A sad story about the continuing decline of Pete Rose.

15 Responses

  1. Tom

    All that’s left now is the record book. When you lie to the public, respect is gone.

  2. ohiobobcat

    Pete’s an old man now. No one would ever hire him to manage a ballclub. Its probably not in many of our genetic codes to forgive a non P.C. “Baseball Sinner” like Pete,huh? Boggs and Kirby had their flaws, and they’re in the HOF. Strawberry, Gooden, Palmeiro, McGwire and Steve Howe can be voted in, if deemed by the writers or seniors committee.

    In the age of internet gambling it would be extremely easy to bet on baseball games. Pete has many flaws, but he has paid his debt to society and baseball.

    The Hall aint the Hall if 4256 aint in it. I think the powers that be are missing the perfect opportunity to enshrine with an explanation of misdoings on the plaque.

    At the least it would serve as a mini-precedent for Barry Bonds in 6 yrs.

  3. Glenn

    Ohio Bob, I used to think that way too, but Pete’s told so many lies. He’s disappointed so many fans, there’s no way I would ever stand up for him.
    When I was a kid I loved to watch him play, but he shot that kid out of the saddle a long time ago. The only thing I feel for Pete Rose right now is pity.

  4. Bill Hansing

    Rose has an addiction. Addictions — including gambling — are clearly acceptable medical afflictions for which insurance carriers routinely provide coverage (because addiction is seen as a disease, not merely a character flaw).

    I read all these sad tales of Pete’s life now — but seldom see anyone see Pete’s actions within the context of an active addict. His actions are indefensible — but that should only serve to underscore the depth of his disease. It should not be more fodder for picking the man’s life apart more than it already is.

    The fact that insurance companies (routinely not the quickest organizations to come around in dec isive ways on issues like these) recognize what Pete has as an illness only makes Bud Selig’s stance look archaic.

    Now Pete has and continues to act like an egotistical jerk; he comes off as stupid for the things he says and does — just like most “addicts” who try to defend their behaviors. Read the accounts of any addict while they are active addicts and the behaviors are inexplainable.

    How could a President of the United States have sexual relations with an intern in his office in the White House? How could a nationally televised preacher be soliciting prostitutes? Sexual addiction; gambling addiction; drug or alcohol addiction = all equal addiction. And with addiction comes years (even decades) of denial, lies, bizarre behavior, financial ruin, broken relationships, etc.

    Without sounding like I am defending Pete Rose — he needs help, not pity or uninformed judgement.

    Will he get the help he needs? Probably not. That is what we should be sad about.

    Pete Rose should be in the HOF — and to hold him out is one of many of Bud Selig’s stupid moves that will define his “legacy” as commissioner.

    Things that are deemed ultimately as detrimental to the integrity to the game of baseball are investigated and uncovered. I want to see Bud Selig’s entire “body of work” as commissioner held to the same investigative scrutiny as Barry Bonds or Pete Rose.

  5. Chad

    Bill H–

    You make a lot of sense here. A lot. With the rush to bury Rose in many places, we don’t hear this perspective often.

  6. ohiobobcat

    On a happier note, with George Mason defeating UConn I am one Villanova win against Florida away from winning the work bracket.

    Yup, that’s the very same Florida team that ousted my Bobcats from the big dance last season.

    Revenge, baby, revenge.

  7. Glenn

    I agree, Rose’s numbers are more than hall-worthy. However, its going to take a public outcry for Selig to reenistate him. I’m just not going to jump on that band wagon. If he gets into the HOF that’s fine with me. If he doesn’t, I’m not going to lose any sleep over it.
    A major stumbling block for Pete is the large percentage of current HOFamers who don’t want to be associated with him. Right now I couldn’t, with a straight face, argue with any of them that they’re point of view is wrong.
    If he is suffering from an addiction, (and I don’t know how anyone can definatively say that without Rose having been examined by some competent medical authority) than he should deal with it.
    In short, my boyhood hero has given me every reason to distrust him and no reason to place any further trust in him. Whatever happens, happens. Its up to Rose.

  8. Bill Hansing

    If he is suffering from an addiction, (and I don’t know how anyone can definatively say that without Rose having been examined by some competent medical authority) than he should deal with it.
    In short, my boyhood hero has given me every reason to distrust him and no reason to place any further trust in him. Whatever happens, happens. Its up to Rose.

    Comment by Glenn — 3/27/2006 @ 1:21 pm

    Glenn, what makes an addict an addict is that their addiction has become the number one thing in their life — even if they say otherwise.

    An alcoholic drinks because alcohol is the number one thing in their life. Even with the pain it causes them financially, relationship-wise, work-wise, etc. It remains number one.

    The same is true with Doc Gooden and cocaine. The same is true with John Daly and alcohol. The same is true with Pete and gambling.

    Despite the pain it has caused — he cannot give it up.

    Of course you should distrust him. He loves gambling more than he likes you as one of your boyhood idols. That is one of the most sure-fire ways one can define and then recognize the addiction.

    A normal, sane, well person wouldn’t gamble away their livelihood and their friendships…but an addicted person cannot keep from doing it.

  9. Glenn

    Bill,
    You may be right. He might be addicted to gambling. Believe me, I’ve been around enough alcoholics (family and friends)to recognize the pattern. He’s certainly is self destructive and he can’t be trusted. However, I’ve also seem many who manipulate others by claiming that they themselves can’t be blamed for their problems, its the alcohol or in this case the gambling that is responsible, not me. In Rose’s case he doesn’t have to even do that. Others make the claim for him. He’s the master manipulator.
    Bill, I don’t want to get in a you know what contest with you. Your life experience may be much different than mine. When it comes to addicted people, I’ve always been the one who has to come in and clean up their messes. Therefore, I have no patience for them.
    I guess I’m not likely to get a callback on that volunteer gig at the clinic.
    I’ll leave it at this. If Rose keeps showing up in casino’s even if he’s only signing autographs, there is no chance he’ll ever be reenstated. (And I probably just made your point for you) Talk to you later, Glenn

  10. Bill Hansing

    Bill, I don’t want to get in a you know what contest with you. Your life experience may be much different than mine. When it comes to addicted people, I’ve always been the one who has to come in and clean up their messes. Therefore, I have no patience for them.
    I guess I’m not likely to get a callback on that volunteer gig at the clinic.
    I’ll leave it at this. If Rose keeps showing up in casino’s even if he’s only signing autographs, there is no chance he’ll ever be reenstated. (And I probably just made your point for you) Talk to you later, Glenn

    Glenn — rather than make this a protracted push & pull contest, let me just say this. You mention that you have no patience for addicted people because you are the person always having to clean up after them.

    Let me ask you, if Pete had a brain tumor that caused him to uncontrollably say and do things that appeared out of character and even stupid (instead of a gambling addiction which causes him to do and say things that are out of character and stupid)would you still have no patience for him??? To me this is a fundmental issue that is oftentimes overlooked.

    Without defending Pete’s actions — if he has a recognized disease that causes him to do and say stupid things — should we just want to see him get the help he so desperately needs?

    I’m not lobbying for the defense of Pete Rose. I am not defending Pete’s actions. I am not condoning Pete’s behavior (previously or now).

    I am just trying to get some folks to see that the way pete continues to act is completely in character with the disease he has — the lies, the deceit, the lack of trustworthiness, the grandiose behavior, the denial and minimizing. It all goes with the territory.

    So see it for what it is and keep pushing for Pete to get the help he needs.

  11. Glenn

    Bill,
    In the immortal words of Arnold, “Its not a tumor”. I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree.
    😀

  12. Bill Hansing

    Bill,
    In the immortal words of Arnold, “Its not a tumor”. I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree.

    Comment by Glenn — 3/30/2006 @ 12:12 pm

    If you are quoting Arnold to support the position you have taken on this issue — then I feel better about the position I am taking on it.
    http://www.counselormagazine.com/ce/articles/75.asp

  13. Bill Hansing

    Bill,
    Stick to your guns.

    Comment by Glenn — 3/30/2006 @ 1:50 pm

    We often act like we know more than we actually do when it comes to addressing complex issues, which surely is the case regarding the determinants of Pete’s gambling addiction. For some, addictive illness takes an unrelenting devastating course with all the characteristics of a malignant disease; for others dependency on substances seems to be symptomatically related to a stressful or distressful phase of a person’s life and the reliance on drugs, sex, gambling or alcohol is transitory and a temporary aberration; and yet for others they simply chose to stop for reasons that are not always clear. 🙄