What I Would Do Chad Dotson 12/12/2008 30 1. Sign Rafael Furcal. 2. Sign (a) Milton Bradley or (b) Adam Dunn. 3. Field a competitive team in 2009. Share this:TweetPocket 30 Responses preach 12/12/2008 1. Sign Furcal 2. Trade Bailey for Dye 3. Sign Baldelli/Kapler or Zobrist type to platoon 4. DFA Majeweski to make some room GregD 12/12/2008 SP Aaron Harang $11,000,000 SP Bronson Arroyo $9,500,000 SP Edison Volquez $400,000 SP Johnny Cueto $400,000 SP Micah Owings $400,000 C Ramon Hernandez $8,000,000 C Ryan Hanigan $400,000 1B Joey Votto $400,000 2b Brandon Phillips $4,750,000 3B Edwin Encarnacion $2,000,000 SS Rafael Furcal $13,000,000 IF Adam Rosales $400,000 IF Jeff Keppinger $450,000 LF Norris Hopper? $400,000 CF Chris Dickerson $400,000 RF Jay Bruce $400,000 OF FA outfielder? $400,000 OF FA outfielder? $400,000 CL Francisco Cordero $12,000,000 RP Bill Bray $400,000 RP Jarod Burton $400,000 RP Arthur Rhodes $2,000,000 RP David Weathers $3,500,000 RP Mike Lincoln $3,000,000 RP Roenicke/Masset $400,000 $74,800,000 GregD 12/12/2008 I’m sorry. That didn’t format very well, and somehow posted twice. Please correct/comment on my list. I’ve tried to put down a 2009 salary for each player, and where the team would end up in payroll if they signed Furcal to $13M per year. Some notes: – All pre-arb players I have at $400k – Some players could easily be subbed with other candidates; the point I’m trying to make is salary at position, not whether Bailey or Owings will be the #5 starter – Encarnacion and Weathers $$’s are just an estimate – I have Hernandez’s full regular season contract here. I’ve read different accounts of whether the O’s are sending $1M, $2M or $3M. Plus, you have to factor in the $1M 2010 buyout if they consider this deal a 1-yr trade According to Fay in an article earlier this week “Jocketty reiterated Tuesday that the Reds’ payroll will be higher than last season’s record of $74.9 million. He wouldn’t say how much higher.” I have $74.8M. The could add Furcal and an outfielder like Burrell if they push it to $90M, but I doubt they go that high. GregD 12/12/2008 I’ve already caught one error/issue. Gonzalez’s $5.375M is not in the list above. Cary 12/12/2008 “Agent Paul Kinzer leaves the winter meetings feeling confident that shortstop Rafael Furcal will match or even exceed the three-year, $39 million deal that he signed with the Los Angeles Dodgers in December 2005.” http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=3761672&name=winter_meetings_2008 Dunn is going to get at least $15M from someone. Bradley can probably be had for a reasonable price ($5M) and is a switch-hitter. His obvious unknown is the anger management. He is the only move I see the Reds having a legitimate shot at doing just because of money. I would try Bradley out of those options. The other mentions just are not realistic because of money. Travis G. 12/12/2008 1. Offer Furcal 4 yrs/$46 million 2. Sign Gabe Kapler to platoon with Dickerson in CF and 3. Sign Eric Hinske as a backup 3B/COF 4. See what the COF market looks like in January and sign the best available guy willing to take a 2-year deal Travis G. 12/12/2008 Bradley’s injury history does not make him a wise choice for the Reds, especially since they can’t coddle him at DH and he will no doubt get better offers than the one-year, $5.25 million deal he played under last season. I realize the Reds haven’t been officially linked to him, so we’re all just pissing in the wind, but signing Furcal is the one thing they could do to put this team closer to contention. We’ve got capable 3-5 hitters, but we don’t have a leadoff man (or a SS who can field his position). Y-City Jim 12/12/2008 Do the best to field a competitive team in 2009 without mortgaging the future. There are many prospects a year or so away. Some of those may be ready to cut their teeth at this level sometime during the season. Brian 12/12/2008 1. Sign Baldelli and Rivera to form a three way platoon with Dickerson OF – Bruce, Dickerson, Baldelli/Rivera, Hairston Jr and Keppinger (5th and 6th options) 2. I like the idea of Furcal but it would be to much money in aging SS in Gonzalez and Furcal. Now don’t get me wrong I think that Furcal is much better than Gonzalez but he was hurt nearly all of last year while Gonzalez was hurt all of last year. So in the end I would not sign Furcal 3. I like the idea of Milton Bradley but when it comes down to it he may want to much money for to many years, so I would do what I said in #1. Sultan of Swaff 12/12/2008 Furcal is high risk/high reward. I doubt we’re even in the conversation there, so it’s likely a moot point. We also need to remember that both Kepp and Gonzo, when healthy, are league average at least. I’m OK with that, but I do understand how it leaves us w/o a true leadoff hitter (Kepp excellent in the 2 hole), which then puts a lot of pressure on Dickerson. I still favor seeking an OF because you get more bang for your buck there. I also don’t see how you can keep EdE at 3B if you’re serious about defense. To me that’s the real question–how to reconcile EdE on this team. As an aside, it’s encouraging that BobC is increasing payroll despite flat attendance and a bad economy. That’s commitment. bweav44 12/12/2008 1. Sign Rafael Furcal. -I love this idea, but don’t see it happening. The money already owed to A-Gon (although the REDS do understand sunk costs as you mentioned) is a stumbling block. I haven’t heard them mentioned together in any rumors either unfortunately. 2. Sign (a) Milton Bradley or (b) Adam Dunn. -I don’t like this at all. I hated Dunn, mostly because he had no work ethic and was not interested in sacrificing for the team. If he did, he’d have taken the move to 1B seriously. He has not improved and is never going to be the lineup anchor he should have become. He hung around with ClubHouse Chemistry Killer Junior for too many years. Speaking of chemistry killers, there’s a reason Bradley doesn’t stick around any one place too long. With so many young guys who look like future team leaders, no thanks. Poison someone else’s clubhouse. 3. Field a competitive team in 2009. -I’m hopeful with the core of position guys, the staff, and a couple of adds they can. What I would do- 1. Trade for Adrian Beltre. 2. Sign Wille Taveras if Hairston won’t come back. 3. Hope A Gon is healthy. 4. Keppinger assumes the super-utility role. 5. Play the best defensive OF you can daily. David 12/12/2008 GregD – Herndandez’s salary isn’t 8 million, rather it is 5-6 million because the O’s are picking up between 2 and 3 million. Leadoff: I am fairly confident in Dickerson’s ability to hit leadoff. What worries me is that a lineup of Dickerson, Votto, ?, Bruce is too lefty dominant. The solution I’m afraid is pushing Phillips up into the No. 2 slot. I agree with most that Furcal should have been the number one priority of this offseason. However, it’s not because I believed Furcal should bat leadoff, rather I think Furcal should hit 2nd, thus giving us flexibility against lefties AND pushing Phillips down in the lineup. I loath the fact that Taveras will be nontendered and become a FA. You just know the “speed” will appeal to Baker. RH 1B: There are a number of FA possibilities in the OF which won’t cost you prospects. Juan Rivera is intriguing but was a fifth outfielder last season. Baldelli shouldn’t be in the conversation due to his chronic mitochondrial disorder. Milton Bradley is more a DH type because of his poor defense, and we know that he will undoubtedly have anger issues when this young team experiences growing pains. The trade market looks better in the OF as the Dodgers seem willing to trade Matt Kemp (rumored for Cano) and the Jays are shopping Alex Rios. But the problem arises – what to do with Votto when Alonso is ready? I say, the Reds should move Votto now, and look into a RH 1B with under team control for approximately 1-2 years, until Alonso pushes his way into the 1B position. Dare I say a Sean Casey reunion? There are a lot of interesting trade options: Pablo Sandoval, Garrett Atkins, Paul Konerko, or Victor Martinez. CF Platoon: I’m of the opinion that Stubbs should be platooned with Dickerson. Stubbs’ defense is plus-plus and he mauls LH pitching. He would be a good late inning sub and could be used to pinch run, due to his speed, on off days. Summary: 1) Sign Furcal. 2) Move Votto to LF and add one of (Atkins, Konerko, or Martinez). My preferance is Martinez because of his 5.75 million contract. 3) Platoon Dickerson and Stubbs Projected lineup: Dickerson (L) Furcal (S) Votto (L) Martinez (S) Bruce (L) Encarnacion (R) Phillips (R) Hernandez (R) (Pitcher) Projected with Stubbs Furcal Votto Martinez Bruce Encarnacion Phillips Hernandez Stubbs (Pitcher) nycredsfan 12/12/2008 There’s no way there is enough payroll left to sign both Furcal and Bradley/Dunn. If Rhodes signs, there is probably $8-12 mil left. Those guys will probably all get that apiece. Plus I wouldn’t sign Bradley for too much or too long, considering his injury history. I do like the Furcal idea, though. It solves the SS and right-handed bat problem. Jeff Gentil 12/12/2008 I’ll pass on the Terrell Owens of MLB (Bradley). Would love to see something done at SS, but I’m just not sure Furcal is worth the money he wants. I’d trade Bailey for Dye. Then in two years, let Votto move to left and give Alonso first base. Big money off the books and by then, the rotation is the best in the N.L anyway, so no need for Homer. non-tender Belisle and Majewski. And although I know he’s already gone, I’d non-tender Coffey just because. doug 12/12/2008 Sign Juan Rivera and Rocco Baldelli to 1 or 2 year deals. I then start Rivera in LF most of the time and use Baldelli to spell him once a week and also use Baldelli to spell Dickerson versus lefties. That leaves my sole option of SS. If the Reds feel comfortable in Gonzo’s knee, then I leave it alone as it is. bweav44 12/12/2008 Rocco Baldelli will be lucky to play 80 games. Rivera is worthwhile if none of the trade options pan out. Although he has some injury issues too. I can’t see them going more than 2 years on any free agent, other than a SS. I’ll probably get laughed (or cursed) off this board, but I would not be opposed to a minor league deal to Richie Sexson to back-up Votto and be a bat off the bench. mike 12/12/2008 I would do the following sign Teixeira and move Votto to the OF sign Dunn to a 1 or 2 year deal moving Bruce to CF you’d have a core offense that was VERY young with Dunn, Teixeira, Bruce, Votto and EE at that point I don’t care who plays SS Jose 12/12/2008 alot of these ideas are great but no logical for a small market team now bradley i would love to have his bat but he wouldn’t be able to play OF he is worse than whiffey about getting hurt. doug 12/12/2008 bweav, I am with you on Baldelli, which is why I platoon him in CF against only lefties and give him a start a week in LF/RF to give Bruce or Rivera a day off. That protects him pretty well I would think. bweav44 12/12/2008 I like Baldelli, but probably not at the cost. It sounded like it was an either/or with Rivera or Baldelli, not both. I also don’t know if Baldelli can handle CF anymore, or if you’d risk it. Everyone I’ve heard mentioned as targets are all for LF. Put me in the camp that does not think Dickerson is a regular player at the big league level. I think it’s only a matter of time before pitchers find the holes in his swing he’s demonstrated at every level above A-ball. Last year was a small sample size. His best value will be as a 4th outfielder and LH pinch hitter/pinch runner type IMO. I’d like to see Taveras in CF and leading off for this team. I don’t think he’s well thought of right now, so a short contract will get him. The OBP’s less than ideal, but if he gets on 1/3rd of the time with the constant threat to run and plays above average CF…he’s valuable. Especially if the terms are right, and the contract is no longer than two years. preach 12/12/2008 I don’t know about Taveras. I’ve never been impressed with his defense, and I think you already have him in Norris Hopper. With Dusty, he will be leading off every game and the OBP doesn’t lend itself to that role. He would be a good guy to have on the bench, but I wouldn’t want to count on him. the large number of pitchers leads me to believe that another trade or two is coming. Are there any other SS besides Furcal worth taking a flyer on? I guess wherever he lands there will be someone displaced. Did you see the Mets signed Putz to be a set up guy? Wow. Personally I think he is a better closer than Rodriguez, but it’s nice to have that one two punch. Hey, we have Weathers and CoCo. Y-City Jim 12/12/2008 I see the Reds are expected to non-tender Bellisle and Majewski. Y-City Jim 12/12/2008 Interesting comments from Jay Bruce http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/section?category=blog07&plckController=Blog&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&plckPostId=Blog:e57bcc87-152a-4f72-96fb-cc08b1f396efPost:a1f91197-ed62-416d-9baa-9d629cfa0352&sid=sitelife.cincinnati.com KY Chip 12/12/2008 I don’t understand the love for Milton Bradley. If you thought Griffey and Dunn were clubhouse cancers, Bradley would be clubhouse ebola virus. I can’t see Furcal wearing the Red. With no takers for A-Gon, the Reds couldn’t use two multi-million dollar shortstops. Signing Furcal while keeping A-Gon makes no sense. I’d like to see the Reds ship Homer to someone before his stock falls any further. As of now, I don’t think they’d get anyone’s prospects for him, so it’d be for a decent player starting the downside of their career (Dye) or it won’t happen at all. The Reds will need an OF, and a RHB with power — and I think they will end up with Pat Burrell. It’ll be funny to see Jocketty run off Dunn, then sign an older, right-handed version of Dunner the next off-season. ‘Course, this only happens if the Dye deal falls apart. Hairston will be back since he’s one of Baker’s Boys from Chicago. At least he’ll (likely) do better than He Who Shall Not Be Named. So, here’s my prediction for next season: 1. Hopper/Dickerson/Hairston – CF 2. Phillips – 2B 3. Bruce – RF 4. Burrell – LF 5/6. Votto – 1B 6/5. Encarnacion – 3B 7. Hernandez/Hanigan – C 8. Gonzalez – SS And I don’t think that team would contend past June. Chad 12/12/2008 I donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t understand the love for Milton Bradley. If you thought Griffey and Dunn were clubhouse cancers, Bradley would be clubhouse ebola virus. I don’t think Dunn was a clubhouse cancer, and I don’t think there’s any evidence that he was. All the evidence says he was very popular in the clubhouse. You are right, though…that lineup you posted above is UGLY. brublejr 12/13/2008 1. I don’t see Furcal even consider the Reds. Same with Bradley because he will have other offers from contenders. Dunn will not come back, not with everything that has gone on the past few years. 2. I don’t see the Dye deal happening because of money issues, giving up Homer and another mid-level prospect is way too much for an aging/injury plagued OF without geeting a lot of relief from the Sox. Especially when there are other options out there. 3. I would sign Rivera to a 2 year deal to play LF. Then I would sign Baldelli 1-2 yr to platoon with Dickerson in CF. Then bring Hairston back as the superutility. If Rivera’s price is too high then I would move on to Ty Wiggington and try to play him in LF or move EE to left. OF is the biggest need at this point since Hopper was non-tendered and we only have 2 OF on the team with a combined 1 year experience at the big league level. 1. Dickerson CF 2. EdE 3B 3. Votto 1B 4. Rivera LF 5. Bruce RF 6. Phillips 2B 7. Hannigan C 8. Gonzo SS Bench: Hernadez C Baldelli OF Hairston UT Keppinger UT Castillo UT 4. The rotation looks good, the bullpen is shaping up nicely and we have tons of depth. I would leave Homer in L’Ville all year and let him get his stuff/confidence back. He is only 22 yrs old for pete’s sake. I don’t want to give up on him like the Rangers gave up on Volquez. I don’t see a problem with not having a LH starter, and I see Owings winning the 5th spot 5. By not signing any big contracts ie.) Furcal, Burrell, Dunn, etc it will ultimately leave more room for extentions to Bruce, Volquez, and Votto not to mention the Hernadez, Gonzo deals coming off the books at the end of the year. 6. With the lineup above, I don’t think it can win the divsion but rather still be competive and not strap us to the point we have to trade away the best players because there is no room to sign them. Travis G. 12/13/2008 Ty Wiggington would be great; he’s basically Jeff Keppinger, but older, better and (likely) more expensive. He’ll almost certainly require a multiyear deal, and he’ll probably get one in this 3B market. But he plays decent defense at multiple positions, mashes lefties and holds his own against righties. (Kepp struggles against righties, and his insane .918 OPS vs. LH is propped up by an even more insane .343 BAbip. But on the other hand, he can almost play SS.) Good teams always have versatile guys like that. I could live with a Taveras signing, as long as Jocketty obtains a court order preventing Dusty from ever batting him higher than 7th. Also, this occurred to me the other morning while I was half-asleep: How insane would it be to take a flyer on Andruw Jones if the Dodgers agreed to pay almost every dime he’s owed? Really insane? Criminally insane? Just crazy enough to work? Dallas 12/13/2008 I donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t think Dunn was a clubhouse cancer, and I donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t think thereÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s any evidence that he was. All the evidence says he was very popular in the clubhouse. ——————————————————————————– Calling Dunn a “clubhouse cancer” is a little harsh. At the worst I’d say he set a bad example for the younger players. Acting aloof about the game and constant joking and pranking while your team sinks further and further into the toilet will get you labeled a bad example. Chad 12/14/2008 I’d say that playing every game every year while hurt much of the time was a wonderful example for the younger players. Y-City Jim 12/14/2008 There is nothing wrong with somebody joking around to try to keep people from getting too down. There is ample evidence that Dunn took the losing very hard. He just refused to be sullen about it. A lot of talk refers to Greg Vaughn’s brief tenure, and how he got in people’s face when he thought they weren’t giving it there all. While I think it is necessary for someone to get on a player’s case when they are not giving it their all, there is also a fine line that one has to be careful not to cross. The ends does not always justify the means.