All this is true, but there’s likely to be a group of players that will replace Dunn in LF, not just Gomes.
The numbers look better when you tally up the potential LF platoon of Gomes-Dickerson-Nix-Hairston-One Lucky Fan Per Game Picked at Random by Marty Brennaman.
But at least they’re cheaper than Dunn, right? Right?!?
brublejr
Gomes is not a starter, plain and simple. But I like the idea of him coming off the bench to mash lefties. What is the bench going to look like at this point? Will they keep 1 or 2 OF?
McDonald, Bankston, Barker, Castillo, Richar, Rosales……. Nix, Barker and Castillo are the only ones who can swing it from the left side. I’d expect LH pinch hitter type to be brought in before it is all over.
GregD
I thought when they signed Hairston, they made a point of saying he was their left fielder. If Gonzalez is ready to go on opening day, I think this makes that scenario even more likely.
Assuming they go with 12 pitchers:
8 starters (Hernandez, Votto, Phillips, Gonzalez, Edwin, Hairston, Taveras, Bruce)
5 on the bench
C – Hanigan
IF – Keppinger
IF – Castillo (or Richar)
OF – Dickerson
OF – Gomes or Nix
Mark in CC
I like the Dickerson quote from Hal McCoy this morning. Early in ’08 the “light came on.”
If it stays on he could be an absolute force and hopefully we will be able to say next winter, “Adam Who”.
Dan
I hope Hairston is nothing more than a good, versatile backup. We enjoyed his career year last year — extremely unlikely to repeat that.
I’m high on Gomes. I hope Dusty gives him an adequate chance.
Here’s an admittedly optimistic question — what if both Dickerson and Gomes are really good? How much mashing out of them as our LF platoon would it take before Dusty starts playing Dickerson in CF over Fast Willy?
I mean, does that scenario have any chance of happening? How open is Dusty to changing his mind? (I’m afraid the answer to that is — not very.)
GregD
None – Taveras is the CFer unless his AVG takes a dive like Patterson’s did last year.
What are Dickerson/Gomes splits? I thought Dickerson hasn’t historically done much vs LH pitchers.
KY Chip
If last year taught us anything, it should be this: even if Taveras’ AVG takes a dive, he’ll likely remain the starting CF and lead-off man. Y’know, because he’s fast and can create havoc on the basepaths, whichever day of the week he happens to get there.
If JHJ is the starting LF, he’ll pull a Humpty-Dumpty sometime in May and we’ll see him again come August. He should be the #1 IF reserve and the #2 OF reserve on this squad and that’s about it.
I think Gomes will end up with a roster spot as long as he doesn’t completely tank spring training. He adds a modicum of power off the bench and if his bat impresses, he could end up as part of a LF platoon with Dickerson.
Flash
I can’t see how anyone in their right mind can put either Nix or Gomes ahead of Hopper. Both of them strike out mor than the get on base. They are also mediocre fielders. I really don’t want to see Gomes or Nix in a Reds uniform. I doubt they are even on par with Stubbs, Henry or Dorn
This is why I like Gomes more than Hopper. Even with his worse defense, and tons of strikeouts, Gomes is better, in my opinion.
In my view, we can’t have TWO no-power outfielders (Taveras and Hopper) both getting playing time. This isn’t 1968.
GregD
If Dickerson starts or Hairston in LF (or starts vs righties, which will be most games), and Gomes/Nix start the year in AAA, the Reds will not have any pop on the bench either.
Dan
Dickerson vs. RHP (career minors) – .272/.364/.464
Dickerson vs. RHP (2008 minors) – .300/.394/.521
Gomes vs. LHP (career majors) – .266/.369/.510
I really like this is a platoon.
(Though I hope there is some chance that Gomes will get a chance to play more if he turns out good. He’s the only new face with any significant offensive upside.)
Dan
Oops… “I really like this AS a platoon” is what I meant…
David
The problem with Gomes is that he doesn’t make up for his poor defense with his bat. His UZR/150 was positive (yes positive) only once in his career. He hasn’t had a positive value win since 2005.
He is a RH PH with some pop. He should be used that way. You have to keep him off the field. If you want to go with a RH/LH platoon in LF, it should be with Hairston (gulp) as the team is currently configured.
Personally, I have been screaming about a Stubbs/Dickerson platoon, but that hasn’t gotten me anywhere. I think Stubbs will surprise and make the jump this year.
Dan
UZR/150 is a rating of defense only, right? Not overall value?
In my view, if Gomes hits anywhere near his career line vs. LHP (.266/.369/.510) this year, I can tolerate some below-average defense in LF.
Defense in LF (in my view) is a lot less important than in CF.
Kramer
Mark in CC….I appreciate the optimism, but I don’t put a whole lot of stock in this sort of comment. If I’m not mistaken, Dusty made a similar comment about Bako after he started last season on a relative hot streak. I’m too lazy to find the exact quote, but it was along the lines of “sometimes, at a certain point in a guys career, the light just goes on”. We all know how that worked out. That being said, I would take Dickerson’s potential over Taveras’ reality.
per14
I’m now reading that Dunn is probably not getting more than about 5 million/year.
Now, a) I’m really glad we didn’t resign him for the numbers he wanted last summer; but b) shouldn’t we think about bringing him back for that amount?!?!? I understand that pride and ego are playing a big part here, and I understand he’s a flawed player but man, he’s worth 5 million/year! Even if the Reds have to pay 7.5 per year to overcome the pride/ego issues, I’d still sign him.
Tom
Dickerson vs. RHP (career minors) – .272/.364/.464
Dickerson vs. RHP (2008 minors) – .300/.394/.521
Gomes vs. LHP (career majors) – .266/.369/.510
====================================
For comparisons sake, here are Laynce Nix split numbers against RHs.
Nix vs. RHP (career minors) – .288/.350/.547
Nix vs. RHP (2008 minors) – .295/.358/.544
Nix vs. RHP (career majors) – .244/.279/.423
Most of Nix MLB ABs were from age 22-24, he’s 28 now, just a year and half older than Dickerson. If he’s healthy again, I think he’d be a decent bet to put up a .800 OPS vs RHs in a platoon. There is not much chance of this, but platoons of Dickerson/Taveras in CF and a Nix/Gomes in LF could be interesting.
All this is true, but there’s likely to be a group of players that will replace Dunn in LF, not just Gomes.
The numbers look better when you tally up the potential LF platoon of Gomes-Dickerson-Nix-Hairston-One Lucky Fan Per Game Picked at Random by Marty Brennaman.
But at least they’re cheaper than Dunn, right? Right?!?
Gomes is not a starter, plain and simple. But I like the idea of him coming off the bench to mash lefties. What is the bench going to look like at this point? Will they keep 1 or 2 OF?
09 Bench (Assuming Dickerson starting LF)
Hannigan
Hairston
Keppinger
Gomes/Nix/Hopper (2 of 3?)
who else?
McDonald, Bankston, Barker, Castillo, Richar, Rosales……. Nix, Barker and Castillo are the only ones who can swing it from the left side. I’d expect LH pinch hitter type to be brought in before it is all over.
I thought when they signed Hairston, they made a point of saying he was their left fielder. If Gonzalez is ready to go on opening day, I think this makes that scenario even more likely.
Assuming they go with 12 pitchers:
8 starters (Hernandez, Votto, Phillips, Gonzalez, Edwin, Hairston, Taveras, Bruce)
5 on the bench
C – Hanigan
IF – Keppinger
IF – Castillo (or Richar)
OF – Dickerson
OF – Gomes or Nix
I like the Dickerson quote from Hal McCoy this morning. Early in ’08 the “light came on.”
If it stays on he could be an absolute force and hopefully we will be able to say next winter, “Adam Who”.
I hope Hairston is nothing more than a good, versatile backup. We enjoyed his career year last year — extremely unlikely to repeat that.
I’m high on Gomes. I hope Dusty gives him an adequate chance.
Here’s an admittedly optimistic question — what if both Dickerson and Gomes are really good? How much mashing out of them as our LF platoon would it take before Dusty starts playing Dickerson in CF over Fast Willy?
I mean, does that scenario have any chance of happening? How open is Dusty to changing his mind? (I’m afraid the answer to that is — not very.)
None – Taveras is the CFer unless his AVG takes a dive like Patterson’s did last year.
What are Dickerson/Gomes splits? I thought Dickerson hasn’t historically done much vs LH pitchers.
If last year taught us anything, it should be this: even if Taveras’ AVG takes a dive, he’ll likely remain the starting CF and lead-off man. Y’know, because he’s fast and can create havoc on the basepaths, whichever day of the week he happens to get there.
If JHJ is the starting LF, he’ll pull a Humpty-Dumpty sometime in May and we’ll see him again come August. He should be the #1 IF reserve and the #2 OF reserve on this squad and that’s about it.
I think Gomes will end up with a roster spot as long as he doesn’t completely tank spring training. He adds a modicum of power off the bench and if his bat impresses, he could end up as part of a LF platoon with Dickerson.
I can’t see how anyone in their right mind can put either Nix or Gomes ahead of Hopper. Both of them strike out mor than the get on base. They are also mediocre fielders. I really don’t want to see Gomes or Nix in a Reds uniform. I doubt they are even on par with Stubbs, Henry or Dorn
Gomes (majors) – .235/.329/.455
Gomes (minors) – .272/.398/.529
Hopper (majors) – .316/.367/.371
Hopper (minors) – .289/.343/.335
This is why I like Gomes more than Hopper. Even with his worse defense, and tons of strikeouts, Gomes is better, in my opinion.
In my view, we can’t have TWO no-power outfielders (Taveras and Hopper) both getting playing time. This isn’t 1968.
If Dickerson starts or Hairston in LF (or starts vs righties, which will be most games), and Gomes/Nix start the year in AAA, the Reds will not have any pop on the bench either.
Dickerson vs. RHP (career minors) – .272/.364/.464
Dickerson vs. RHP (2008 minors) – .300/.394/.521
Gomes vs. LHP (career majors) – .266/.369/.510
I really like this is a platoon.
(Though I hope there is some chance that Gomes will get a chance to play more if he turns out good. He’s the only new face with any significant offensive upside.)
Oops… “I really like this AS a platoon” is what I meant…
The problem with Gomes is that he doesn’t make up for his poor defense with his bat. His UZR/150 was positive (yes positive) only once in his career. He hasn’t had a positive value win since 2005.
He is a RH PH with some pop. He should be used that way. You have to keep him off the field. If you want to go with a RH/LH platoon in LF, it should be with Hairston (gulp) as the team is currently configured.
Personally, I have been screaming about a Stubbs/Dickerson platoon, but that hasn’t gotten me anywhere. I think Stubbs will surprise and make the jump this year.
UZR/150 is a rating of defense only, right? Not overall value?
In my view, if Gomes hits anywhere near his career line vs. LHP (.266/.369/.510) this year, I can tolerate some below-average defense in LF.
Defense in LF (in my view) is a lot less important than in CF.
Mark in CC….I appreciate the optimism, but I don’t put a whole lot of stock in this sort of comment. If I’m not mistaken, Dusty made a similar comment about Bako after he started last season on a relative hot streak. I’m too lazy to find the exact quote, but it was along the lines of “sometimes, at a certain point in a guys career, the light just goes on”. We all know how that worked out. That being said, I would take Dickerson’s potential over Taveras’ reality.
I’m now reading that Dunn is probably not getting more than about 5 million/year.
Now, a) I’m really glad we didn’t resign him for the numbers he wanted last summer; but b) shouldn’t we think about bringing him back for that amount?!?!? I understand that pride and ego are playing a big part here, and I understand he’s a flawed player but man, he’s worth 5 million/year! Even if the Reds have to pay 7.5 per year to overcome the pride/ego issues, I’d still sign him.
Dickerson vs. RHP (career minors) – .272/.364/.464
Dickerson vs. RHP (2008 minors) – .300/.394/.521
Gomes vs. LHP (career majors) – .266/.369/.510
====================================
For comparisons sake, here are Laynce Nix split numbers against RHs.
Nix vs. RHP (career minors) – .288/.350/.547
Nix vs. RHP (2008 minors) – .295/.358/.544
Nix vs. RHP (career majors) – .244/.279/.423
Most of Nix MLB ABs were from age 22-24, he’s 28 now, just a year and half older than Dickerson. If he’s healthy again, I think he’d be a decent bet to put up a .800 OPS vs RHs in a platoon. There is not much chance of this, but platoons of Dickerson/Taveras in CF and a Nix/Gomes in LF could be interesting.