Okay, time to discuss CoCo. No, not this Koko; this CoCo. How valuable is this guy? And can that value be discussed without looking at the contract he signed last off-season?

I’ll be honest, I’m surprised that Edwin Encarnacion’s “How Valuable” post didn’t top Brandon Phillips’ post for number of comments. Feel free to continue the discussion about those players, but I want to hear what you think about Cordero.

I was not critical of the Cordero signing, and I was pretty pleased with the guy after about half of this season. Now, I’m seriously wavering. If he had pitched like he was being paid, he had some real value to the team. As it turned out, that contract may be an albatross that we will regret for some time.

What do you think?

16 Responses

  1. Brian

    I think it was a good signing because I would much rather have him closing games than Weathers.

    Plus it was probably hard for him with so little save opportunities and I don’t think Baker did a good job at still getting him innings early in the year when they weren’t save situations. So I think he went unutilized a lot more than he should of which is why I think we saw his numbers and quality of innings slide in the second half.

    Overall I still like the signing and will wait till I see how he is utilized and how he does next year.

    I think responses will increase when we approach the Ryan Freel debate. Which I will start early by saying please trade him he is getting paid way to much for what he is.

  2. Dave E.

    He is crazy overpaid. He may be terrible by the time the contract has expired.

    But. . .

    The bullpen was great last year, and terrible the year before. A lot (lot!) of that had to do with:

    1) Getting rid of Stanton.
    2) Having FC be your closer and moving everyone back on your depth chart.

  3. Mark in CC

    I am amazed when I read that we should be willing to pay above the market value for a young outfielder who hasn’t spent a full season in the big leagues but when all that was heard in 2007 was improve the bullpen and we need a closer, we then question the move after the fact.

    So management got a closer who has an All Star track record and now there is discussion as to whether it was necessity or a luxury.

    They paid Cordero what they needed to pay him to get him. The bullpen is better, sometimes good so lets let it play out and be happy we have him. When we win, hopefully before his contract is up, we will need an All Star closer and we have one.

  4. Dan

    While I agree that Cordoro makes a ton relative to his time on the field, I would say that two facts make me inclined to live with that (at least for the next season):

    1. All closers make a lot of money
    2. Cordero played well when the Reds were in contention.

    My stance on the debate of a closer’s value in based in my belief that some players are consistently better than others in pressure situations. I think Cordero is one of those people.

  5. bart

    Getting players to wear a Reds jersey is a tough sell, i think thats why the Reds had to pay what they did. My question when they signed him was is he the all-star closer from Milwaukee or the bust from Texas? I’ll wait one more year before i say, but it’s a lot of money to secure a late lead when you have so many holes you never have a late lead. And agree Mike, bullpen was ok in spurts, but not great. Also not crazy about re-signing Weathers.

  6. John

    I was ambivilent about his signing but became less and less of a Coco fan as the year wore on. He was sometimes lights out but too often his one inning was an adventure. How many times did he walk batters, especially the first one he faced. He had a 4.94 ERA after the All-Star break and a 4.17 ERA at home. The MLB site has him with an ERA of 4.42 against right-handers. I want less than a 3.33 ERA for my closer.Pay isn’t a factor; performance is. I’m not that impressed. My question is that the Reds announced at the end of the year that he had been playing hurt all year. I wonder if that is really true; why didn’t it get mentioned until three days before the end of the season. If this is really true, can we expect better performance next year?

  7. Mike

    It filled a big need at the time although for too much money. But he’s not a ‘lights out’ closer.

  8. tim

    i have been waiting for someone to explain why the reds played better against better teams. did they play up and down to the other teams levels? was it a lack of concentration against the other teams they thought they should beat?

  9. Mark in CC

    The most popular measure of a closer is saves. Of the top 4 NL relievers in saves(Woods and Coco are tied at 34 three others ahead of them), only Brad Lidge had a remarkedly better year.

    Cordero had 6 blown saves, Valverde had 7, Woods and Wilson 6 and Lidge 0.

    ERAs Woods, Valverde and Coco all within .15 of each other, again Lidge on top. Considering the range of the defense behind them only Wilson in SF had it as bad as Coco with the Reds defense.

    All the other stats are pretty similar.

    I don’t think the Reds had another player stack up at their position as well as they did at closer. It also goes without saying if the team gets better the closer will too.

    Call it overvalued but if we had a player in the top four of their position at every position we would still be playing. Give me some more of those kind of overvalued players.

  10. Kevin

    I have mixed feelings. I wish he wasn’t getting paid so much…to me the fact that one player gets such a high percentage of the payroll at all doesn’t make very much sense. But, what a relief it was to have a good bullpen this year (pun intended). In 2007 it was actually flat out painful, and this year it wasn’t, so although it’s a bummer we’re paying someone that high of a percentage, if we had to do it all over again, I’d sign him, anyway. He’s on the roster for two more years, no reason to complain about having a good closer, I guess.

  11. Mark from CC

    It isn’t about K/BB and WHIP. It is about saves and blown saves. He is right at the top here. Its about the team winning not fantasy stats.

    As far as making as much as Harang it is again what is the market value.

  12. Mark in CC

    Mr. Redlegs it can’t be said better than that.

  13. Kevin

    You’ve won this time, Mr. Redlegs, but we’ll get you someday!!

  14. Nathan from Muncie

    I say try to get his salary off the books as well. There are plenty of young willing closer-type arms in the farm system that can be placed in his spot.

    See: Jared Burton, Josh Roenicke are two.

  15. earl

    I tend to think unless the Reds are willing to pay a big chunk of that salary to move him on, Coco is going to be around for a couple of more years. Who would be willing to deal for that contract and needs a closer? I don’t see a team.

    It could be worse, it could be like some of the lame deals the Yanks signed like Wright or Pavano where they get paid huge bucks and never play.

    I just hope Coco has a good season or at least gets off to a hot start so maybe some club with more cash than brains deals for him.

  16. bart

    Can we hurry and get to the evaluating of Dick Pole?