Indians 9, Reds 4. Box Score. Win Probability Graph.

Last night was a good night for the ol’ Redlegs. Tonight was a not so good night.

Messers. Votto and Phillips had themselves splendandy-evenings and the ever-affable Mr. Bruce surely provided adequate contribution by helping to plate all the runs managed by the home team in this futile tilt, but as for the rest of the team, they can only hang their heads in abject sorrow.

Young Anthony DeSclafani certainly had his learning for the night. He’s still new and young and hope dawns for the young like for no one else. Onward to another day.

—-

Shifting to regular voice: Rough game today. Trades are about to be happening, we’re told. If Jay Bruce is going to be traded, I’ll be really sad. Same with Cueto (who is going to be traded). Other folks, I’m less attached to. Chapman, I don’t mind largely because he’s been so misused by the Reds. But Bruce and Cueto, that’d be tough.

I do not understand why Frazier is the only player not on the table. Objectively, this is the perfect time to trade Todd Frazier given his age and the remaining years of control. Yes, I know we all like him and stuff (he is likable), but just being cold about it, he should be on the block. It makes no sense to be willing to trade Bruce and not Frazier as you likely try to keep both guys if you’re planning to contend at any point in the next couple of years.

All of the games are so nondescript now. I only really worry about individual performances and otherwise, I let things float past. It’s weird to have wins and losses matter so little. Another game tomorrow, I guess. See you then.

 

50 Responses

  1. Tom Gray

    Trade them all. Get what you can. The Reds will L more than W the next 3-5 years no matter what.

      • BigRedMachine

        To be fair he didn’t mention Price’s lack of his experience, that Price probably isn’t smart enough to know what inning it is, or how great of a manager Dusty Baker was. Take what you can get, Nick. 😉

      • Vicferrari

        Do not forget that Dusty Baker had losing seasons his first 2 years and was able to lose every conceivable way when he got to the team to the playoffs with virtually no injuries and significantly more talent, therefore he is a better manager than Price because Price has no experience.

      • Tom Gray

        Because I’ve been there when it happened before. The Reds stunk in the 1950’s (I was in 1951), got better in the early 1960’s, great in the 1970’s, then back down in the 1980’s. Pretty good in the 1990’s but not so good since 2000 (except for a few recent years).

      • Tom Gray

        Born in 1951. God forbid there be an edit feature. You’d think Skip Schumaker designed this blog.

    • Evan armstrong

      Why be so negative? Reds are missing key players. A few tweaks and no reason they can’t be a playoff contender.

      • BigRedMike

        What players are the Reds missing? Other teams seem to do fine with injured players.

      • greenmtred

        Mesoraco and Bailey and Cozart. Key players by any reasonable standard. I’ll mention also that Vic Ferrari seems to have forgotten that Cueto got hurt in his first game in one of those playoffs.

      • Redsfan48

        I agree, people should be less negative. You do have to be realistic, but optimistic at the same time. I’m not going to say the Reds are a lock to make the playoffs in 2016, that’s just not realistic. But I will say that with the correct moves with these trades, they can contend for a playoff spot in 2016.

      • Tom Reed

        I don’t think all is lost. The Reds have a core to build around and young pitching coming up. Let’s see what happens in the next couple weeks and in the off-season. 1989 was a rough year with Pete Rose being banned from baseball and the Reds finished 5th. in the NL West, 17 games out. No one expected that the next year the Reds would win the pennant and sweep the WS. As a fan you’re realistic, but look for the positive.

      • Tom Gray

        Disagree. The Reds had good teams but often finished “Not Quite” in 2nd place in the late 1980’s. Piniella and his managerial skills put them into 1st place. He said that spring It’s Time For This Team To Win.

        The Reds will not contend until 2018 at the earliest if the Fire Sale Trades occur. It may be the right thing to do but the Reds will suck for a while.

  2. PARED84

    Reds fans are going to have to learn that even the best players will have growing pains. You need to look no further than tonight’s game. Cisco,Suarez, Hamilton all youg talented players who had tough games. Expect more of same after trades.
    I would not trade Bruce. Big mistake unless u get multiple high prospects which isn’t likely. I would trade JC,,AC,TF,MB,PENA,BP and try to resign Leake.

  3. jdx19

    Jason, I’m in the same boat. I’m rooting for players to do well for themselves, but the wins/losses don’t really change my mood anymore.

    Things I’m rooting for (assuming the guys don’t get traded):

    Joey: Maintain .400 OBP and .500 SLG for the rest of the season.
    BP: Play good defense and stay healthy
    Billy: Increase skills in walking and bunting
    Jay: Keep the walk rate up and the O-Swing% down.
    Todd: FORTY-HOMERS! Do it.
    Suarez: No more errors!
    Tucker: Maintain a passable MLB bat in your limited PT.
    Lorenzen: Quit walking so many guys!
    Raisel: Quit walking so many guys!
    Disco: Stay healthy and pitch a bunch of innings. May need you to go 200 next year.

    • jessecuster44

      Walt: Get replaced
      Price: Use Chappy in 2 inning bursts instead almost not at all

    • Hotto4Votto

      Those are good. And mainly what I’m looking for. Although I don’t care about Billy bunting as much. I wish he did it well but it’s not a skill I care a lot about, or one I see really effected his offense much. I would like to see him drop switch hitting and focus on hitting the ball hard (increasing line drive percentages).

      I’d like to see Suarez keep demonstrating good plate discipline and above average power from the MIF spot (as well as the no errors). We need more good ABs from our guys.

      I’d like to see DeJesus get more playing time, either as a PH or giving guys days off.

      I’d also like to see YRod get some time in the OF, so move Byrd sooner than later. And get Stephenson a few opportunities to show his growth at the MLB level in September.

    • BigRedMike

      Would be nice to see Hamilton improve his hitting, a wRC+ of 50 is a concern

      His defense and base running make up some for the poor hitting

    • Redsfan48

      I agree with most of these, but I think Frazier has a shot at 50 HRs with a strong second half, why not shoot for that goal?

  4. Tom Gray

    90 W (or more) by Reds in my lifetime (born in 1951).

    Dusty 3 times. Jack McKeon 1 time. Lou Piniella 2 times. John McNamara 1 time. Sparky Anderson 7 times. Fred Hutchinson 2 times. Birdie Tebbets 1 time.

    1951 season through 2015 season is 65 years. So 17 out of 65 years Reds have 90 W or more.

    Sparky is the best by far (duh, HOF). Dusty next, then Lou and Hutch.

    When might the Reds next get to 90 W?

      • Tom Gray

        No but only because the 1994 strike lingered into 1995 season.

        Marge Scott didn’t like his personal life (reportedly living with his girlfriend before they were married) so he didn’t last.

      • Vicferrari

        Most likely would have had it 94 and 95 had it not been for the strike

    • Redsfan48

      They could do it in the near future if this rebuild goes as planned. My money is on Barry Larkin being the manager to get it done.

    • Vicferrari

      Dusty has managed more losing seasons of any Reds manager in your lifetime. Pete had more winning seasons. This is not about advocating Price should be retained it the argument you seem to imply it was a mistake to replace Dusty at all.

  5. Indy Red Man

    Trade BP!!! He might want to go to a contender and there is no point in keeping a 35-36 yr old infielder on a rebuilding team. I think he could really help someone and he’d love the big stage in the playoffs! To me most of Jay Bruce’s 3 run hrs are in 9-1 ballgames but I’m sure that’s not actually true. He’s actually a good value and someone they couldn’t replace very easily? If they trade Jay does that mean they’ll run Byrd out to RF next year? If they keep Bruce and Chapman and find a way to get a .350+ obp leadoff hitter when they trade Cueto, Leake, BP, Parra, Byrd, etc. then I think they could atleast do .500 next year and possibly contend? It might come down to if Mesoraco can catch again but I think they’ll score some runs next year? I like our young pitchers and they could prob add some great arms in these trades?

    • Jason Linden

      I think the Reds would gladly trade BP, I just don’t think he’s very tradable. Declining performance. Old. Biggish contract left. 10-5 man (no-trade protection).

    • Redsfan48

      Hard to trade because of the contract and no-trade rights. The only way we could probably trade him (even assuming he waives his no-trade clause) is either if we take another bad contract in return (in which case I’d rather have Phillips) or we eat a ton of money (which defeats the purpose of trading him) so they should just hold onto him for his defense and for everything he does for the fans.

    • Evan armstrong

      Can’t trade someone who doesn’t want to be traded.

  6. Adam S.

    Frazier should not be in the block! Trade him for prospects that will never benefit the adds? No way. I would keep him and extend him.

    • Jason Linden

      Are you comfortable with a 35-year-old Votto, or is he someone you’d trade because of the contract. If you’re not comfortable keeping Votto, there’s not reason to extend Frazier, as he will also age and decline. Frazier will be 31 when he hits free agency. That’s the decline phase. Extending him likely doesn’t make financial sense, especially given his inconsistent track record (Votto had been a much better player when he was extended).

      Basically, my view is that Bruce and Frazier are equivalent in that if you keep one, you keep both because you’re trying to compete soon. If you trade one, trade both, because you’re looking further down the road. The Reds’ current strategy makes no sense.

      • Redsfan48

        I’d be comfortable with Frazier being on this team through his age-35 season like I’ve said in the past. Sign him up until then, then let him walk. Slightly overpay on AAV to get less years on the contract kind of like the Red Sox did with Porcello

      • Tom Gray

        Frazier is not Frank Robinson but the Reds traded F Robby because GM Bill DeWitt thought he was an “old 30” and could be replaced by Deron Johnson.

        He is not Tony Perez either but the Reds traded Perez because GM Bob Howsam thought he was about to decline and Danny Driessen could replace him.

      • Adam S.

        Reds were wrong when traded frank and tony and would be wrong trading Frazier too

      • greenmtred

        Jason: Wouldn’t it depend upon whom the Reds were offered for Bruce and Frazier?

  7. Adam S.

    I would keep Frazier because he is a very good player and acts like he cares about playing. He is a great representative for the team

  8. Tom Gray

    Today may be Johnny Cueto’s last start as a Red. Let’s hope for vintage Cueto today.

  9. Adam S.

    If it’s his last reds start I will be sad. I am expecting next to nothing in return in a trade. I don’t value low rated prospects.

  10. sezwhom

    Follow the Astros blueprint. Unload, stock up, plan for the future. Paying off now.

    Personally, I’d like to see a change in Management too. Price is a goner but as for GM, I’d try for Bobby Evans of the Giants. Probably won’t move his family but he’d be a solid choice.

  11. Evan armstrong

    Weather we want to admit or not this is still a business and while baseball wise trading Frazier might be smart..it would be a horrible PR and business move.