey is turned in.

      • redmountain

        If you have been a fan since 1949, how can you say that the Reds have never a How about like Cueto? Mario Soto and Jim Maloney? Both played for bad teams but were considered outstanding pitchers. Soto taught Cueto his change-up.

      • Tom Gray

        Maloney played for bad teams? 1961 NL champs. 1962 3rd, 1964 2nd.

        The Reds had very good teams most years in the 1960’s except 1960 and 1966.

      • GreatRedLegsFan

        I’d say that three more great years is a very optimistic forecast. I’d give as much as two more. A change to the AL will benefit his carreer.

      • sezwhom

        I agree. Cueto’s our ace and we’ll be hard pressed to find someone new of his ilk but it’s time to move on without him. We’re not going anywhere with him so reload.

    • Evan armstrong

      His contact will not be worth it.

      • redmountain

        This is not a lie, but in comparison to other pitchers he will be paid his value.

      • charlottencredsfan

        Just depends on his ultimate destination. Let’s face it, with Reds he has to perform way above market value and to the Yanks he wouldn’t even have to reach that bar. Heck, a couple of Cy Young-like seasons out of 6 and they would think it’s worth it, and it would be.

    • wdwrolen2713

      Even if you do want to resign Johnny, nothing is keeping you from doing that even if we trade him. He will most likely be fa at offseason no matter what team has him. Doesnt qo go away when team gets him in trade so every team, even us, have equal opportunity to sign him.

    • Vicferrari

      This when you bit the bullet and
      SELL HIGH,, SELL HIGH

  5. rhayex

    Kyle Zimmer was the player whose medicals didn’t check out, apparently.

      • rhayex

        Not a reliever. He’s an SP who’s been injury prone the last few years. Ranked as Royals #1 prospect previous two years, fell due to injury concerns. 2012 was ranked #24 in baseball, 2013 #23, 2014 #75 in baseball. Very good prospect, long term prospects look grim after failing his physical for the trade.

      • rhayex

        Reds wouldn’t have had him as the main piece of a Johnny Cueto trade if they were planning on using him as a reliever. They were intending to convert him back to starting. That’s why they failed him on the physical; they saw something they didn’t like in his elbow.

    • ohiojimw

      I read a tweet that it was a leftie. If so good chance it was Sean Manaea
      http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=manaea000sea

      He was the #34 overall pick in the 2013 draft. Manaea’s name was mentioned along with Brandon Finnegan, also a leftie pitcher. Finnegan was the #17 overall pick in the 2014 draft:

      http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/f/finnebr01.shtml

      I’m saying Manaea was most likely because he made 25 starts last season at High A then did not plat this year until the last week of June when he made a start for the Arizona Royals in the Arizona Rookie league. Manaea then made 4 starts with the high A team and was just bumped up to the AA team where he had made 1 start per Baseball Reference last night. So that smells of some kind of injury situation.

      • ohiojimw

        I have difficulty believing Zimmer would have been a central piece at this point.
        He was pick #5 overall in 2012 out of college and since then as never gotten higher than a cup of coffee at AA.

        Between 2014 and 2015, Zimmer fell like a rock in the prospect ratings. For the pre-2015 rankings, he fell clear out of the Baseball Prospectus top 100 rankings, and to 75 in BA and 58 in the MLB rankings.

      • rhayex

        Yeah, I’m reading conflicting rumors that it was either Zimmer or Manaea. Zimmer seems to be more of the consensus, though. I’m PRAYING that we get Mondesi because of this though.

      • ohiojimw

        If what I read, that it was a leftie, is accurate then it is Manaea or possibly the other guy Finnegan. They were all technically 1st round picks, although Manaea was 34 overall because of comp/ sandwich picking.

      • rhayex

        I’d think if it wasn’t Zimmer it’d be due to the injury concerns anyway, and if it was either of those two guys that failed their physical then I have no clue what the Royals can send to the Reds that we’ll accept.

      • redmountain

        Does the term not in a million years mean anything to you?

  6. Tom Gray

    Cueto and Bailey came up about the same time. Cueto is the better P (I think) but Bailey has the 2 no-hitters. Both are good P developed by Reds MiLB system.

    • jdx19

      No doubt Cueto is better. I just hope Homer can get (and stay) healthy and give us a good 3-4 months next year.

    • pinson343

      You’re not sure which is better ???

  7. pinson343

    Cueto was very upset at the Reds handling of his situation today, according to Sheldon. He quoted Cueto as saying: “I was warming up and he (Lorenzon) was there in the bullpen and I told him, ‘What are you doing here?’ He told me, ‘I’m going to pitch because you’re going to get traded.’ That happened 10 minutes before the game,” Cueto said through translator Tomas Vera.
    “I don’t want to use a bad word in this location, but it was really bad how I found out what happened,” Cueto said. “My head went around the whole way. My thoughts were all over the place. I didn’t know what to do.”

    That’s how Johnny learned of the near trade ? Usually you don’t have to tell a player about a near trade, but when they have Lorenzon warming up to start the game, someone in management has to tell him Cueto why that’s happening, you don’t just leave it to Lorenzon.

    A communication breakdown, what a surprise.

    I hope they manage to make nice with Johnny, would hate to see him depart with bad feelings.

    • Vanessa Galagnara

      good job bryan price. that one falls on the manager that is his job to keep players informed of their status.

      • Jim t

        What was Price or any reds official supposed to do. Run out there in the middle of Johnny a warming up and tell him you may have been traded? Cueto knows he is on the block and it can happen any minute. He will make a ton of money next year in FA. This is a business. He should understand that. I’m sure he has been told by reds officials he will be moved before the 31. I am sorry to see him go but he will be set financially for the rest of his life. Can we please tone down the poor Cueto stuff.he has been treated very well here by management and fans.

      • ohiojimw

        “What was Price or any reds official supposed to do. Run out there in the middle of Johnny a warming up and tell him you may have been traded?”
        *****************************************************************************************
        Yes, in a proactive organization that’s exactly what they would do. It’s not like everybody didn’t know this could be happening. The front office would be in touch with the player’s agent; and, the manager would tell the player. And it didn’t happen in the middle of Cueto warming up. Cueto got to the pen and Lorenzen was already there.

        All it takes is a simple sentence or two, “Johnny, Lorenzen will be warming up alongside of you because I’ve been informed by the GM that a trade may be pending.

        And certainly if somebody can tell Lorenzen why he is warming up, somebody can tell Cueto why too.

        Fay and Sheldon said everybody knew something was going on because Jocketty and Price (and others) were locked down all afternoon behind closed doors. On the pregame radio (i.e. under Reds team control) MB asked Price if he could provide an explanation for why they were closeted. Price ultimately said as of right now as we speak nothing is happening that I know anything about.

      • greenmtred

        Actually, yes, a Reds’ official–preferably Price–should have told Cueto what was happening. That’s simply decency, good manners, the right thing to do. Business and money do not free anyone from the obligation to behave decently.

      • Tom Diesman

        I’m thinking as penance, Price should hang a big mirror in his office today for the meeting with the reporters, stand in front of it when they arrive, an berate himself with F-Bombs for 10 minutes. 🙂

      • Vicferrari

        If someone had the time to tell Lorenzen, they should have had time to tell Cueto. Maybe Lorenzen just put 2 and 2 together.

      • Jim t

        You guys are kidding right. No way should he have told Johnny that he may be dealt prior to the game especially in the middle of his preparation. Lorenzen was a back up and I’m quite sure both Cueto and his agent are aware something was close. Deals take all kinds of shape. Sometimes it happens quick and sometimes it drags out. We have a owner who wants more then anything to give the fans a winner. His efforts are not the problem nor is it a issue how he treats his players. This organization could use a bit of luck. Injuries have been huge. It’s my opinion if Cueto wouldn’t have been lost in less then a inning against the Giants we would have already had a title. We are far from the worst organization in the league. This is a very tough spot. Unloading players when others know you have to is not easy. Timing is everything!!! How about we wait and see how it all plays out!!!

      • pinson343

        As a matter of policy, you never tell a player that he’s “almost been traded”. In this case, Cueto was going to learn that when he saw Lorenzon warming up. So that’s actually breaking the policy. It was 10 minutes before the game, the trade had already been nixed. Tell Lorenzon to sit down.

        In any case, if he had to find out because of the situation, it shoudn’t be Lorenzon to have to tell him. Was that fair to Lorenzon ?

        I too think Cueto has been treated very well by the Reds and their management.

      • User1022

        Agree.

        I know baseball is a business and you can’t get sentimental about players.

        But it’s simply human decency to someone who controls your future to tell you when that future has been altered. As many have said, how is it Lorenzen knew but Cueto didn’t?

      • Jim t

        Lorenzen had to be told to warm up. This was not his day to pitch so he was told. He was told ere is a chance you may be needed because of the timing of the deal. If all went well with physicals he wou
        D be needed. I have no doubt that Cueto knew there was something up. He has to know it can be any mi ute between now and 31st. Actually he has known this for awhile. When they couldn’t get a deal done with the Reds he has known he was gone before the deadline. This is a non- issue. He has been paid well and treated well since he has been a red. He is going to hit the lottery again in the off season.

      • Tom Gray

        Price would not know that because he has never been a manager anywhere but the Reds, this year and last. He has no idea how to be a manager.

    • DHud

      Lack of social tact from a young rookie. Lorenzen has to have more of a feel than that. I 100% agree that I don’t want to see Johnny leaving on a sour note

      • pinson343

        But that’s why you don’t put a rookie in that situation.

  8. pinson343

    One person on the game thread was very upset at Price for taking out Cueto after 8 innings. It turns out that Cueto asked to be taken out after his 8 innings and 100 pitches, not surprising in the high altitude.

  9. pinson343

    I savored every moment of tonight’s game (except the trouble with getting the final out and bringing in Chapman). Cueto especially, of course, he got especially nasty with LHed hitters toward the end of the game. Votto, Hamilton, Frazier.

    As Jason said, the way it was “supposed to go” this year.

  10. pinson343

    To JDX19: Just saw your in-game comment that you saw the game at Coors last night. You’re right, it’s a beautiful place to watch a game.

    I watched the Reds play at Coors a few years ago. I had a seat on the left field side, got to watch the sun set over the Rocky Mountains. Chapman was a setup guy then and pitched the 8th inning. The Reds won, something they haven’t often done at Coors in recent years.

    • charlottencredsfan

      JDX knows how to pick ’em. Wonderful game. Guys seemed to play loose and really enjoy being a team. Great to see the heartfelt attaboys that Johnny received from the guys after the game.

  11. sultanofswaff

    Jocketty needs to call Cueto to personally say he’s sorry for what transpired last night. Someone other than Lorenzen should’ve told him of the possibility of a trade. Classless. I mean, how did Lorenzen know? Clearly, it wasn’t some state secret. All Price had to do was march his butt out to the bullpen and give Johnny a heads up. Respect the guy enough to do that much. Gheesh.

    • ohiojimw

      Amen a thousand times over, Nothing like burning your bridges in front of one’s self to expose true colors.

      It was the sort of misstep they had when Skipworth read online he was being sent down and Price erupted into the Fbombing tirade at CTR,

      Wonder if they will blame this one on Lorenzen? Guess we will have to watch and see if he finds out from the ballboy that he’s been traded for the bag of used batting practice balls the kid just delivered.

      More seriously it shows the same type of lack of detail orientation the team does on the field as they find ways not to win games.

    • Tom Gray

      Manager’s job to communicate with his players. Reds don’t have a manager who knows that because he never managed at any level before.

    • sezwhom

      I don’t have all the facts but if that’s what really went down, then I agree.

    • Tom Reed

      The Peter Principle is in action with Price. He’s been promoted to his incompetency as manager. Why send a rookie out to inform your ace that a trade is pending. Price should have gone to the bullpen himself and spoke to Cueto man to man.

  12. sultanofswaff

    I love how Price will bring in Chapman to get one out with a 3 run lead last night but wouldn’t bring him into the 8th inning to protect a 1 run lead with the heart of the Rockies order coming up Friday night.

    #closerrules

  13. msanmoore

    Only watched the first couple of innings, but I turned it off with an oddly secure feeling that Johnny was dealing and we were in good shape. Glad that was the case and I got to see what is certainly the last start in a Reds uniform for JC. It’s been a nice run, that’s for sure. I wish him well in a ring chase this year and wherever he lands after that.

  14. Vanessa Galagnara

    When does revenue come in for the new TV contract? Are the Reds now essentially telling everyone that they are broke and cannot afford even to add the replacement value of Cueto’s existing contract?

    • ohiojimw

      I believe this negotiable between the team and the media organization buying the rights. If memory serves correctly, the payments on this expiring contract or the one previous were front loaded to help quickly provide increased liquidity .

      Of course when you front load that means you probably end up with less in the long run since the amount of overloading is essentially a loan against future payments,

  15. User1022

    Has RLN got their “Top 5 Johnny Cueto Moments” article ready to go? What would be yours? Definitely have to include the 10 strikeout debut, his role in the Cardinals brawl, his 1 hitter against the Pirates….

    What else?

    • charlottencredsfan

      Might remember last night’s as long as any of his other starts.

    • dradg

      The gem he pitched this year in Washington, with the shoulder shimmy.

  16. (@dixon606)

    Can we trade enough salary to be able to keep Cueto? Just wondering. Trade Chapman, Leake, Bruce, and anyone else except Votto to keep Johnny a Red. Ugh that Homer Bailey deal was a killer.

    • sezwhom

      The Homer deal is exactly why you don’t give that much bank to a SP. How’s that working out for us now?

    • Evan armstrong

      No way you pay any pitcher what Cuteo will get in the off season unless you are the Dodger’s.

  17. Vicferrari

    Maybe Toronto can give a better deal and he can pitch against KC on Thursday.
    I am hoping Cueto gets to pitch at home against the Pirates and tehy move him after the game. Defintely could hype that game.

  18. lwblogger2

    Jason, I enjoyed this short recap as much as anything you’ve written on here. Very well done.

  19. ProspectCincy

    It’s official … to the Royals!

  20. Lloyd

    Baseball sucks…. bring back the days when baseball players played for the same team their whole career and we didn’t have to worry about who’s making the most money it’s a sport it’s a game money has ruined it